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by Shaktirajya » Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:32 pm
by Wallenburg » Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:34 pm
Heavens Host wrote:Heaven officially declared war on the world assembly. The reason for this declaration is as follows: Mandating the normalization and acceptance of degenerate transsexuals, Seeking to put men in women’s prisons, and worst of all defiling the image of God with unnatural hormones.
All who stand for decency unite against this anti moral menace!
Hail Christ!!!
by Itchalia » Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:38 pm
by Fushiya » Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:44 pm
by San Felix » Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:10 pm
by Kenmoria » Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:13 pm
Fushiya wrote:I see a lot about children getting involved.
Unless I've missed something, we are still free to regulate the age limit of those subject to hormone therapy, no? As well as the financial cost of the therapy...in what we deem "affordable"
San Felix wrote:"Our only issue with the resolution is the lack of clarity on the "consenting individuals" part. Are nations allowed to decide what counts as "consenting individuals" or there will be set rules for this matter?"
by Paleoconservative Citizens » Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:20 pm
by Fushiya » Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:38 pm
Kenmoria wrote:Fushiya wrote:I see a lot about children getting involved.
Unless I've missed something, we are still free to regulate the age limit of those subject to hormone therapy, no? As well as the financial cost of the therapy...in what we deem "affordable"
(OOC: You may only limit access to children if the children cannot properly consent. For instance, a twelve year old does not have the capability to think and evaluate options in the same extent a forty year old can, so there must be limitations. Provided you maintain a good-faith approach, and don’t make the age something such as eighty, an age limit would be compliant. Also, long as it remains affordable, yes you can regulate the financial cost.)
by Araraukar » Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:47 pm
Kyrgwalaey wrote:"Perfect, so we can finally fix the problem by extreme rehabilitation programs."
What makes a man different than a woman? Anatomy, and psychology.
What defines a gender is subjective in all cultures using it.
a small minority
Itchalia wrote:I am interested in the vast amount of people stating that this not being a mental condition.
I also opposed this due to the fact that i am uncomfortable giving children hormone therapy as i feel this causes health risks during puberty and growth. Imo, it should not be done until at least the age of 19.
Fushiya wrote:I see a lot about children getting involved.
Unless I've missed something, we are still free to regulate the age limit of those subject to hormone therapy, no? As well as the financial cost of the therapy...in what we deem "affordable"
Aquind wrote:What exactly does the resolution mean by "affordable"? Will unregulated hormone therapy be allowed with no interference by the state?
Paleoconservative Citizens wrote:Paleoconservative Citizens is a conservative nation built upon the principle teachings of Christianity, and the people of USPC will not stand for anything that goes against the founding principles of this nation.
Apologies for absences, non-COVID health issues leave me with very little energy at times.Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
by San Felix » Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:48 pm
Itchalia wrote:I am interested in the vast amount of people stating that this not being a mental condition. It was to the whole wide world a known fact that trans people feel uncomfortable with their gender due to a mental condition. It was only when the LGBT community started becoming more and more opponent to this fact when this notion was disregarded and it is also widely known that the scientific community is extremely biased and misleading more than ever since the 1600s. I have family and friends that are transgender so do not mistake me for dislike or discomfort but i do, and so do the people that call themselves transgender that ive spoken to, believe that this is a mental condition. I also opposed this due to the fact that i am uncomfortable giving children hormone therapy as i feel this causes health risks during puberty and growth. Imo, it should not be done until at least the age of 19.
by Paleoconservative Citizens » Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:55 pm
Araraukar wrote:Kyrgwalaey wrote:"Perfect, so we can finally fix the problem by extreme rehabilitation programs."
IC: "Which are called "conversion therapy", are torture, do not work, and also literally forbidden by the World Assembly legislation."What makes a man different than a woman? Anatomy, and psychology.
OOC: So a transgender individual already fits half of your definitions (psychology).What defines a gender is subjective in all cultures using it.
IC: "Do you identify as male or female? Or something else entirely? If you have a gender identity, why do you think other people would not? What makes you experience more valid than that of others?"a small minority
OOC: Not as small as you think, but as you can see, the proposal is of Mild strength.Itchalia wrote:I am interested in the vast amount of people stating that this not being a mental condition.
OOC: Mental condition =/= mental illness. Shyness is a mental condition, as are all emotions.I also opposed this due to the fact that i am uncomfortable giving children hormone therapy as i feel this causes health risks during puberty and growth. Imo, it should not be done until at least the age of 19.
