[DEFEATED] Liberate EmbassyRegionia

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

I'm glad I got to raid your region.

[Orifna]

So, um, EmbassyRegionia has fallen, we can't do anything now

[RiderSyl]

3. Well, for the sake of the proper argumentation of the policy's justified enforcement, yep the definition that was explicitly packaged for my policy is considered to be more important than fascism's universal definition.

Considering your specific definition mandated that the embassy regions' founders/delegates have Nazi flags, and Nazi flags are banned on NS, you were operating with a policy that excluded every rule-following fascist region in the game by default.

[Outer Sparta]

1. Your first point has nothing to do with what I said.
2. I literally just explained that I agreed that their are problematic systems other than fascism.
3. So you basically admitted that you do not care about what fascism actually is because the definition you curtailed for your policy is more important

1. I am pretty certain that my first point had everything to do with what you said. Having said "Well in that case" at the beginning which indicates that your statement was read so I decided to slightly change my position to fit with the subject matter.

2. No you didn't. All you stated was that there were other "unsavory" nations but that's just about it with no mention of other "problematic systems or ideologies"

3. Well, for the sake of the proper argumentation of the policy's justified enforcement, yep the definition that was explicitly packaged for my policy is considered to be more important than fascism's universal definition.

How would you react if the natives do end up banning you from the region? Are you going to create alt accounts and try to seize back the power you lost after your first nation CTEd if the community does not want you back?

[New Astri]

snip

i don't think you're a very good person

So, um, EmbassyRegionia has fallen, we can't do anything now

the region is still there, it's the embassies that were destroyed

[Embassies4Breakfast]

Well, I wasn't really going to renounce my views anyways.

1. In that case, only the original Fascist Party is fash. Nazis are actually very different in how their "fascism" was operated and regulated compared to how Italy's system was operated and regulated.

2. Well, I don't support Hitler though at least

3. While there were certainly similarities, the two systems operated in different manner and used different motives to fuel their popularity and power seizure. So, Nazi can't necessarily be inherently fascist. That's my position


4. There are other problematic systems that aren't Fascist ya know

5. the definition of Fascism being universally accepted doesn't really make a difference because fascism has been redefined by my policy which is no longer enforced due to the raid

Also, how could you support ousting me in my very own region in favor of supporting another nation's definite leadership instead? Those embassies were constructed (pretty much) single-handedly over the span of nearly 11 months and are now all going to be closed in less than a day. That's not very easy to rebuild.

1. Your first point has nothing to do with what I said.
2. I literally just explained that I agreed that their are problematic systems other than fascism.
3. So you basically admitted that you do not care about what fascism actually is because the definition you curtailed for your policy is more important.

Good Question.

Possibly.

If we take it at face-value than I would probably have no choice but to accept the embassy so long as it doesn't fit all 6 of my criteria .



Interesting. I'm not helping my case? Well, it's not like you're really doing anything to help me either (endorsing a raid on EmbassyRegionia) but most of my hope has been diminished and you're right that I hardly care.

So, you would “possibly” accept an embassy with a Nazi. In other words, you are ok with Nazism and want everyone else to be ok with that. This is proven over and over by all your posts and the telegram in which you have been skirting around calling Nazis fascist in order to stay connected with Nazis, Neo-Nazis, and similar types of people.

You have made it possible for this liberation to not pass, and you have no one but yourself to blame. How this region will even continue after the occupation, regardless of whether or not the defenders win or a liberation is passed (or both), is unknown. You have proven yourself to be an unfit leader, but the region is your brainchild, which puts the region in a pickle. You have jeopardized not only your future (in NationStates) but your region’s future. Congratulations!

Well, I wasn't really going to renounce my views anyways.

1. In that case, only the original Fascist Party is fash. Nazis are actually very different in how their "fascism" was operated and regulated compared to how Italy's system was operated and regulated.

2. Well, I don't support Hitler though at least

3. While there were certainly similarities, the two systems operated in different manner and used different motives to fuel their popularity and power seizure. So, Nazi can't necessarily be inherently fascist. That's my position


4. There are other problematic systems that aren't Fascist ya know

5. the definition of Fascism being universally accepted doesn't really make a difference because fascism has been redefined by my policy which is no longer enforced due to the raid

Also, how could you support ousting me in my very own region in favor of supporting another nation's definite leadership instead? Those embassies were constructed (pretty much) single-handedly over the span of nearly 11 months and are now all going to be closed in less than a day. That's not very easy to rebuild.

