[PASSED] Repeal Conscientious Objectors Act

[Keronians]

Finally, anybody who puts forth legislation in this Assembly that would reduce the defensive capabilities of the Imperial Chiefdom represents a direct and serious threat to our national defense. We will take any such threats very seriously and will summon any appropriate force as necessary to restore the integrity of our borders, our trade routes, and especially our people.

Henrik Søgård
Imperial Chiefdom of Krioval

I proposed that resolution sir, and I assure you that you are welcome in Worvland or Otrenia anytime. However, don't expect a great many new subjects to tax, I suggest you see the above Gandhi quote if you want a preview.

*Grins as he addresses the Ambassador* You are obviously ver sure of public opinion. But consider this. If I were to (as we do with every colony and protectorate) treat your citizens as equals, not oppress them or treat them seperate from Keronians, grant them all the priveleges a Keronian would have, treat your land as part of the homeland that any soldier of ours would defend with every last inch of his soul, give you all the social benefits the remainder of the nation enjoys, allow your people to continue their daily lives and keep their culture and traditions, would this opposal really last? Would your people not eventually embrace our people? This is certainly my experience from other regions. There is some opposal at first, but it eventually dies out.

[Krioval]

I am attempting to do my best for the people of the world. I consider widening a person's rights as an extremely laudable goal. I have not done anything to your army, you may still have one, you just may not force anyone to be a part of it. Conscription is, in my opinion, a form of slavery. These people have not been convicted of any crime, how can they justly be forced to do something against their will?

People are made to pay taxes "against their will". People are made to follow laws "against their will". And in times of national defense, they are made to fight "against their will", unless, y'know, they actually registered as conscientious objectors ahead of time. If anything, involuntary combat is one of the most avoidable aspects of Kriovaller society that involves subordinating oneself to the collective will. It's not as if people aren't made aware that conscription is a possibility, albeit a remote one.

Henrik Søgård
Imperial Chiefdom of Krioval

[Keronians]

I am attempting to do my best for the people of the world. I consider widening a person's rights as an extremely laudable goal. I have not done anything to your army, you may still have one, you just may not force anyone to be a part of it. Conscription is, in my opinion, a form of slavery. These people have not been convicted of any crime, how can they justly be forced to do something against their will?

People are made to pay taxes "against their will". People are made to follow laws "against their will". And in times of national defense, they are made to fight "against their will", unless, y'know, they actually registered as conscientious objectors ahead of time. If anything, involuntary combat is one of the most avoidable aspects of Kriovaller society that involves subordinating oneself to the collective will. It's not as if people aren't made aware that conscription is a possibility, albeit a remote one.

Henrik Søgård
Imperial Chiefdom of Krioval

I am inclined to agree with my colleague.

[Worvland]

I proposed that resolution sir, and I assure you that you are welcome in Worvland or Otrenia anytime. However, don't expect a great many new subjects to tax, I suggest you see the above Gandhi quote if you want a preview.

*Grins as he addresses the Ambassador* You are obviously ver sure of public opinion. But consider this. If I were to (as we do with every colony and protectorate) treat your citizens as equals, not oppress them or treat them seperate from Keronians, grant them all the priveleges a Keronian would have, treat your land as part of the homeland that any soldier of ours would defend with every last inch of his soul, give you all the social benefits the remainder of the nation enjoys, allow your people to continue their daily lives and keep their culture and traditions, would this opposal really last? Would your people not eventually embrace our people? This is certainly my experience from other regions. There is some opposal at first, but it eventually dies out.

We would continue to fly the Worvland flag, we would continue to elect our Senate, we would continue to make and follow our own laws and ignore yours. If this caused you to punish our citizens then we would protest those punishments. Really I doubt there would be any way to actually force us to be a part of you country in any way but name. These maxims have been a part of our culture for generations uncountable, they are passed down from generation to generation, you know how strong cultural mores are.

[Doomiedoomiedoom]

*The Doomian ambassador fires his gun several times into the air*

Dear gods, you're like a bunch of razor hounds fighting over some meat. Chill out, people.
I may of said this before in a drunken state, but if you're really content on protecting the whiners, make sure there allowed to leave the military for personal beliefs, i.e. "I wouldn't fight an invading force even if my family was about to be killed in our own home", not for any other reason. The current resolution in place allows reasons like "That sounds like work. I hate work", which would be why it's so unpopular.

[Eireann Fae]

*The Doomian ambassador fires his gun several times into the air*

Dear gods, you're like a bunch of razor hounds fighting over some meat. Chill out, people.
I may of said this before in a drunken state, but if you're really content on protecting the whiners, make sure there allowed to leave the military for personal beliefs, i.e. "I wouldn't fight an invading force even if my family was about to be killed in our own home", not for any other reason. The current resolution in place allows reasons like "That sounds like work. I hate work", which would be why it's so unpopular.

