[PASSED] Affordable Transgender Hormone Therapy

[Morover]

I cannot vote in favor of any piece of legislation that uses the word "ought" in its proposal.

"That seems highly trivial."

“Ambassador, GAR#91 covered an area incredibly similar to this - this is patching a loophole in GAR#91’s text.”

"With that clarification, we shall be voting for this proposal."

"We appreciate your support, ambassador."

[Grand Empire of Luxembourg]

The fact that a nation would be forced to provide "transgenders" with unneeded hormone care is outrageous. It is always possible to travel to foreign countries and obtain illegal therapy there.

[Grenartia]

The fact that a nation would be forced to provide "transgenders" with unneeded hormone care is outrageous. It is always possible to travel to foreign countries and obtain illegal therapy there.

Science says it is necessary, and ethics says it should be legal in one's own country.

[Attempted Socialism]

OOC: I don't think most of the drive-by posters against the proposal are able to differentiate between sex, gender and genderroles. Several have quite clearly confused them.

OOC: Sex and Gender are and have always been synonymous, and I have not yet seen a compelling argument as to why they are suddenly different now. Also, aren't 'gender roles' against the very nature of progressivism? Men and women can do whatever they want; their gender is irrelevant, yes? Men and women do different things naturally, it's part of the biological differences, but we shouldn't act as though liking 'girly' things makes you a girl, for example. Also, people who claim they are non binary do exist, but non binary people don't exist. One could say there is a spectrum from male personality/behaviour to female, but not perfectly fitting into the stereotypical man/woman category doesn't mean you are something else entirely. People often bring up intersex, but that is 1. simply a genetic abnormality, just as someone might be born with 6 fingers, and 2. the said person almost always has very defining characteristics of one gender, they are not directly in between.

Furthermore, if I told you I was a dragon, you obviously wouldn't believe it. If I told you I was a woman, you probably would believe it. It doesn't really matter. Personally, I choose to judge people based on the content of their character, not whatever they 'identify' as. So there's really no need to tell people what you 'identify' as, since it has no tangible effect on anything.

Precisely, you don't know enough to participate meaningfully in this debate. I don't know who you are, but your words alone show that your opinions are based on misinformation, rather than any basis in facts.
I would suggest that you inform yourself to avoid making a fool of yourself.

[Separatist Peoples]

The fact that a nation would be forced to provide "transgenders" with unneeded hormone care is outrageous. It is always possible to travel to foreign countries and obtain illegal therapy there.

"So you advocate illegal medical tourism over lawful domestic treatment? What an absurd notion."

[Boisonia]

I expected a ton of bigotry and wilful ignorance in this thread, but still, yikes. So many people making false appeals to "scientific evidence" that gender and sex are synonymous and binary, and that trans/enby people are "mentally ill" despite the overwhelming majority of scientific evidence disagreeing. Aside from demonstrating wilful ignorance of the fact that gender and sex are not synonymous, most of these arguments are just empty appeals to faith or tradition, both types of arguments that don't hold any water beyond possibly just evoking an emotional reaction. They're just cover ups for prejudice and bigotry based on fear. Fear of things they don't understand, fear of things that are different, fear of change.

[Araraukar]

OOC: This is kind of confusing. How can you be nb and male?

OOC: I identify as 75% male, 25% non-female. So as "non-female-non-male" is really what non-binary is, the total sum of treatments and expression (like using a male name, and male pronouns in English; my native language, Finnish, doesn't have gendered pronouns to begin with) is on the male side of the slider between female and male, but not all the way at the male end. I was assigned female at birth.

Forgive me if I am not fully understanding what's written but which is it? Mental illness or not?

OOC: Being transgender is no more a mental illness than being cisgender is. It's basically just a different setting in your brain, something you can't affect yourself. So it's a mental condition, but not an illness. Think of it as how being shy is also a mental condition, but not a mental illness.