1. Your first point has nothing to do with what I said.
2. I literally just explained that I agreed that their are problematic systems other than fascism.
3. So you basically admitted that you do not care about what fascism actually is because the definition you curtailed for your policy is more important.

Good Question.

Possibly.

If we take it at face-value than I would probably have no choice but to accept the embassy so long as it doesn't fit all 6 of my criteria .



Interesting. I'm not helping my case? Well, it's not like you're really doing anything to help me either (endorsing a raid on EmbassyRegionia) but most of my hope has been diminished and you're right that I hardly care.

So, you would “possibly” accept an embassy with a Nazi. In other words, you are ok with Nazism and want everyone else to be ok with that. This is proven over and over by all your posts and the telegram in which you have been skirting around calling Nazis fascist in order to stay connected with Nazis, Neo-Nazis, and similar types of people.

You have made it possible for this liberation to not pass, and you have no one but yourself to blame. How this region will even continue after the occupation, regardless of whether or not the defenders win or a liberation is passed (or both), is unknown. You have proven yourself to be an unfit leader, but the region is your brainchild, which puts the region in a pickle. You have jeopardized not only your future (in NationStates) but your region’s future. Congratulations!

Look, I'm mostly going to write some oversimplification responses at this point.

Don't expect this to be a long sentence.

"Possibly" does not = "definitely"

When was it ever stated that I was ok with Nazism or that I wanted to every other region to accept it as well. Last time I checked "every other region should like Nazis" wasn't included in my embassy policy.

I never called Nazis "fascist" they can't be called fash unless they meet the (general) criteria so as far as I am concerned, they can continuously construct embassies with us. Also, I am not trying to stay connected with Nazis or Neo-Nazis? I am just enforcing rules and saying that certain Nazi regions don't fall into certain categories and are therefore eligible to have their embassy requests accepted Rules are still Rules you know.

Also, I am very certain that the liberation will pass with about 7,440 for and only 2,223 directly opposing it. So, it's very likely that it'll pass it in 3 days from now if it continues to recieve mounds of support.

The region's future isn't jeopardized. My future in NationStates hasn't been jeopardized either due to some particular reasons. I was a very good leader. Rules like mine shouldn't be changed as I am EmbassyRegionia's former founder. Yes, the region is my brainchild which is why the region was looked after really well prior to my DEAT

Infact, considering that the extremely tiring work of constructing all those 1,170 embassies was my doing, I do not have myself to blame at all. I only have myself to congratulate.

Because these embassies were ultimately burned to the ground (despite the fact that hard work was put in to them) these embassies were certainly jeopardized by the raider vandals

Good Question.

Possibly.

If we take it at face-value than I would probably have no choice but to accept the embassy so long as it doesn't fit all 6 of my criteria .

'i would probably have no choice' bro you say that like someone is forcing you at gunpoint to accept embassies with nazis even tho you are literally 100% in control of whether or not you do that

Oh crap. You're absolutely right...That somewhat got a chuckle out of me. "You say that like someone is forcing me at gunpoint to construct embassies with Nazis even though it's 100% your choice"

Well, maybe the Nazi regions themselves are being forced at gunpoint to support Adolf Hitler... but (jokes aside)

The rest of my region will simply have to be more subordinated to my established rules and not criticize them.

So the choice to construct embassies with regions that don't fall into my (very narrow 6-point list) has unfortunately been made. Sorry but not sorry

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

When was it ever stated that I was ok with Nazism

here:

certain Nazi regions don't fall into certain categories and are therefore eligible to have their embassy requests accepted

---

I never called Nazis "fascist" they can't be called fash unless they meet the (general) criteria so as far as I am concerned, they can continuously construct embassies with us.

That take is so hot the sun is jealous.

---

Rules are still Rules you know.

And who made those rules?

I was a very good leader. Rules like mine shouldn't be changed as I am EmbassyRegionia's former founder.

You made those rules. Also, I'm not sure "good leaders" accept neo-nazi emabssies...or get DEAT on the founder nation.

---

Infact, considering that the extremely tiring work of constructing all those 1,170 embassies was my doing, I do not have myself to blame at all. I only have myself to congratulate.

Yeah -

I'm glad I got to raid your region.

[RiderSyl]

I'm not sure "good leaders" accept neo-nazi emabssies

But you see, he was just following orders. His... own... orders...

