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[PASSED]Preparing for Disasters

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Cievan
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Founded: Jun 26, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Cievan » Fri Jul 02, 2010 2:04 am

II. Demands member states to regularly inspect structures such as dams and levees, which could cause disasters if the structure was to fail,
(a) Member states shall share the findings of these inspections with the WADB,
(b) The WADB shall provide all the help that a nation requests in this process such as training national investigators or performing the investigations for the nation,

-I think it would be appropriate to expand this clause to dams, levees, nuclear facilities, and any other structures or vehicles which hold materials which, if the structure were to malfunction, could precipitate a disaster in the immediate area.

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Topid
Minister
 
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Founded: Dec 29, 2008
Capitalizt

Postby Topid » Fri Jul 02, 2010 2:12 am

Cievan wrote:
II. Demands member states to regularly inspect structures such as dams and levees, which could cause disasters if the structure was to fail,
(a) Member states shall share the findings of these inspections with the WADB,
(b) The WADB shall provide all the help that a nation requests in this process such as training national investigators or performing the investigations for the nation,

-I think it would be appropriate to expand this clause to dams, levees, nuclear facilities, and any other structures or vehicles which hold materials which, if the structure were to malfunction, could precipitate a disaster in the immediate area.

Done. Also for everyones information, Cievan TGed me with more ideas for the resolution which include areas this resolution hadn't even touched before that are really useful. We're working on getting that part written in now, but I've listed him as a Co-Author because this new part of the proposal is all his idea. :clap:

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Manticore Reborn
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Founded: Apr 13, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Manticore Reborn » Fri Jul 02, 2010 3:49 am

Topid wrote:II. Demands member states to regularly inspect structures such as dams, levees, nuclear facilities, and any other structures or vehicles which hold materials which, if the structure were to malfunction, could precipitate a disaster in the immediate area,
(a) Member states shall share the findings of these inspections with the WADB,
(b) The WADB shall provide all the help that a nation requests in this process such as training national investigators or performing the investigations for the nation,


The Kingdom of Manticore Reborn is concerned about how this data will be protected once turned over to the WADB. For instance, if inspection shows several weak points in a nation’s infrastructure, this data could be used by a nation during an offensive military operation to cripple the defending nation. This would be information that the attacking nation would not normally be able to come by during the normal course of relations.

The humble representative from the Kingdom of Manticore Reborn yields the floor.
Respectfully,
Hamish Alexander, Eighteenth Earl of White Haven
Minister of Foreign Affairs to His Majesty King Roger VI
The Kingdom of Manticore Reborn

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Topid
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Founded: Dec 29, 2008
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Postby Topid » Fri Jul 02, 2010 4:14 am

Manticore Reborn wrote:
Topid wrote:II. Demands member states to regularly inspect structures such as dams, levees, nuclear facilities, and any other structures or vehicles which hold materials which, if the structure were to malfunction, could precipitate a disaster in the immediate area,
(a) Member states shall share the findings of these inspections with the WADB,
(b) The WADB shall provide all the help that a nation requests in this process such as training national investigators or performing the investigations for the nation,


The Kingdom of Manticore Reborn is concerned about how this data will be protected once turned over to the WADB. For instance, if inspection shows several weak points in a nation’s infrastructure, this data could be used by a nation during an offensive military operation to cripple the defending nation. This would be information that the attacking nation would not normally be able to come by during the normal course of relations.

The humble representative from the Kingdom of Manticore Reborn yields the floor.

A reasonable concern. I'll add a section about not sharing weaknesses found.

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Manticore Reborn
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Founded: Apr 13, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Manticore Reborn » Fri Jul 02, 2010 4:52 am

(c) The WADB is to keep all weaknesses in a nation's infrastructure strictly confidential to prevent this information from being used by a nations enemies,


My government thanks the noble ambassador from Topid for taking our concerns into account. However, we do not feel this clause gives enough protection. The Kingdom of Manticore Reborn offers the following:

(c) All data imparted to the WADB by member nations shall be considered the exclusive property of the member nation and will be kept in a secure location and considered confidential. No nation will be granted access to another nation's data without the expressed permission of the nation to which the data belongs. In addition, all data will be surrendered to the nation to which is belongs upon reasonable notice.
Respectfully,
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Minister of Foreign Affairs to His Majesty King Roger VI
The Kingdom of Manticore Reborn

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Topid
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Founded: Dec 29, 2008
Capitalizt