You've missed the point about consent. A child under the age of majority cannot consent, legally. (Possibly unless their parents consent on their behalf - which is actually mandated by an existing resolution and cannot be contradicted by this one.)Fushiya wrote:I see a lot about children getting involved.
Unless I've missed something, we are still free to regulate the age limit of those subject to hormone therapy, no? As well as the financial cost of the therapy...in what we deem "affordable"
OOC: You're free to regulate the age of majority. Also, it's not like "affordable" is difficult to understand, so you can't screw up the price to whatever.Aquind wrote:What exactly does the resolution mean by "affordable"? Will unregulated hormone therapy be allowed with no interference by the state?
OOC: It's not unregulated. You're just not allowed to forbid it from someone for the purpose stated in the proposal. And affordable is not really a difficult word to understand. If you have trouble with it, I suggest looking it up in a dictionary.Paleoconservative Citizens wrote:Paleoconservative Citizens is a conservative nation built upon the principle teachings of Christianity, and the people of USPC will not stand for anything that goes against the founding principles of this nation.
OOC: Point out to me where in the Bible it says anything about transgender people. But if you're leaving the WA over this, then byebyes, don't walk into the door on your way out.
by Araraukar » Sat Jul 13, 2019 4:03 pm
Paleoconservative Citizens wrote:So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.
Genesis 1:27 ESV
"A woman shall not wear a man's garment, nor shall a man put on a woman's cloak, for whoever does these things is an abomination to the Lord your God.
Deuteronomy 22:5 ESV
Apologies for absences, non-COVID health issues leave me with very little energy at times.Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
by Marxist Germany » Sat Jul 13, 2019 4:09 pm
Paleoconservative Citizens wrote:After much thought, and speaking with my advisors, the nation of Paleoconservative Citizens has decided that it no longer wants to be World Assembly member. Paleoconservative Citizens is a conservative nation built upon the principle teachings of Christianity, and the people of USPC will not stand for anything that goes against the founding principles of this nation.
by Marxist Germany » Sat Jul 13, 2019 4:28 pm
by Paleoconservative Citizens » Sat Jul 13, 2019 4:32 pm
Marxist Germany wrote:Paleoconservative Citizens wrote:After much thought, and speaking with my advisors, the nation of Paleoconservative Citizens has decided that it no longer wants to be World Assembly member. Paleoconservative Citizens is a conservative nation built upon the principle teachings of Christianity, and the people of USPC will not stand for anything that goes against the founding principles of this nation.
"You won't be missed, ambassador."
by San Felix » Sat Jul 13, 2019 4:37 pm
Paleoconservative Citizens wrote:So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.
Genesis 1:27 ESV
"A woman shall not wear a man's garment, nor shall a man put on a woman's cloak, for whoever does these things is an abomination to the Lord your God.
Deuteronomy 22:5 ESV
by Paleoconservative Citizens » Sat Jul 13, 2019 4:45 pm
San Felix wrote:Paleoconservative Citizens wrote:So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.
Genesis 1:27 ESV
"A woman shall not wear a man's garment, nor shall a man put on a woman's cloak, for whoever does these things is an abomination to the Lord your God.
Deuteronomy 22:5 ESV
"Wasn't the Old Testament abolished by Jesus Christ, ambassador?
Romans 10:4 - 'Christ is the culmination of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes.'
Galatians 5:18 - 'But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.'
Galatians 3:11 - 'Clearly no one who relies on the law is justified before God, because “the righteous will live by faith.”'
So, which one is it? Do you follow the Old Testament or the teachings of Christ? Because clearly, the Bible says you can't follow both."
by West Heisen » Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:00 pm
Kenmoria wrote:West Heisen wrote:OOC: Sex and Gender are and have always been synonymous, and I have not yet seen a compelling argument as to why they are suddenly different now. Also, aren't 'gender roles' against the very nature of progressivism? Men and women can do whatever they want; their gender is irrelevant, yes? Men and women do different things naturally, it's part of the biological differences, but we shouldn't act as though liking 'girly' things makes you a girl, for example. Also, people who claim they are non binary do exist, but non binary people don't exist. One could say there is a spectrum from male personality/behaviour to female, but not perfectly fitting into the stereotypical man/woman category doesn't mean you are something else entirely. People often bring up intersex, but that is 1. simply a genetic abnormality, just as someone might be born with 6 fingers, and 2. the said person almost always has very defining characteristics of one gender, they are not directly in between.
