[DEFEATED/DISCARDED] Condemn Civil Defence Siren

[Kotarya]

I have come back to this game from 2 years absence and have no idea how this game works and how some members have more power.
Like, more power for what? To enforce stupid ideologies? Many "laws" that passed are so contradictory, and if this one passes I will eat my hat.

That nation has in its factbook: The goal of the system is to ensure that nations are fully informed of the dangers of residing in a Nazi/Fascist region, and to encourage them to consider relocating.

It says we should be democratic, but at the same time encourages more people to avoid joining such regions. So basically: "Don't join them, go to a more "democratic" region instead, we are telling you what to do and how to do it, so we are more democratic than them".
So the conclusion is that you are the fascist region, not them.

If you are going to propose something, at least make it right. If you are going to run your mouth about having big political freedoms there, follow your own saying. Leave the rest to do whatever the heck they want.

[Farnhamia]

its nice to know that regardless of how good or bad this is, that the majority of people voting here are ok with Nazism. ALthough i am willing to bet that a good 70% of these people lean left, and since the left loves nazis and anti Semites, im not surprised that there is such an overwhelming majority against this proposal.

But whos gonna bother to read this and reply constructively? Since i live in the CCD and i have a history of speaking out against you democracy loving filth, it means that this whole remark is gonna get nothing but crud from yall. Thats ok, you profile me, i have no problem profiling you, as i did with the statement above.

For, purely because (irl) as a German disgusted with nazism and anti-semitism, i refuse to let some elitists who have been writing these things for years bash it because of 'bad english' or 'poor formatting' etc.

and now i wait for the reputable democracy lovers to respond in a more negative manner than my own.

The funny thing about posting in a negative manner is, it often brings negative consequences, like being *** warned for trolling. ***

[Kranostav]

I just have to point out how hilarious it is to me that the complainers started off with "This will never make it to the vote" then once it made it to the vote, started complaining that it's illegal.

Its incredibly easy to get terrible proposals to vote when you throw money behind them. Without a campaign, this doesn't get north of 45 approvals. Don't pretend that there is some underlying support for this.

[Kinnies]

It says we should be democratic, but at the same time encourages more people to avoid joining such regions. So basically: "Don't join them, go to a more "democratic" region instead, we are telling you what to do and how to do it, so we are more democratic than them".
So the conclusion is that you are the fascist region, not them.

*Eichmann in Jerusalem voice* You claim to be democratic, yet are telling me I can’t commit war crimes!

[Bhang Bhang Duc]

I just have to point out how hilarious it is to me that the complainers started off with "This will never make it to the vote" then once it made it to the vote, started complaining that it's illegal.

Nobody’s complaining that it’s illegal, the Mods have ruled it that way. We are finding your incompetence at not being able to spell the target’s name consistently hilarious though.

Better luck next time.

[True Democratic Socialism]

This proposal was so badly worded that I thought it was for banning facism

[The Feylands]

A well thought out proposal.

And we hate nazism too. But this kind of narrow-minded and uncalled for moralism is only counter-productive and annoying.

Like - who the h*** cares?

[Isla Pobre]

Isla Pobre is proudly communist and not fascist, but we defy any attempt of a world government trying to saying what kind of government we can and can't have!

Also it appears that many here are unaware that nazism and fascism aren't exactly synonyms. Nazism is a kind of fascism, but not all fascism is Nazism or even race-based for that matter.

[Boisonia]

How did this resolution even make it to vote? Are there that many CCD puppet regions now that they can just shove a resolution like this through the approval process? It's so horribly written and an obvious attempt to "epically troll" the WA by the Confederation of W̶h̶i̶n̶e̶y̶ ̶E̶d̶g̶e̶l̶o̶r̶d̶s Corrupt Dictators, attempting to slander a nation that does us all a public service by disrupting and countering their and other fascist regions' recruitment. Ironically enough, the CCD themselves are mostly fascists or at the very least fascist sympathizers, seeing as their region actively promotes fascism. Opposed.

[The Black Party]

CDS is really just annoying but the question is, does being annoying warrant a condemnation?

[North Cross]

One wishes the Confederation of Corrupt Dictators would spend as much time drafting quality proposals as they do blowing hot air about regarding "corruption" and "elitism" in the World Assembly. If they desire to actively wear the "villain" costume on the world stage, they might at least make the effort to write proposals of real substance. As it stands, it would be more accurate to describe the garb they are donning to be that of the "clown."