Postby Topid » Fri Jul 02, 2010 5:13 am

Manticore Reborn wrote:
(c) The WADB is to keep all weaknesses in a nation's infrastructure strictly confidential to prevent this information from being used by a nations enemies,


My government thanks the noble ambassador from Topid for taking our concerns into account. However, we do not feel this clause gives enough protection. The Kingdom of Manticore Reborn offers the following:

(c) All data imparted to the WADB by member nations shall be considered the exclusive property of the member nation and will be kept in a secure location and considered confidential. No nation will be granted access to another nation's data without the expressed permission of the nation to which the data belongs. In addition, all data will be surrendered to the nation to which is belongs upon reasonable notice.
Due to the fact that I know we're adding the part Cievan and I are working on I'll hold off for a bit on that. There is a character limit on these things, and we have 800ish characters left before we need to make cuts. I'll add as much of that as I can, although I think the italicized part is really just defining confidential...
Last edited by Topid on Fri Jul 02, 2010 5:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Manticore Reborn
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Ex-Nation

Postby Manticore Reborn » Fri Jul 02, 2010 5:22 am

Topid wrote:Due to the fact that I know we're adding the part Cievan and I are working on I'll hold off for a bit on that. There is a character limit on these things, and we have 800ish characters left before we need to make cuts. I'll add as much of that as I can, although I think the italicized part is really just defining confidential...


This representative understands and will await notification of the updated proposal once your consultations are complete.
Respectfully,
Hamish Alexander, Eighteenth Earl of White Haven
Minister of Foreign Affairs to His Majesty King Roger VI
The Kingdom of Manticore Reborn

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Aranoff
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Founded: Jun 29, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Aranoff » Fri Jul 02, 2010 6:23 am

Defining for the purposes of this resolution a ‘disaster’ as an event that causes massive loss of life or property damage, exempting any event intentionally caused by a warring party, or any acts of terrorism, or other political attacks,


The Allied States of Aranoff would like to point out that there is another disaster, which threatens the very fabric of every society, which is not listed. Financial Disasters impact nations on very large scales, and we believe that, in order to protect the national and global economy, that the World Assembly should require nations to also regularly check on the foundations of their financial systems to make certain there would not be a financial meltdown that could be avoided.

Aranoff holds its businesses and the spirit of entrepreneurship very high, and as such, protect our businesses from dangerous swings in the market by providing a fund to hedge against the possible failure. We also hold the ability to bolster and push funds into a corporation if and when a corporation, considered too large to fail, is suffering significant strife and faces a collapse that could shake the foundations of the economy and throw us into depression.

We understand that not every nation holds our economic values, but we understand that every nation values its economy, and would ask that some form of preparation for financial disasters be included in this legislation. Further, we do not believe any amount of regulation could protect a business, and any regulation should be mandated by individual nations. Aranoff proposes to simply include a clause that would also allow for the protection of corporations from failure, which would result in financial disasters.
Last edited by Aranoff on Fri Jul 02, 2010 6:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Bears Armed
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Founded: Jun 01, 2006
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Bears Armed » Fri Jul 02, 2010 6:35 am

Topid wrote:
GENERAL ASSEMBLY

Disaster Preparedness Act
A resolution to improve world security by boosting police and military budgets.

Category: International Security | Strength: Mild | Proposed by: Topid

The General Assembly,

Defining for the purposes of this resolution a ‘disaster’ as an event that causes massive loss of life or property damage, exempting any event intentionally caused by a warring party, or any acts of terrorism, or other political attacks,

Noting the vast amounts of wealth spent annually by member states, NGOs, and the World Assembly itself in providing humanitarian aid after disasters,

Recognizing that some of the loss of life and damage to property could be avoided if a nation had some warning a disaster was pending,

Seeking to prevent the loss of as many lives or the damage of as much property as possible when disasters occur,

Hereby:

I. Establishes the World Assembly Disaster Bureau (WADB) which shall be tasked with monitoring public hazards,
(a) Defines ‘public hazard’ as a condition, event, or situation that could become a disaster or makes a disaster possible or likely to occur,
(b) The WADB shall operate:
(1) Meteorological centers to monitor the weather,


"Ahem!"
Last edited by Bears Armed on Fri Jul 02, 2010 6:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
The Confrederated Clans (and other Confrederated Bodys) of the Free Bears of Bears Armed
(includes The Ursine NorthLands) Demonym = Bear[s]; adjective = ‘Urrsish’.
Population = just under 20 million. Economy = only Thriving. Average Life expectancy = c.60 years. If the nation is classified as 'Anarchy' there still is a [strictly limited] national government... and those aren't "biker gangs", they're traditional cross-Clan 'Warrior Societies', generally respected rather than feared.
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Topid
Minister
 
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Founded: Dec 29, 2008
Capitalizt

Postby Topid » Fri Jul 02, 2010 6:46 am

Bears Armed wrote:
Topid wrote:
GENERAL ASSEMBLY

Disaster Preparedness Act
A resolution to improve world security by boosting police and military budgets.

