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by Balnik » Thu Dec 24, 2020 1:15 pm
by Bormiar » Thu Dec 24, 2020 7:36 pm
by Honeydewistania » Thu Dec 24, 2020 7:41 pm
Bormiar wrote:Pls don't argue about whether TWI is or isn't commendable. That has nothing to do with this resolution, and I'd like to not have this proposal associated with that debate.
Alger wrote:if you have egoquotes in your signature, touch grass
by Corindia » Thu Dec 24, 2020 8:11 pm
Wayneactia wrote:Wallenburg wrote:I'd prefer to see a replacement ready before supporting such a repeal.
Or we could, you know....... not? Since you seem to be such a huge fan, please elaborate exactly what TWI has done to make the community a better place? Vancouvia passed one whole resolution, which was very quickly repealed. They are a little isolationist region and nothing more. Their population has been dropping for quite some time now. In fact Vancouvia's endorsement count is a third of what it used to be. That it? That's really all it takes these days to get a commendation?Greater Cesnica wrote:Not true, I wanted TWI to get a commendation.
Bullshit. You were seeking attention. Nothing less, nothing more.
Of the People, For the People
by Bormiar » Thu Dec 24, 2020 8:13 pm
Corindia wrote:Honeydewistania wrote:
I agree, I think it's a little obtuse to act like that has nothing to do with it when things like the below quotes are being tossed around and are apparently on topic.Wayneactia wrote:Or we could, you know....... not? Since you seem to be such a huge fan, please elaborate exactly what TWI has done to make the community a better place? Vancouvia passed one whole resolution, which was very quickly repealed. They are a little isolationist region and nothing more. Their population has been dropping for quite some time now. In fact Vancouvia's endorsement count is a third of what it used to be. That it? That's really all it takes these days to get a commendation?
Bullshit. You were seeking attention. Nothing less, nothing more.Comfed wrote:TWI has influenced the site? How have they done so, besides yelling that GP is corrupted?
by Corindia » Thu Dec 24, 2020 8:19 pm
Of the People, For the People
by Bormiar » Thu Dec 24, 2020 8:23 pm
Corindia wrote:not following the rebuttal to them.
by Aizcona » Thu Dec 24, 2020 9:46 pm
Bormiar wrote:Corindia wrote:not following the rebuttal to them.
Well the rebuttal was what turned it into a debate .
Anyways, discussing the nature of the debate is even less on-topic than the debate itself. Basically, I just wanted to say that this proposal is not about whether TWI is or isn't worthy of commendation. That's just something I need hammered down.
by WayNeacTia » Fri Dec 25, 2020 2:32 am
Bormiar wrote:Pls don't argue about whether TWI is or isn't commendable. That has nothing to do with this resolution, and I'd like to not have this proposal associated with that debate.
RiderSyl wrote:You'd really think that defenders would communicate with each other about this. I know they're not a hivemind, but at least some level of PR skill would keep Quebecshire and Quebecshire from publically contradicting eac
wait
by Greater Cesnica » Fri Dec 25, 2020 5:11 am
Wayneactia wrote:Bullshit. You were seeking attention. Nothing less, nothing more.
Sic Semper Tyrannis.
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San Lumen wrote:You are ridiculous.George Orwell wrote:“That rifle on the wall of the labourer's cottage or working class flat is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there.”
by Big Bad Badger » Fri Dec 25, 2020 5:01 pm
by Astrobolt » Fri Dec 25, 2020 7:59 pm
by Aizcona » Fri Dec 25, 2020 10:24 pm
Big Bad Badger wrote:The original commendation is gratuitous at best. This region is far from commendable. I am for the repeal quickly and or any quality.
by Praeceps » Sat Dec 26, 2020 2:16 am
Bormiar wrote:Unimpressed by the drafting of SC#336 “Commend the Western Isles”, whose author attempted to rush the proposal to the floor of the Security Council, went radio silent whenever a nation provided constructive criticism, ignored or gave curt, unsubstantive responses to virtually every genuine question from voters, and failed to change the proposal very much even in an absurd twelve drafts,
Aizcona wrote:Comfed wrote:TWI has influenced the site? How have they done so, besides yelling that GP is corrupted?
It's funny that us messing around 3 years ago still gets to you.