Gender dysphoria (the difference between the self-image of the mind and the body) can be classified as a mental illness (though, so can grieving, so I'm not entirely convinced by that classification) in that it can cause clinical depression and anxiety disorders and all kinds of nasty mental health things. Since treating each of those separately would not actually help (think of how, if you got repeately hit on the head every day, and went to complain about that, if the doctor just treated your headache instead of tackling the cause of the headache, your problems would continue), treating the cause - the body being/presenting as wrong sex - does help. It's not a cure-all, and usually you also need additional therapy or even medications, but it helps make the treatments for the "side-effects" more effective.

Hope that helps. If you're still confused, TG me.

[Wallenburg]

The fact that a nation would be forced to provide "transgenders" with unneeded hormone care is outrageous. It is always possible to travel to foreign countries and obtain illegal therapy there.

Imagine unironically wanting people to go through expensive, dangerous, and illegal procedures rather than affordable, safe, and legal ones.

[Araraukar]

The fact that a nation would be forced to provide "transgenders" with unneeded hormone care is outrageous. It is always possible to travel to foreign countries and obtain illegal therapy there.

Imagine unironically wanting people to go through expensive, dangerous, and illegal procedures rather than affordable, safe, and legal ones.

OOC: Maybe GEoL prefers their own healthcare to be foreign, expensive, dangerous and illegal? I somehow doubt that, though...

[Heavens Host]

Heaven officially declared war on the world assembly. The reason for this declaration is as follows: Mandating the normalization and acceptance of degenerate transsexuals, Seeking to put men in women’s prisons, and worst of all defiling the image of God with unnatural hormones.

All who stand for decency unite against this anti moral menace!

Hail Christ!!!

[Grenartia]

Heaven officially declared war on the world assembly. The reason for this declaration is as follows: Mandating the normalization and acceptance of degenerate transsexuals, Seeking to put men in women’s prisons, and worst of all defiling the image of God with unnatural hormones.

All who stand for decency unite against this anti moral menace!

Hail Christ!!!

Cool story bro.

Christ came to my BBQ last week to congratulate me on my transition.

[Araraukar]

Christ came to my BBQ last week to congratulate me on my transition.

OOC: Did he do that water to wine trick? That's such a great saving on the cost on booze to serve to guests.

[San Felix]

Heaven officially declared war on the world assembly. The reason for this declaration is as follows: Mandating the normalization and acceptance of degenerate transsexuals, Seeking to put men in women’s prisons, and worst of all defiling the image of God with unnatural hormones.

All who stand for decency unite against this anti moral menace!

Hail Christ!!!

Jesus Christ would be very sad if he saw you saying all of these ignorant, short-minded and above all, hateful statements. You're defiling the image of your God by portraying him as a unloving, bigoted person that only cares for certain groups and not for every single one of his creations.

[Grenartia]

Christ came to my BBQ last week to congratulate me on my transition.

OOC: Did he do that water to wine trick? That's such a great saving on the cost on booze to serve to guests.

Even better. He turned water into beer. And not that horsepiss shit, either. Actually drinkable stuff.

[San Felix]

OOC: Did he do that water to wine trick? That's such a great saving on the cost on booze to serve to guests.

Even better. He turned water into beer. And not that horsepiss shit, either. Actually drinkable stuff.

OOC: Do you have his phone number? I've been looking for a magician for my niece's birthday.

[Separatist Peoples]

Heaven officially declared war on the world assembly. The reason for this declaration is as follows: Mandating the normalization and acceptance of degenerate transsexuals, Seeking to put men in women’s prisons, and worst of all defiling the image of God with unnatural hormones.

All who stand for decency unite against this anti moral menace!

Hail Christ!!!

"But we don't believe in you. Doesn't that kill angels? Or is that fairies? I genuinely can't tell the two apart. The C.D.S.P. will treat any unidentified entrant into our airspace, angelic or otherwise, as a hostile entity and will shoot it down. We genuinely don't care if we're shooting at fairies."