Category: International Security | Strength: Mild | Proposed by: Topid

The General Assembly,

Defining for the purposes of this resolution a ‘disaster’ as an event that causes massive loss of life or property damage, exempting any event intentionally caused by a warring party, or any acts of terrorism, or other political attacks,

Noting the vast amounts of wealth spent annually by member states, NGOs, and the World Assembly itself in providing humanitarian aid after disasters,

Recognizing that some of the loss of life and damage to property could be avoided if a nation had some warning a disaster was pending,

Seeking to prevent the loss of as many lives or the damage of as much property as possible when disasters occur,

Hereby:

I. Establishes the World Assembly Disaster Bureau (WADB) which shall be tasked with monitoring public hazards,
(a) Defines ‘public hazard’ as a condition, event, or situation that could become a disaster or makes a disaster possible or likely to occur,
(b) The WADB shall operate:
(1) Meteorological centers to monitor the weather,


"Ahem!"

Oops. Happened while I was away from NS, didn't even know.

Well that's an odd situation then. Clearly extremely important parts of being prepared for disasters were foolishly left out of that replacement resolution because of the switch in category... But enough was put it that I'm not sure submitting another is possible.

EDIT: In other words I don't understand your decision to focus solely on weather disasters and ignore all the other types of disasters.
Last edited by Topid on Fri Jul 02, 2010 6:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Bears Armed
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Bears Armed » Fri Jul 02, 2010 6:57 am

I already had a 'Weather' proposal available to work with (having originally passed it as a NSUN resolution), felt that the subject was enough for a full resolution in its own right rather than a single clause within a rather wider one such as yours, and so decided to get an updated version of my older idea in while I could: There's no real problem, though, because as the IMO is instructed to cooperate with any other WA agencies that have an interest in the matter (clause#7) your own proposed agency can simply get its meteorological data from them...
Last edited by Bears Armed on Fri Jul 02, 2010 6:59 am, edited 2 times in total.
The Confrederated Clans (and other Confrederated Bodys) of the Free Bears of Bears Armed
(includes The Ursine NorthLands) Demonym = Bear[s]; adjective = ‘Urrsish’.
Population = just under 20 million. Economy = only Thriving. Average Life expectancy = c.60 years. If the nation is classified as 'Anarchy' there still is a [strictly limited] national government... and those aren't "biker gangs", they're traditional cross-Clan 'Warrior Societies', generally respected rather than feared.
Author of some GA Resolutions, via Bears Armed Mission; subject of an SC resolution.
Factbook. We have more than 70 MAPS. Visitors' Guide.
The IDU's WA Drafting Room is open to help you.
Author of issues #429, 712, 729, 934, 1120, 1152, 1474, 1521.

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Bahgum
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Posts: 65
Founded: Dec 18, 2003
Ex-Nation

Postby Bahgum » Fri Jul 02, 2010 7:28 am

Bahgum woud like clarification on the classification of Mother in Law visits. Do they come under acts of terrorism or do we take into account the actual devastation caused and class it under disaster?

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Cievan
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 16
Founded: Jun 26, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Cievan » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:18 pm

Bears Armed wrote:I already had a 'Weather' proposal available to work with (having originally passed it as a NSUN resolution), felt that the subject was enough for a full resolution in its own right rather than a single clause within a rather wider one such as yours, and so decided to get an updated version of my older idea in while I could: There's no real problem, though, because as the IMO is instructed to cooperate with any other WA agencies that have an interest in the matter (clause#7) your own proposed agency can simply get its meteorological data from them...

That would have to be understood and implied, but not specifically stated in the bill, because we can't note other bills in the passing of this one.

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Topid
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Founded: Dec 29, 2008
Capitalizt

Postby Topid » Fri Jul 02, 2010 1:45 pm

Draft updated. VII sounds awkward.
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Kulaloe
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Posts: 570
Founded: Mar 18, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Kulaloe » Fri Jul 02, 2010 4:43 pm

The Grandnarfolio is a very paranoid man...