Nonetheless as for how has TWI influenced the site? Well that's a bit hard to quantify isn't it in comparison to what you guys normally do? Most WA resolutions it seems have to deal with the interconnectivity of the WA and R/D gameplay, although the R/D stuff seems to be more in the past with changes to the site. Or maybe I'm just not noticing it so much anymore. Either way RP to me feels underrepresented in terms of what it means to NS. In my mind RP is the best part of NS and probably the best thing to come out of it, following in the footsteps of the writer who created this site. And when I say RP I mean neither this WA stuff nor the Portal to the Multiverse stuff.
You'd be surprised at how many TNPers and SCers dislike R/D and agree that it's the worse part of the site (excluding fascists ofc).Plus in my mind R/D is probably the worst part of this site and the fact that that stuff is what alot of the SC resolutions have been about is kind of telling what influence means to the majority of you, especially in TNP I would imagine.
This is all good information which should have been worked to being incorporated into the resolution and could be incorporated into a replacement (now, with support demonstrating that these resources are being used, etc.).Getting back to TWI's influence, we have produced some of the best RP and nationbuilding on this site. We've curated an expanse of knowledge on how to do it well from military, economic, cultural, environmental, and more perspectives. Our Art and our dispatch styles have been used by many people which the best way to see that is whenever one of our members would see their dispatch be posted on another Regions WFE as a reference. In addition to this we have done this from a solely isolationalist perspective, building from the ground up. Creating a very well functioning regional government that helps its regional members even in its third addition. We've been very high on members although recently we've stabilized to a more reasonable number than back when we had 800 nations.
At the end of the day we've had a rich history as a region. Our contributions to this site is all onsite, we haven't done our RP in other places like other regions and we have a clean RMB taking good use of the forums with our [TWI Only] tags that can often be seen.
For me I don't really care too much how TWI gets a commendation, I'm just happy that it has received it as I thoroughly believe it does deserve it. And I believe that its nice that the WA does recognize that RP regions contribute to the shared history of this site that is quite nice and interesting.
I don't much know how to quantify that for a SC thing though as honestly this mix of IC and OOC confuses me. Whatever you guys go with is what happens but the fact that a commendation did pass makes me happy.
Here's some factbooks at least to see what I'm talking about,
Tutorial Factbook: Nationbuilding
Tutorial Dispatch: Government and Politics Part 2
So You Want To Design Your Economy?
Guide to Nuclear Weapons and Refinement
Making Vehicle Art, The Corindi Way
Our Welcome dispatch
Our map which is the highest upvoted one on NS, Top 20 dispatch
Our third and current Constitution which has enabled an extremely stable region
These are just some overarching factbooks but you can find high quality factbooks among most of our members.
Along with that you can find multiple of our members, notably Corindia, Miklania, and Alteran Republics prowling around art and military threads.
by Bormiar » Sun Dec 27, 2020 7:02 pm
Wayneactia wrote:Bormiar wrote:Pls don't argue about whether TWI is or isn't commendable. That has nothing to do with this resolution, and I'd like to not have this proposal associated with that debate.
Can you clue us in, as to your line of reasoning here? I would think whether TWI is commendable or not would be at the very heart of a resolution seeking to REPEAL their commendation.
Praeceps wrote:I find it extremely confusing as to how it is irrelevant as to whether TWI is commendable or not given that this is a repeal without an associated replacement... I'm fine that there is no replacement as I'm currently unconvinced as to the Commendability of TWI and the repeal's text does not make the assertion that they are commendable or that there should be a replacement.
Praeceps wrote:I'm not particularly concerned in this case since the resolution seems fairly well-written even if I dislike the formatting, of course, in the event of further information being pointed out, I reserve the right to change my mind.
Praeceps wrote:Bormiar wrote:Unimpressed by the drafting of SC#336 “Commend the Western Isles”, whose author attempted to rush the proposal to the floor of the Security Council, went radio silent whenever a nation provided constructive criticism, ignored or gave curt, unsubstantive responses to virtually every genuine question from voters, and failed to change the proposal very much even in an absurd twelve drafts,
This seems a bit harsh to me. I do acknowledge and appreciate you toning it down as previously raised in the thread. However, I still think it's unduly severe.
by Greater Cesnica » Mon Dec 28, 2020 5:07 am
Sic Semper Tyrannis.