[Union of Sovereign States and Republics]

Heaven officially declared war on the world assembly. The reason for this declaration is as follows: Mandating the normalization and acceptance of degenerate transsexuals, Seeking to put men in women’s prisons, and worst of all defiling the image of God with unnatural hormones.

All who stand for decency unite against this anti moral menace!

Hail Christ!!!

As a Christian, a protestant one at that, this nation is just pure blasphemy at best, and cyberterrorism at worse if it comes to that.

[Central Asian Republics]

Yet another worthless piece of platitude forward by the GA; rather than forbidding nations from banning access to hormone therapy, this resolution forces nations to simply provide "affordable" treatment without anything indicating how that could be done.

[Kenmoria]

Yet another worthless piece of platitude forward by the GA; rather than forbidding nations from banning access to hormone therapy, this resolution forces nations to simply provide "affordable" treatment without anything indicating how that could be done.

(OOC: This does forbid nations from banning access to hormone therapy, just indirectly. It states ‘requires all member-states to legalize hormone therapy for all consenting individuals,’ which bans a member state from prohibiting hormone therapy.)

[New Ossiron]

" The Glorious Republic rejects this proposal in its current state and will, therefore, be voting against. Despite this, we would like to make clear that we openly admire and condone the resolution and its intent.

The Glorious Republic wishes to highlight that it does not aline itself with many of the views expressed by those opposing the resolution, however, a number of areas within the proposal cause us deep concern and form the basis of our opposition.

We wish to emphasise the three key issues that currently influence our decision:

1. We believe the proposal could introduce a potential threat to children by giving them the autonomy to make life-changing decisions before we can be sure they are fully understanding of the consequences. Therefore, we would like a minimum age for hormone therapy to be included within the document, or for states to be allowed the freedom to implement their own age restrictions upon hormone therapies. If this was done the New Ossironian People would be significantly more likely to lend support in favour of the resolution.

2. We are of the belief that identifying as transgender is a "mental illness" (as opposed to a physical one, despite possibly having physical consequences) and would, therefore, like to see this removed from the resolution. However, this is a matter of categorisation and is overall of little importance.

3. Finally, we believe that the proposal may contradict itself in points 2 and 4. Point 2 states that "[transgender] experiences are not the product of 'mental illness'", while point 4 claims that "[transgenderism is] like any mental condition". We would like to see this possible conflict addressed.

Thank you. "

[Fushiya]

OOC: This is kind of confusing. How can you be nb and male?

OOC: I identify as 75% male, 25% non-female. So as "non-female-non-male" is really what non-binary is, the total sum of treatments and expression (like using a male name, and male pronouns in English; my native language, Finnish, doesn't have gendered pronouns to begin with) is on the male side of the slider between female and male, but not all the way at the male end. I was assigned female at birth.

Forgive me if I am not fully understanding what's written but which is it? Mental illness or not?

OOC: Being transgender is no more a mental illness than being cisgender is. It's basically just a different setting in your brain, something you can't affect yourself. So it's a mental condition, but not an illness. Think of it as how being shy is also a mental condition, but not a mental illness.

Gender dysphoria (the difference between the self-image of the mind and the body) can be classified as a mental illness (though, so can grieving, so I'm not entirely convinced by that classification) in that it can cause clinical depression and anxiety disorders and all kinds of nasty mental health things. Since treating each of those separately would not actually help (think of how, if you got repeately hit on the head every day, and went to complain about that, if the doctor just treated your headache instead of tackling the cause of the headache, your problems would continue), treating the cause - the body being/presenting as wrong sex - does help. It's not a cure-all, and usually you also need additional therapy or even medications, but it helps make the treatments for the "side-effects" more effective.

Hope that helps. If you're still confused, TG me.

Thank you for the clarification. It was most reassuring.