KAF assassins jump out of the shadows and put a knife to Ambassador Doogle's throat.

D'ya see what I mean? His Awesomeness will support this resolution. (Whispering to the airmen) Good job boys. Our use of these dramatic effects seem to be persuasive. Keep up the... (Notices the mic picked up what she said) Crap!
Last edited by Kulaloe on Fri Jul 02, 2010 4:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Bears Armed
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Founded: Jun 01, 2006
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Bears Armed » Sat Jul 03, 2010 1:23 am

Cievan wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:I already had a 'Weather' proposal available to work with (having originally passed it as a NSUN resolution), felt that the subject was enough for a full resolution in its own right rather than a single clause within a rather wider one such as yours, and so decided to get an updated version of my older idea in while I could: There's no real problem, though, because as the IMO is instructed to cooperate with any other WA agencies that have an interest in the matter (clause#7) your own proposed agency can simply get its meteorological data from them...

That would have to be understood and implied, but not specifically stated in the bill, because we can't note other bills in the passing of this one.

OOC: You can do so by instructing an existing agency (in this case the IMO) to perform some specific duty (in this case supplying your new agency with information) that was not explicitly amongst its roles beforehand: In that case, if the earlier resolution were to be repealed then the IMO would remain in existence but with only this new duty rather than its original ones.
(Yes, re-using agencies like this has already been ruled legal by the Mods...)
The Confrederated Clans (and other Confrederated Bodys) of the Free Bears of Bears Armed
(includes The Ursine NorthLands) Demonym = Bear[s]; adjective = ‘Urrsish’.
Population = just under 20 million. Economy = only Thriving. Average Life expectancy = c.60 years. If the nation is classified as 'Anarchy' there still is a [strictly limited] national government... and those aren't "biker gangs", they're traditional cross-Clan 'Warrior Societies', generally respected rather than feared.
Author of some GA Resolutions, via Bears Armed Mission; subject of an SC resolution.
Factbook. We have more than 70 MAPS. Visitors' Guide.
The IDU's WA Drafting Room is open to help you.
Author of issues #429, 712, 729, 934, 1120, 1152, 1474, 1521.

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Nullarni
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Founded: Sep 26, 2006
Ex-Nation

Postby Nullarni » Sat Jul 03, 2010 5:54 am

Bears Armed wrote:OOC: You can do so by instructing an existing agency (in this case the IMO) to perform some specific duty (in this case supplying your new agency with information) that was not explicitly amongst its roles beforehand: In that case, if the earlier resolution were to be repealed then the IMO would remain in existence but with only this new duty rather than its original ones.
(Yes, re-using agencies like this has already been ruled legal by the Mods...)


OOC: I feel this greatly under utilized. If I were the king of the WA, I would take the countless committees, restructure them, and eliminate the committees whose duties could logically be reallocated to other committees. I figure that you really would need only a small handful of them to cover all the things tasked to a committee.
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Bears Armed
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Founded: Jun 01, 2006
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Bears Armed » Sat Jul 03, 2010 5:58 am

Nullarni wrote:
Bears Armed wrote:OOC: You can do so by instructing an existing agency (in this case the IMO) to perform some specific duty (in this case supplying your new agency with information) that was not explicitly amongst its roles beforehand: In that case, if the earlier resolution were to be repealed then the IMO would remain in existence but with only this new duty rather than its original ones.
(Yes, re-using agencies like this has already been ruled legal by the Mods...)


OOC: I feel this greatly under utilized. If I were the king of the WA, I would take the countless committees, restructure them, and eliminate the committees whose duties could logically be reallocated to other committees. I figure that you really would need only a small handful of them to cover all the things tasked to a committee.

OOC: You'd need to repeal & replace a LOT of existing resolutions...
The Confrederated Clans (and other Confrederated Bodys) of the Free Bears of Bears Armed
(includes The Ursine NorthLands) Demonym = Bear[s]; adjective = ‘Urrsish’.
Population = just under 20 million. Economy = only Thriving. Average Life expectancy = c.60 years. If the nation is classified as 'Anarchy' there still is a [strictly limited] national government... and those aren't "biker gangs", they're traditional cross-Clan 'Warrior Societies', generally respected rather than feared.
Author of some GA Resolutions, via Bears Armed Mission; subject of an SC resolution.
Factbook. We have more than 70 MAPS. Visitors' Guide.
The IDU's WA Drafting Room is open to help you.
Author of issues #429, 712, 729, 934, 1120, 1152, 1474, 1521.