"So it is not those opposed to war that you wish to force to fight, but those you deem too apathetic to get away with not fighting? How asinine."

[Doomiedoomiedoom]

*The Doomian ambassador fires his gun several times into the air*

Dear gods, you're like a bunch of razor hounds fighting over some meat. Chill out, people.
I may of said this before in a drunken state, but if you're really content on protecting the whiners, make sure there allowed to leave the military for personal beliefs, i.e. "I wouldn't fight an invading force even if my family was about to be killed in our own home", not for any other reason. The current resolution in place allows reasons like "That sounds like work. I hate work", which would be why it's so unpopular.

"So it is not those opposed to war that you wish to force to fight, but those you deem too apathetic to get away with not fighting? How asinine."

I understand that may seem silly to you, but uselessness is a crime warranting death in my country. That, and soldiers start their training as young children. If the apathetic do wish to quit the army, they cannot do anything else because they did not train for anything else, therefore rendering them useless.

[Eireann Fae]

I understand that may seem silly to you, but uselessness is a crime warranting death in my country. That, and soldiers start their training as young children. If the apathetic do wish to quit the army, they cannot do anything else because they did not train for anything else, therefore rendering them useless.

Rowan is shocked, full realization of Doomiedoomiedoom's policies finally striking her. Epiſkœ softly whispers something, and after several moments in reflection of her own, Alexandra translates. "Then we truly feel sorry for the citizens of your nation, and offer them sanctuary within the Community of Eireann Fae. We will also seek to end your government's abhorrent practice, to the best of our ability. In the meantime, we will defend whatever rights of every being we can, including the right to object to the senseless slaughter of other beings."

[Coxnord]

"So it is not those opposed to war that you wish to force to fight, but those you deem too apathetic to get away with not fighting? How asinine."

I understand that may seem silly to you, but uselessness is a crime warranting death in my country. That, and soldiers start their training as young children. If the apathetic do wish to quit the army, they cannot do anything else because they did not train for anything else, therefore rendering them useless.

The Holy Empire would like to direct Your Excellency's attention towards the fact that policies to this effect are in violation of several resolutions adopted by this assembly.

Effective immediately, The Holy Empire will be granting unconditional asylum to anyone that is being oppressed by Your Excellency's regime.

[Worvland]

It would be Worvland's pleasure to also grant asylum to the oppressed peoples of Doomiedoomiedoom, as well.

[Tanzoria]

The Tanzorian Ambassador shouts "Honoured Members of The World Assembly, I would like to put my full support behind this repeal, as conscientious Objectors act was quite frankly dangerous, putting countrys defense on the line. The Tanzorian Millitary was crippled, because all of a sudden, everyone in Tanzoria become "Conseientious Objectors". Imagine if a country with a crippled millitary were to be invaded, now that would be disastorous."

[Worvland]

The Ambassador from Worvland rose to speak,

"I am absolutely shocked at how many militarized nations are having an extreme amount of conscientious objectors in their militaries. If they were so unwilling to serve, I cannot imagine how poorly these nations militaries have been performing."

[Tanzoria]

The Ambassador from Worvland rose to speak,

"I am absolutely shocked at how many militarized nations are having an extreme amount of conscientious objectors in their militaries. If they were so unwilling to serve, I cannot imagine how poorly these nations militaries have been performing."

"Ambasasdor, many of these people were not conscentious objectors before the Conscientious objectors act was passes. They used that as a loophole to leave the millitary"

[Doomiedoomiedoom]

I understand that may seem silly to you, but uselessness is a crime warranting death in my country. That, and soldiers start their training as young children. If the apathetic do wish to quit the army, they cannot do anything else because they did not train for anything else, therefore rendering them useless.

Rowan is shocked, full realization of Doomiedoomiedoom's policies finally striking her. Epiſkœ softly whispers something, and after several moments in reflection of her own, Alexandra translates. "Then we truly feel sorry for the citizens of your nation, and offer them sanctuary within the Community of Eireann Fae. We will also seek to end your government's abhorrent practice, to the best of our ability. In the meantime, we will defend whatever rights of every being we can, including the right to object to the senseless slaughter of other beings."

*The Doomian ambassador looks his college blankly*
You don't know the half of it. Our magnificent and powerful leader is quite proud of his human right violations, you can talk to him later if your really interested.

Keep in mind Doomiedoomiedoom is a country of robot people. While not all serve the purpose of combat, even small maintenance class workers can kill someone if aggravated. In addition to that, xenophobia is quite rampant among the robot people, as other species are viewed as imperfect and impure. Magic or not, a pissed off heavy lifter class is not something you faeries want to deal with in the near future (yes, we feel minor forms of emotion). Lets ignore that emigration is illegal, and by housing any runaways you are subject to subpoena, as the runaways are still property of their production company unless you bought them yourself.