[Vrama]

Namaste,

His Sacred Majesty wishes me to inform the GA that this proposal is unacceptable.

Further, Vrama regards this proposal as illegal and invalid ab initio, for it is contrary to nature.

Such activity, without the permission of the Ministry of Justice, is illegal and shall remain so.

[Kenmoria]

" The Glorious Republic rejects this proposal in its current state and will, therefore, be voting against. Despite this, we would like to make clear that we openly admire and condone the resolution and its intent.

The Glorious Republic wishes to highlight that it does not aline itself with many of the views expressed by those opposing the resolution, however, a number of areas within the proposal cause us deep concern and form the basis of our opposition.

We wish to emphasise the three key issues that currently influence our decision:

1. We believe the proposal could introduce a potential threat to children by giving them the autonomy to make life-changing decisions before we can be sure they are fully understanding of the consequences. Therefore, we would like a minimum age for hormone therapy to be included within the document, or for states to be allowed the freedom to implement their own age restrictions upon hormone therapies. If this was done the New Ossironian People would be significantly more likely to lend support in favour of the resolution.

2. We are of the belief that identifying as transgender is a "mental illness" (as opposed to a physical one, despite possibly having physical consequences) and would, therefore, like to see this removed from the resolution. However, this is a matter of categorisation and is overall of little importance.

3. Finally, we believe that the proposal may contradict itself in points 2 and 4. Point 2 states that "[transgender] experiences are not the product of 'mental illness'", while point 4 claims that "[transgenderism is] like any mental condition". We would like to see this possible conflict addressed.

Thank you. "

“Point one is a simple matter enforced by the fact that the proposal only mentions ‘consensual’ hormone therapy. A seven year old, in terms of the human species found in Kenmoria, cannot consent, so the proposal does not apply. Point two is a good point but, as you point out, of little importance. Point three has been addressed before, so merely for clarification: being transgender is not a mental illness by itself, however the disconnect between mind and body resultant from circumstances is a mental condition.

However, I must congratulate you on your standard of debate. It is far above the average I have seen today, as the ambassador from Marxist Germany put it.”

Namaste,

His Sacred Majesty wishes me to inform the GA that this proposal is unacceptable.

Further, the Vrama regards this proposal as illegal and invalid ab initio, for it is contrary to nature.

Such activity, without the permission of the Ministry of Justice, is illegal and shall remain so.

(OOC: Don’t do that. GA proposals are illegal if they violate the rules, or possibly the OSRS, and for no other reason. If this is passed, your nation complies with it. That is the nature of the General Assembly.)

[Catsfern]

This resolution is going to pass, I can see that hopefully it won’t force me to modify any legislation to bring me into compliance.

[Kyrgwalaey]

"Their experiences are not the product of "mental illness," "confusion," "disease," or anything of the sort -- rather, their understanding of their relationship to the world in the lens of gender does not correspond with their biological sex."

Perfect, so we can finally fix the problem by extreme rehabilitation programs. If the nature of their abnormality is simply misunderstanding, it should be quite simple to open their eyes to the truth. Also, if hormone therapy is a genuine treatment, wouldn't this mean that this is precisely a mental illness, or a physical imbalance? In fact, this means that they are either confused, or suffering from illness.

Furthermore, we prefer not to use the term "gender". Its a fancy way of saying what you relate to. If a bird acted like a hippo, is it a bird? Of course you can argue how this is related to the resolution, in which case I would point out that we believe only biological sex is a valid identity. Gender is a false use of identity and enjoyment of things. What makes a man different than a woman? Anatomy, and psychology. How do you plan to provide change for this? When clearly the person is born with the identity that they so clearly can see, especially when looking down. What defines a gender is subjective in all cultures using it. The whole theory is based off the idea of enjoyment, or resentment. So?

We clarify that it is not the role of the government to provide easy access to personal preference of a small minority. Very weird how this resolution came so far.