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Nullarni
Ambassador
 
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Founded: Sep 26, 2006
Ex-Nation

Postby Nullarni » Sat Jul 03, 2010 6:13 am

OOC: I know, thats why I would have to be "King of the WA" to be able to even consider it. I would say its a shame we can't ammend resolutions, but allowing ammendments would open up a Pandora's Box that I wouldn't want to go anywhere near.
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Charlotte Ryberg
The Muse of the Westcountry
 
Posts: 15007
Founded: Mar 14, 2007
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Charlotte Ryberg » Sat Jul 03, 2010 6:24 am

VII. Instructs the WADB to collaborate with all World Assembly organizations to achieve its goals,

As a committee in the WA I think the WADB is already allowed to collaborate with all World Assembly organizations by default. I'm not quite sure because I don't think the WA committees exist in isolation within the WA.

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Kramis
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 8
Founded: Jul 01, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Kramis » Sun Jul 04, 2010 2:02 am

This is rather important the lives of our citizens rely on the government for their safety and well-being. :clap:

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Topid
Minister
 
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Founded: Dec 29, 2008
Capitalizt

Postby Topid » Thu Jul 08, 2010 3:23 pm

Added VII. Submitting soon? Find problems now rather than later.
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Manticore Reborn
Ambassador
 
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Founded: Apr 13, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Manticore Reborn » Fri Jul 09, 2010 3:20 am

The Kingdom of Manticore Reborn unfortunately cannot support this proposal with the current form of clause II c).
c) The WADB is to keep all weaknesses in a nation's infrastructure strictly confidential to prevent this information from being used by a nations enemies,

We suggest and request that this clause be changed as follows
c) All data granted to the WADB by member nations shall be considered the exclusive property of the member nation and will be kept in a secure location and considered confidential. All data will be surrendered to the member nation to which is belongs upon reasonable notice.

The humble representative from the Kingdom of Manticore Reborn yields the floor.
Respectfully,
Hamish Alexander, Eighteenth Earl of White Haven
Minister of Foreign Affairs to His Majesty King Roger VI
The Kingdom of Manticore Reborn

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Topid
Minister
 
Posts: 2843
Founded: Dec 29, 2008
Capitalizt

Postby Topid » Fri Jul 09, 2010 3:30 am

Manticore Reborn wrote:c) All data granted to the WADB by member nations shall be considered the exclusive property of the member nation and will be kept in a secure location and considered confidential.
Still, to me, that just sounds like a restatement of what we have now, but longer and more awkward.
Manticore Reborn wrote:All data will be surrendered to the member nation to which is belongs upon reasonable notice.
I don't really see the point of this, either.

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Manticore Reborn
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Founded: Apr 13, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Manticore Reborn » Fri Jul 09, 2010 3:43 am

Topid wrote:
Manticore Reborn wrote:c) All data granted to the WADB by member nations shall be considered the exclusive property of the member nation and will be kept in a secure location and considered confidential.
Still, to me, that just sounds like a restatement of what we have now, but longer and more awkward.
Manticore Reborn wrote:All data will be surrendered to the member nation to which is belongs upon reasonable notice.
I don't really see the point of this, either.

Allow me to requote the clause as it now stands and then point out the issues my government has with it.
c) The WADB is to keep all weaknesses in a nation's infrastructure strictly confidential to prevent this information from being used by a nations enemies,

First, why are only the weaknesses of a nation's infrastructure to be kept confidential? Whom is responsible for determining what is a weakness?
Second, why is this clause stating the intent is only to keep this information from a nation's enemies? I know of several neutral, and friendly, nations who would not hesitate to forward information to companies within their nations who would then use that "insider" knowledge to submit bids. Other companies would not be privy to this information from their more honorable governments and would then be at a distinct disadvantage when negotiating. And in the world of international relations, my friend, or neutral, could easily be my enemy tomorrow.
My government understands sharing this knowledge with a specialized agency would be beneficial, if for no other reason then having another set of eyes available to spot areas of concern, but, under the current phrasing of this clause, there are simply too many questions for my government to be confident that this data would not be used for purposes detrimental to our people's best interests.
Nor do we find out suggested clause to be awkwardly phrased. In one simple sentence, it assigns ownership, how the data is to be kept and the status of that data. We concede that the final clause concerning surrenderering of the data could be struck.
Respectfully,
Hamish Alexander, Eighteenth Earl of White Haven
Minister of Foreign Affairs to His Majesty King Roger VI
The Kingdom of Manticore Reborn

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