Rules are still Rules

This one telegram is the source of animosity towards my region by NS leftist.

You got started early on blaming Those Darn Leftists, huh?

[New Astri]

I never called Nazis "fascist" they can't be called fash unless they meet the (general) criteria so as far as I am concerned, they can continuously construct embassies with us.

oh, dude. there's not an "us" anymore. your opinions are awful and your region has rejected you.

Infact, considering that the extremely tiring work of constructing all those 1,170 embassies was my doing, I do not have myself to blame at all. I only have myself to congratulate.

Because these embassies were ultimately burned to the ground (despite the fact that hard work was put in to them) these embassies were certainly jeopardized by the raider vandals

ironically, you have entirely yourself to blame. if not for your policies slathering the region in an ungodly amount of embassies with fascists and setting a terrible precedent for embassy collectors everywhere, i wouldn't have gotten involved in that raid. and if i hadn't gotten involved in that raid, it's likely that the defenders would have succeeded during a certain update prior to the destruction of the embassies. all you had to do was make the very low bar of not doing what you did and your embassies would be safe right now.

this one is all on you. hope that stings a little.

[Otaku Stratus]

Don't you just love the casual way we express the way rights are universal except for those whose ideologies we don't like
Isn't that just splendid and not the least bit dystopic

[New Astri]

Don't you just love the casual way we express the way rights are universal except for those whose ideologies we don't like
Isn't that just splendid and not the least bit dystopic

yeah, it is pretty nice ! it makes me happy to see the ns community being so broadly unaccepting towards bigoted or violent ideologies. i'm glad you're hopping on to help point out that this founder's behavior isn't alright

[RiderSyl]

Don't you just love the casual way we express the way rights are universal except for those whose ideologies we don't like
Isn't that just splendid and not the least bit dystopic

"We must tolerate fascists and their sympathizers or else we're being dystopic" is an interest one. I'll just jot that down, next to "put forth by Otaku Stratus, delegate of Japan, only 7 endorsements".

[Cyberstrom]

Don't you just love the casual way we express the way rights are universal except for those whose ideologies we don't like
Isn't that just splendid and not the least bit dystopic

Please read about the Paradox of Tolerance.

[New Astri]

Don't you just love the casual way we express the way rights are universal except for those whose ideologies we don't like
Isn't that just splendid and not the least bit dystopic

"We must tolerate fascists and their sympathizers or else we're being dystopic" is an interest one. I'll just jot that down, next to "put forth by Otaku Stratus, delegate of Japan, only 7 endorsements". ;)

oh, huh, and no founder...saying shit that might qualify for a DND, as well. not to get off-topic or anything, but do me a favor, syl, and hit me up if you ever wanna chat more about that one.

[Embassies4Breakfast]

When was it ever stated that I was ok with Nazism

here:

certain Nazi regions don't fall into certain categories and are therefore eligible to have their embassy requests accepted

---

I never called Nazis "fascist" they can't be called fash unless they meet the (general) criteria so as far as I am concerned, they can continuously construct embassies with us.

That take is so hot the sun is jealous."

---

Rules are still Rules you know.

And who made those rules?

I was a very good leader. Rules like mine shouldn't be changed as I am EmbassyRegionia's former founder.

You made those rules. Also, I'm not sure "good leaders" accept neo-nazi emabssies...or get DEAT on the founder nation.

---

Infact, considering that the extremely tiring work of constructing all those 1,170 embassies was my doing, I do not have myself to blame at all. I only have myself to congratulate.

Yeah -

I'm glad I got to raid your region.

1. Well, accepting embassy requests isn't the same thing as straight up being ok with an Ideology.

2. "That take is so hot the sun is jealous" you could say that it's as hot as lightning!

3. "Who made those rules"/"you made those rules" of course I made those rules. It's not like those rules apply anymore to the region's way of doing things. My founder nation was DEATed anyways.

4. "I'm not sure that 'good leaders' accept embassies with neo-nazi regions or get DEAT on the founder nation". Well, why don't you blame the neo-nazi regions for that rather than me? They were the ones who sent/accepted the embassy requests. Also, sure my founder nation may have been DEATed but that doesn't mean I was not a good leader. Besides, I was a very hard working leader in my conquest to become the largest embassy region on NationStates.