Furthermore, if I told you I was a dragon, you obviously wouldn't believe it. If I told you I was a woman, you probably would believe it. It doesn't really matter. Personally, I choose to judge people based on the content of their character, not whatever they 'identify' as. So there's really no need to tell people what you 'identify' as, since it has no tangible effect on anything.
(OOC: Sex and gender have not always been synonymous, and transgender people have a long history throughout civilisation. Besides, even if they are, you admit that men and women should be able to do what they want. Why shouldn’t they be allowed to take hormone therapy to feel comfortable?)
by San Felix » Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:01 pm
Paleoconservative Citizens wrote:San Felix wrote:
"Wasn't the Old Testament abolished by Jesus Christ, ambassador?
Romans 10:4 - 'Christ is the culmination of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes.'
Galatians 5:18 - 'But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.'
Galatians 3:11 - 'Clearly no one who relies on the law is justified before God, because “the righteous will live by faith.”'
So, which one is it? Do you follow the Old Testament or the teachings of Christ? Because clearly, the Bible says you can't follow both."
That is false. As Jesus said,
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.
Matthew 5:17 ESV
Paul is saying that we are not under the law as means of salvation.
by West Heisen » Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:02 pm
Attempted Socialism wrote:Precisely, you don't know enough to participate meaningfully in this debate. I don't know who you are, but your words alone show that your opinions are based on misinformation, rather than any basis in facts.West Heisen wrote:OOC: Sex and Gender are and have always been synonymous, and I have not yet seen a compelling argument as to why they are suddenly different now. Also, aren't 'gender roles' against the very nature of progressivism? Men and women can do whatever they want; their gender is irrelevant, yes? Men and women do different things naturally, it's part of the biological differences, but we shouldn't act as though liking 'girly' things makes you a girl, for example. Also, people who claim they are non binary do exist, but non binary people don't exist. One could say there is a spectrum from male personality/behaviour to female, but not perfectly fitting into the stereotypical man/woman category doesn't mean you are something else entirely. People often bring up intersex, but that is 1. simply a genetic abnormality, just as someone might be born with 6 fingers, and 2. the said person almost always has very defining characteristics of one gender, they are not directly in between.
Furthermore, if I told you I was a dragon, you obviously wouldn't believe it. If I told you I was a woman, you probably would believe it. It doesn't really matter. Personally, I choose to judge people based on the content of their character, not whatever they 'identify' as. So there's really no need to tell people what you 'identify' as, since it has no tangible effect on anything.
I would suggest that you inform yourself to avoid making a fool of yourself.
by Paleoconservative Citizens » Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:03 pm
San Felix wrote:Paleoconservative Citizens wrote:That is false. As Jesus said,
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.
Matthew 5:17 ESV
Paul is saying that we are not under the law as means of salvation.
Jesus fulfilled the law by fulfilling the prophecies that announced his arrival. He abolished the law by imposing his new law: Galatians 6:2 - "Go on carrying the burdens of one another, and in this way you will fulfill the law of the Christ."
What was this new law?: John 13:34, 35 - I am giving you a new commandment, that you love one another; just as I have loved you, you also love one another. By this all will know that you are my disciples—if you have love among yourselves.”
Are you proving to be a disciple of his by not showing love and acceptance to others? Jesus doesn't think so:
1 John 4:20, 21 - "If anyone says,'I love God', and yet is hating his brother, he is a liar. For the one who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot love God, whom he has not seen. And we have this commandment from him, that whoever loves God must also love his brother."
by San Felix » Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:14 pm
Paleoconservative Citizens wrote:They are not my brothers. And also, concerning the law:
Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Matthew 5:19 ESV
by Paleoconservative Citizens » Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:15 pm
San Felix wrote:Paleoconservative Citizens wrote:They are not my brothers. And also, concerning the law:
Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Matthew 5:19 ESV
Unfortunately for you, they are. Because even though, you don't accept their lifestyle, you do have to respect them.
1 Peter 2:17 - "Honor men of all sorts, have love for the whole association of brothers, be in fear of God, honor the king."
Hebrews 12:14 - "Pursue peace with all people and the sanctification without which no man will see the Lord."
by Araraukar » Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:16 pm
West Heisen wrote:I was saying that 'non binary' is not a legitimate thing.
Apologies for absences, non-COVID health issues leave me with very little energy at times.Giovenith wrote:And sorry hun, if you were looking for a forum site where nobody argued, you've come to wrong one.
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