You wish to condemn a particular nation for acts you deem unworthy? Fine. I would honestly be interested to read an honest, well thought-out proposal that is creative and expertly-crafted. This makes me sleepy.

A more apt proposal may be a Condemnation of Wrapper for exploitation of a film of such caliber as Blues Brothers for the purpose of deflecting responsibility:

It wasn't my fault. Honest. I ran out of gas. I had a flat tire. I… I didn’t have enough money for cab fare. My tux didn’t come back from the cleaners. An old friend came in from out of town. Someone stole my car. There was an earthquake! A terrible flood! Locusts! IT WASN’T MY FAULT, I SWEAR TO GOD!

Hereby Condemns Wrapper

[Greater vakolicci haven]

A well thought out proposal.

And we hate nazism too. But this kind of narrow-minded and uncalled for moralism is only counter-productive and annoying.

Like - who the h*** cares?

Why aren't more people here like this guy...

[The Gilded Star]

I just have to point out how hilarious it is to me that the complainers started off with "This will never make it to the vote" then once it made it to the vote, started complaining that it's illegal.

Its incredibly easy to get terrible proposals to vote when you throw money behind them. Without a campaign, this doesn't get north of 45 approvals. Don't pretend that there is some underlying support for this.

True enough, the proposal sat at about 6 approvals for about 24 hours before flying up to 88+ within a matter of a couple hours. Makes it pretty obvious it was campaigned on. Willing to bet a good number of them didn't even know what they were voting for, they just did it because someone (Jocospor) politely asked them to.

That being said, it really didn't deserve being rammed through for a vote, not because it's condemning the CDS, but because 90% of the proposal is some red herring with no bearing on the resolution and barely even mentions the nominee, much less explains why they warrant a condemnation.

[The Reddington States]

I don't see the importance of a Civil Defence Siren. To start with, fascists are proud of their political views. Do they want liberals or leftists entering their region? The answer to that is probably not. You'd believe that the Civil Defence Siren is doing fascist regions a favor by scaring off users who follow "an ideology of degeneracy".

Furthermore, it's utterly ineffective in non-fascist regions. Redlandia should not be there but many of us stopped caring when we noticed that the number of members in the region grew by around twenty despite a siren in effect. The new members also questioned whether or not the CDS was factual. Our answer to their question was, "See for yourself and determine for yourself if our region is right for you".

The Civil Defence Siren is just kinda pointless. It didn't stop any new nations from joining CCD (a region I don't perceive as fascist but has a very difficult time alienating itself from actual fascists), or Redlandia, for that matter.

Regardless of the vote, I'm pretty glad the CDS was brought up. The CDS is like Wile E. Coyote trying to catch the Road Runner: it tries to negatively affect recruitment numbers but never really does.

The point of CDS is to let prospective members of these fascist regions know they're in a fascist region. For example, a normal dictatorship wants to join CCD but doesn't know its fascist. The CDS lets them know that. If they're fascist, well then okay.

Also my usual 'redlandia big fascist so their opinion doesn't matter' applies.

Eh, regardless of what you think about our region, the CDS has been an epic failure at keeping newcomers out. We've grown 82 to 102 using less than 500 recruitment telegrams.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Malphe]

Oh my god this actually made it to vote? I wasn't paying attention. CCD never ceases to amaze.

[Kuriko]

I guess I'll be the one to provide the campaign telegram here for perusal.

The Imperial Empire of Jocospor → Slackertown, tag: delegates
1 day 18 hours ago
This one's OOC today.

A nation in my region, Slackertown, has recently written a Security Council proposal to Condemn Civil Defence Siren.

For those who don't know what this is, a handful of regions have been blacklisted by this "siren" - when a new nation joins one of the regions, they get a telegram along the lines of "Don't live here. Bad. Horrible place."

In my opinion, and I'm sure not everyone will agree, but this is unnecessary and, to be honest, pretty rude. Each of us are entitled to be allowed to create our own communities the way we want to. If you're not happy with someone's community, just don't be a part of it. And, on that, a lot of people who don't like certain communities just don't understand them. I'd encourage people to send puppets here and there if they really want to learn about a region's workings, not just fire off misrepresenting telegrams.

More so, a lot of the players who get the Civil Defence Siren are new (I think that must be specified in the API or something). These new players haven't had the opportunity to properly experience NationStates yet. It's not fair on them, or NationStates as a whole, to start perpetuating false understandings of what this game is.

Please approve this proposal. It seems the right thing to do, and will hopefully encourage the benefactors of the Civil Defence Siren to reconsider their actions.