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San Lumen wrote:You are ridiculous.George Orwell wrote:“That rifle on the wall of the labourer's cottage or working class flat is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there.”
by WayNeacTia » Mon Dec 28, 2020 9:09 pm
Greater Cesnica wrote:I did consult Vancouvia beforehand.
RiderSyl wrote:You'd really think that defenders would communicate with each other about this. I know they're not a hivemind, but at least some level of PR skill would keep Quebecshire and Quebecshire from publically contradicting eac
wait
by WayNeacTia » Tue Dec 29, 2020 1:43 am
RiderSyl wrote:You'd really think that defenders would communicate with each other about this. I know they're not a hivemind, but at least some level of PR skill would keep Quebecshire and Quebecshire from publically contradicting eac
wait
by Greater Cesnica » Tue Dec 29, 2020 5:15 am
Sic Semper Tyrannis.
WA Discord Server
Authorship Dispatch
WA Ambassador: Slick McCooley
Firearm Rights are Human Rights
privacytools.io - Use these tools to safeguard your online activities, freedoms, and safety
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San Lumen wrote:You are ridiculous.George Orwell wrote:“That rifle on the wall of the labourer's cottage or working class flat is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there.”
by Praeceps » Tue Dec 29, 2020 3:58 pm
Bormiar wrote:Wayneactia wrote:Can you clue us in, as to your line of reasoning here? I would think whether TWI is commendable or not would be at the very heart of a resolution seeking to REPEAL their commendation.Praeceps wrote:I find it extremely confusing as to how it is irrelevant as to whether TWI is commendable or not given that this is a repeal without an associated replacement... I'm fine that there is no replacement as I'm currently unconvinced as to the Commendability of TWI and the repeal's text does not make the assertion that they are commendable or that there should be a replacement.
If you don't believe TWI is commendable, you'd vote for this repeal. If you do believe TWI is commendable, that doesn't mean you won't vote for this, because this repeal addresses the quality of the commendation, rather than the commendability of the nominee.
This isn't a difficult distinction to grasp and therefore doesn't take much debate, so we may have to agree to disagree. Just note that we've thus far avoided most useless, condescending bickering on whether TWI is or isn't commendable, and I'd like to keep things that way.
As someone who repeatedly offered feedback to the author, I got the impression that they genuinely didn't understand the criticisms. I prefer to give them the benefit of the doubt.Praeceps wrote:This seems a bit harsh to me. I do acknowledge and appreciate you toning it down as previously raised in the thread. However, I still think it's unduly severe.
Well, it is a punch, and I can't risk the resolution not fully encapsulating the drafting issues, but I'll see what I can do.
by Nova Vandalia » Tue Dec 29, 2020 11:23 pm
Bormiar wrote: If you don't believe TWI is commendable, you'd vote for this repeal. If you do believe TWI is commendable, that doesn't mean you won't vote for this, because this repeal addresses the quality of the commendation, rather than the commendability of the nominee.
by Comfed » Wed Dec 30, 2020 7:31 am
Nova Vandalia wrote:—snipped out part—
As an aside though I do take issue with the second part of your argument though, Bormiar. I hate the "quality of the commendation" argument. The SC is one of the only organizations, irl or online, I know of that takes away awards from regions and nations because the awards themselves aren't "pretty" enough. What kind of bizarre culture have we developed here? I think the first commend repeal base on the merit of the writing and not the receiver was a major mistake, one that we need to frankly change course on now.
I think our writers should be riskier and more flavorful/personal as we had talk about previously, but like seriously separating the fact that a nation or region is getting punished for the mistakes of the writer, is weird right? I mean surely we all know OOC that Commends mean more that just the bull hockey literal resolutions, why can't we all just agree to silently acknowledge that? I feel like we used to, but maybe I've over idealized the SC's past.
by Nova Vandalia » Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:14 am
Comfed wrote:The SC is about writing quality resolutions. Generally when the bad ones get repealed they are replaced with something better. If I write a commend for, say, Amerion and it doesn’t talk about his achievements in defending, Lazarus or TSP then what kind of an award is it? The SC has always been about good writing and to suggest we get rid of that is ridiculous.
Comfed wrote:For one thing, OOC stuff says OOC, and does not belong in the Security Council. I disagree, it didn't used to.
Comfed wrote:Have one’s C/C repealed and then replaced isn’t a punishment, it is merely making one’s C/C better.
Comfed wrote:What do you mean by more flavourful/personal anyways?
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