5. "Yeah. I'm so glad I got to raid your region" well, I'm not. You helped to destroy an entire embassy collector region for the sake of vandalizing regions. The raiders destroyed an entire embassy network and destroyed all of my hardworking effort and that qualifies as embassy griefing.

I'm not sure "good leaders" accept neo-nazi emabssies

But you see, he was just following orders. His... own... orders...

Rules are still Rules

This one telegram is the source of animosity towards my region by NS leftist.

You got started early on blaming Those Darn Leftists, huh?

1. Well yeah I was following my own orders because it's my region... but there are some problems that I have with you definitely misinterpreting the telegram that was sent by me at this point.

2. "You got started on blaming those darn leftists, huh?" Now, don't be silly. I don't blame all leftists, just the ones that raided my region.

I never called Nazis "fascist" they can't be called fash unless they meet the (general) criteria so as far as I am concerned, they can continuously construct embassies with us.

oh, dude. there's not an "us" anymore. your opinions are awful and your region has rejected you.

Infact, considering that the extremely tiring work of constructing all those 1,170 embassies was my doing, I do not have myself to blame at all. I only have myself to congratulate.

Because these embassies were ultimately burned to the ground (despite the fact that hard work was put in to them) these embassies were certainly jeopardized by the raider vandals

ironically, you have entirely yourself to blame. if not for your policies slathering the region in an ungodly amount of embassies with fascists and setting a terrible precedent for embassy collectors everywhere, i wouldn't have gotten involved in that raid. and if i hadn't gotten involved in that raid, it's likely that the defenders would have succeeded during a certain update prior to the destruction of the embassies. all you had to do was make the very low bar of not doing what you did and your embassies would be safe right now.

this one is all on you. hope that stings a little.

1. "Oh, dude. There's not an "us" anymore. Your opinions are awful and your region has rejected you" I wouldn't be so sure about that. Sure, my opinions may have stirred up some controversy here and there, but my region's natives should at least acknowledge that I am the region's founder and it was me who took about 4 hours out of my day just to expand on my embassies. You think about how much dedication to one's own region that would take.

2. Well, my policies never said anything about engaging in open diplomaticy with fascist or nazi regions. All that it says (in the simplest way) is that most regions (including those that I exclude from my definition) are able to construct an embassy with me whereas a much smaller minority of regions that precisely fits all 6 of my definitions of "NS Fascists" cannot. Also, yes if multiple regions such as yourself hadn't gotten involved, our embassies could have been saved by defenders during any update.

However, saying that "all I had to do was not do what I did" doesn't cut it because you partook in the griefing of a region's embassies and tried to justify your actions by claiming that all I had to do was not have embassies with Fascist Regions?

Why does it even matter to you which embassies are kept and which embassies are rejected by me?

Also, I am pretty certain that the remaining natives of my region DO NOT agree with the destruction of my embassies by vandals from BOM, TBH, LWU, Lily, Osiris, Karma among others.

I am sorry to break it to you, but you literally just helped other raiders to take over a region that didn't even belong to them and committed regional vandalism.

I'm sorry, but it's more on you than on me.

[Grea Kriopia]

Happy weekend o/

After discussing future plans with ER's natives, there will be no need to continue passing this liberation proposal - tank away

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

Happy weekend o/

After discussing future plans with ER's natives, there will be no need to continue passing this liberation proposal - tank away

Exfounder: "blame the neo nazis for associating with me, not vice versa!"

Grea: "FROM THE TOP WIRE-"

[HumanSanity]

Exfounder: "blame the neo nazis for associating with me, not vice versa!"

Grea: "FROM THE TOP WIRE-"

The native we have been in discussions with has been Swaklaton, the current WA Delegate, who has demonstrated full intent to abandon fascist embassies now that they're in full control of the region. This has been our primary native point of contact since the first day of this Liberation resolution being in the queue.

[Ever-Wandering Souls]

Exfounder: "blame the neo nazis for associating with me, not vice versa!"

Grea: "FROM THE TOP WIRE-"

The native we have been in discussions with has been Swaklaton, the current WA Delegate, who has demonstrated full intent to abandon fascist embassies now that they're in full control of the region. This has been our primary native point of contact since the first day of this Liberation resolution being in the queue.

Sure, but see, the timing was hilarious.

[Embassies4Breakfast]

3. Well, for the sake of the proper argumentation of the policy's justified enforcement, yep the definition that was explicitly packaged for my policy is considered to be more important than fascism's universal definition.