Our wonderful and majestic leader would be more than happy to explain this in more detail if you submit a visitation request form to me later.

[Himleria]

If you live in Himleria, you will fight for Himleria. The military is the most important part of our society. It is supported in every way possible. We shall require our citizens to fight when they are called upon. The WA is reaching into territories that should be left up to Nations and their leaders. Himleria formally resigns from the WA and out of spite, doubles the size of the Himlerian armed forces peace time military, with 80% of the new openings being filled by conscription with 62% of those being citizens who filed for conscientious objector status.

[Coxnord]

If you live in Himleria, you will fight for Himleria. The military is the most important part of our society. It is supported in every way possible. We shall require our citizens to fight when they are called upon. The WA is reaching into territories that should be left up to Nations and their leaders. Himleria formally resigns from the WA and out of spite, doubles the size of the Himlerian armed forces peace time military, with 80% of the new openings being filled by conscription with 62% of those being citizens who filed for conscientious objector status.

(emphasis added)

The Holy Empire would think that in the case that the Himlerian military be supported in every way possible, conscientious objectors would be statistically insignificant or none at all, meaning the resolution would not pose any problem to Himleria. In the event that any Himlerian Citizen would enter The Holy Empire and seek asylum on grounds of being a conscientious objector whose such status is not protected in Himleria, such a request shall be granted.

[Vinage]

My nation of Vinage supports this repel of an Act that should never have been passed. We are a new nation that broke free from our motherland with a divided population. Was the motherland, who is not a member of the Assembly, ever to attack us we could not use the basic principle of Conscription as those who supported the motherland would be free to leave our army - thus leaving us virtually defenceless. Only through tireless efforts and appeasement have we been able to keep back the Nationalist-backlash we face on our homefront.

Thank you for arranging this fast repel of a dangerous piece of legislation, its a shame some of these people did not vote 'No' in the first place.

Advocate-Speaker of Vinage

[Keronians]

If you live in Himleria, you will fight for Himleria. The military is the most important part of our society. It is supported in every way possible. We shall require our citizens to fight when they are called upon. The WA is reaching into territories that should be left up to Nations and their leaders. Himleria formally resigns from the WA and out of spite, doubles the size of the Himlerian armed forces peace time military, with 80% of the new openings being filled by conscription with 62% of those being citizens who filed for conscientious objector status.

(emphasis added)

The Holy Empire would think that in the case that the Himlerian military be supported in every way possible, conscientious objectors would be statistically insignificant or none at all, meaning the resolution would not pose any problem to Himleria. In the event that any Himlerian Citizen would enter The Holy Empire and seek asylum on grounds of being a conscientious objector whose such status is not protected in Himleria, such a request shall be granted.

Ahem. Corrupt dictatorship. Ahem. You're making too many enemies, Ambassador, I hope you know what you're doing, because from here, it looks like you're being cornered voluntarily, and it won't be the pacifists who'll help you out in the future, it'll be the "killers", if you know what I mean.

[Keronians]

*Grins as he addresses the Ambassador* You are obviously ver sure of public opinion. But consider this. If I were to (as we do with every colony and protectorate) treat your citizens as equals, not oppress them or treat them seperate from Keronians, grant them all the priveleges a Keronian would have, treat your land as part of the homeland that any soldier of ours would defend with every last inch of his soul, give you all the social benefits the remainder of the nation enjoys, allow your people to continue their daily lives and keep their culture and traditions, would this opposal really last? Would your people not eventually embrace our people? This is certainly my experience from other regions. There is some opposal at first, but it eventually dies out.

We would continue to fly the Worvland flag, we would continue to elect our Senate, we would continue to make and follow our own laws and ignore yours. If this caused you to punish our citizens then we would protest those punishments. Really I doubt there would be any way to actually force us to be a part of you country in any way but name. These maxims have been a part of our culture for generations uncountable, they are passed down from generation to generation, you know how strong cultural mores are.

Our views clearly differ. And I seriously doubt that that will be the case. Perhaps initially, but not for long. Especially if what we offer is better than what you are currently offering. A peaceful people, you say. How would you not embrace another people that are showing such kindness? That are rebuilding any damage that was done. That are treating you as equals even though you were technically "defeated"? That are defending you with every last ounch of their souls? That are embracing your culture, and offering you theirs? That are giving you full representation at a larger Parliament, standing alongside any Keronian representative? People do change, Ambassador. If you treat them well, if you be nice to them and if you make them feel valued and appreciated, they do change. They do accept you.

[Numdia]

I'd like to point out that there is a bit of hypocracy in this bill as well.

In the event of a draft with this bill in place, all pacifists would be able to say it's against their beliefs and dodge the draft.
But there army people that are not pacifists but are not infavor of such a war that will be called to fight as it is not really against their beliefs.

It makes no sense why a person should be forced into a draft simply because their views are not as extreame as others.

[Eireann Fae]

I'd like to point out that there is a bit of hypocracy in this bill as well.

In the event of a draft with this bill in place, all pacifists would be able to say it's against their beliefs and dodge the draft.
But there army people that are not pacifists but are not infavor of such a war that will be called to fight as it is not really against their beliefs.

It makes no sense why a person should be forced into a draft simply because their views are not as extreame as others.

"One of many reasons we support the Conscientious Objectors Act and oppose this repeal. Unfortunately, it seems that you and I are in the minority."

[Numdia]

We would continue to fly the Worvland flag, we would continue to elect our Senate, we would continue to make and follow our own laws and ignore yours. If this caused you to punish our citizens then we would protest those punishments. Really I doubt there would be any way to actually force us to be a part of you country in any way but name. These maxims have been a part of our culture for generations uncountable, they are passed down from generation to generation, you know how strong cultural mores are.

Our views clearly differ. And I seriously doubt that that will be the case. Perhaps initially, but not for long. Especially if what we offer is better than what you are currently offering. A peaceful people, you say. How would you not embrace another people that are showing such kindness? That are rebuilding any damage that was done. That are treating you as equals even though you were technically "defeated"? That are defending you with every last ounch of their souls? That are embracing your culture, and offering you theirs? That are giving you full representation at a larger Parliament, standing alongside any Keronian representative? People do change, Ambassador. If you treat them well, if you be nice to them and if you make them feel valued and appreciated, they do change. They do accept you.

It is theoreticly possible that if you allowed them to become intigrated with you, then they may indeed become part of your nation. The problem is that if you allow them to go about their daily bussiness right after the annexation then they would quickly rebel and become independent. And even if you did control them for a long, long time they could still rebel later on in different generations. Think Ireland and Great Brittian. And think the Ottoman Empire and Greece.

[Coxnord]

I'd like to point out that there is a bit of hypocracy in this bill as well.

In the event of a draft with this bill in place, all pacifists would be able to say it's against their beliefs and dodge the draft.
But there army people that are not pacifists but are not infavor of such a war that will be called to fight as it is not really against their beliefs.

It makes no sense why a person should be forced into a draft simply because their views are not as extreame as others.

Thank You. We had been thinking about the hypocracy of this proposal and are glad to discover that we are not alone in opposition of this madness.

[Keronians]

Our views clearly differ. And I seriously doubt that that will be the case. Perhaps initially, but not for long. Especially if what we offer is better than what you are currently offering. A peaceful people, you say. How would you not embrace another people that are showing such kindness? That are rebuilding any damage that was done. That are treating you as equals even though you were technically "defeated"? That are defending you with every last ounch of their souls? That are embracing your culture, and offering you theirs? That are giving you full representation at a larger Parliament, standing alongside any Keronian representative? People do change, Ambassador. If you treat them well, if you be nice to them and if you make them feel valued and appreciated, they do change. They do accept you.

It is theoreticly possible that if you allowed them to become intigrated with you, then they may indeed become part of your nation. The problem is that if you allow them to go about their daily bussiness right after the annexation then they would quickly rebel and become independent. And even if you did control them for a long, long time they could still rebel later on in different generations. Think Ireland and Great Brittian. And think the Ottoman Empire and Greece.

Indeed, there is a thin line that one must tread. It is easy to tread one path and ignore the other.

[Worvland]

The Prince of Worvland, recently arrived to speak to the WA himself, rises to make a speech.

"As it now seems all hope is lost that the Conscientious Objector Act will not be repealed, I would like to make a few statements of behalf of His Majesty King Francis I, and myself. Firstly, we would like to thank all the Ambassadors that had any involvement in the debate over that act's passage, and the passage of this repeal. Though some strong words were said, many in disagreement with our opinions, we realize and applaud these ambassadors for performing their duties with the zeal required of them. We realize that this bill was flawed, and we really were surprised ourselves that it passed. We were unaware that it is proper procedure to put a bill through the forums, believe me when I say that the lesson has been learned, and we will never submit a proposal without taking the proper course of action again. The CO Act accomplished, with flying colors, it's true mission, to bring to attention the need for reform in the area of compulsory military service. That being said we will now throw our full support behind the Military Freedom Act that is currently drafting, though we see it as too weak, it is a good compromise. And compromise is the goal of diplomacy. Finally we would like to personally thank Eireann Fae for their vehement support, and Coxnord for their levelheadedness and politeness. Thank you, good evening."