Considering your specific definition mandated that the embassy regions' founders/delegates have Nazi flags, and Nazi flags are banned on NS, you were operating with a policy that excluded every rule-following fascist region in the game by default.

Nope. Sorry to break it you Syl but that is not true whatsoever

At no point had I ever made a rule that regions with Nazi flags are allowed.

Infact, I had actually stated the exact opposite!

"4. The region's founder or delegate possesses a Nazi-Themed flag"

I had specifically included the possession of Nazi Flags by the founder (or delegate) of another region as a criteria for being despised by me BUT one of them must also have an Italian Flag as well.

If both the founder and delegate of another region has Nazi Flags, they won't be considered Fascist by me. However, if the founder has an Italian Flag while the delegate has a Nazi Flag, they will be considered Fascist and will not have their embassy requests accepted. That's all I said.

I never condoned the usage of Nazi Flags!

Speaking of that... I never condoned hate either... as seen from this

"2. Has a track record of genuine hate against minorities" (which the Nazis sought to exterminate)

You see? Maybe you should read harder next time and take some more time to process it all.

Also, I pretty much said that I hate Racism and Aryanism at number 6 on my list.

[Cyberstrom]

Considering your specific definition mandated that the embassy regions' founders/delegates have Nazi flags, and Nazi flags are banned on NS, you were operating with a policy that excluded every rule-following fascist region in the game by default.

Nope. Sorry to break it you Syl but that is not true whatsoever

At no point had I ever made a rule that regions with Nazi flags are allowed.

Infact, I had actually stated the exact opposite!

"4. The region's founder or delegate possesses a Nazi-Themed flag"

I had specifically included the possession of Nazi Flags by the founder (or delegate) of another region as a criteria for being despised by me BUT one of them must also have an Italian Flag as well.

If both the founder and delegate of another region has Nazi Flags, they won't be considered Fascist by me. However, if the founder has an Italian Flag while the delegate has a Nazi Flag, they will be considered Fascist and will not have their embassy requests accepted. That's all I said.

I never condoned the usage of Nazi Flags!

Speaking of that... I never condoned hate either... as seen from this

"2. Has a track record of genuine hate against minorities" (which the Nazis sought to exterminate)

You see? Maybe you should read harder next time and take some more time to process it all.

Also, I pretty much said that I hate Racism and Aryanism at number 6 on my list.

So by your own logic, only Italian Nazis would fall under your 6 rules?
Look, I suggest just stop digging a grave for yourself here.

[Refuge Isle]

Still discovering how many steps there are in this staircase that E4B's mouth cannot help but fall down.

It is fortunate that the region now rests in the control of those who have better judgment.

[Outer Sparta]

Considering your specific definition mandated that the embassy regions' founders/delegates have Nazi flags, and Nazi flags are banned on NS, you were operating with a policy that excluded every rule-following fascist region in the game by default.

Nope. Sorry to break it you Syl but that is not true whatsoever

At no point had I ever made a rule that regions with Nazi flags are allowed.

Infact, I had actually stated the exact opposite!

"4. The region's founder or delegate possesses a Nazi-Themed flag"

I had specifically included the possession of Nazi Flags by the founder (or delegate) of another region as a criteria for being despised by me BUT one of them must also have an Italian Flag as well.

If both the founder and delegate of another region has Nazi Flags, they won't be considered Fascist by me. However, if the founder has an Italian Flag while the delegate has a Nazi Flag, they will be considered Fascist and will not have their embassy requests accepted. That's all I said.

I never condoned the usage of Nazi Flags!

Speaking of that... I never condoned hate either... as seen from this

"2. Has a track record of genuine hate against minorities" (which the Nazis sought to exterminate)

You see? Maybe you should read harder next time and take some more time to process it all.

Also, I pretty much said that I hate Racism and Aryanism at number 6 on my list.

If the delegate and natives don't want you back, then don't try and force yourself to come back. Simple as that.

[The Universe World]

In this story, Embassies4Breakfast is the real villain, not Venico. Sorry Venny .

[Outer Sparta]

In this story, Embassies4Breakfast is the real villain, not Venico. Sorry Venny .

That is quite a region liberation story then if the old founder is the villain to EmbassyRegionia more than the actual raiders. The raiders just did their thing and left while the founder still wants to be in control despite having their nation CTEd and having a questionable embassy setup they still abide by.