Thanks everyone. Have a good day.

- Jocospor

[The Feylands]

A well thought out proposal.

And we hate nazism too. But this kind of narrow-minded and uncalled for moralism is only counter-productive and annoying.

Like - who the h*** cares?

Why aren't more people here like this guy...

Like this gal. But thank you anyway.

And yeh - I cannot phantom why someone would do something like this except out of some kind of obnoxious pathologically intolerant, psychologic need for the holier-than-thou feeling, at the expense of others. This kind of behaviour should legitimately get one booted out from any community in real life. (perhaps that's why this is happening online instead..? )

Almost got me to relocate to the CCD out of sympathy... but my nation doesn't really fit in there.

If a group of people are bad, please treat us players as capable enough of finding that out ourselves. If I want a damn sermon I can always go to a Church.

[Qilai]

When I first saw the name "Civil Defence Siren", I was like, "oooh, pretty!"

But then I found out it's like one of them alert sirens. So disappointing.

[The Gilded Star]

This kind of behaviour should legitimately get one booted out from any community in real life.

Actually they exist in real life, too. The US Travel Advisory, for one example.

[The Reddington States]

Why aren't more people here like this guy...

Like this gal. But thank you anyway.

And yeh - I cannot phantom why someone would do something like this except out of some kind of obnoxious pathologically intolerant, psychologic need for the holier-than-thou feeling, at the expense of others. This kind of behaviour should legitimately get one booted out from any community in real life. (perhaps that's why this is happening online instead..? )

Almost got me to relocate to the CCD out of sympathy... but my nation doesn't really fit in there.

If a group of people are bad, please treat us players as capable enough of finding that out ourselves. If I want a damn sermon I can always go to a Church.

The CDS not only angers residents of non-fascist regions, it confuses anyone who enters any of the listed regions. People are not stupid enough to follow the CDS's words like the Gospel. The CDS has always been questioned and, based on experience, all of them are likely to agree with the residents on whether or not their region is fascist, rather than the CDS itself.

The CDS is like if someone was trying to kill fire with fire and ended up making the fire bigger and brighter.

[The Reddington States]

All I'm saying is that the CDS is useless. Even if the majority vote is "against" the proposal, I highly doubt real fascist regions care, and the CDS is only "poking" a few exceptions without actually hurting them.

[Novum Vallis]

Like this gal. But thank you anyway.

And yeh - I cannot phantom why someone would do something like this except out of some kind of obnoxious pathologically intolerant, psychologic need for the holier-than-thou feeling, at the expense of others. This kind of behaviour should legitimately get one booted out from any community in real life. (perhaps that's why this is happening online instead..? )

Almost got me to relocate to the CCD out of sympathy... but my nation doesn't really fit in there.

If a group of people are bad, please treat us players as capable enough of finding that out ourselves. If I want a damn sermon I can always go to a Church.

The CDS not only angers residents of non-fascist regions, it confuses anyone who enters any of the listed regions. People are not stupid enough to follow the CDS's words like the Gospel. The CDS has always been questioned and, based on experience, all of them are likely to agree with the residents on whether or not their region is fascist, rather than the CDS itself.

The CDS is like if someone was trying to kill fire with fire and ended up making the fire bigger and brighter.

I'd reword some things here. It initially angered me when the CDS was in place but since new members questioned its telegrams I gradually laughed it off. I do believe it's annoying, but its ineffectiveness should really be the reason for the CDS to stop existing.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

I guess I'll be the one to provide the campaign telegram here for perusal.

The Imperial Empire of Jocospor → Slackertown, tag: delegates
1 day 18 hours ago
This one's OOC today.

A nation in my region, Slackertown, has recently written a Security Council proposal to Condemn Civil Defence Siren.

For those who don't know what this is, a handful of regions have been blacklisted by this "siren" - when a new nation joins one of the regions, they get a telegram along the lines of "Don't live here. Bad. Horrible place."

In my opinion, and I'm sure not everyone will agree, but this is unnecessary and, to be honest, pretty rude. Each of us are entitled to be allowed to create our own communities the way we want to. If you're not happy with someone's community, just don't be a part of it. And, on that, a lot of people who don't like certain communities just don't understand them. I'd encourage people to send puppets here and there if they really want to learn about a region's workings, not just fire off misrepresenting telegrams.

More so, a lot of the players who get the Civil Defence Siren are new (I think that must be specified in the API or something). These new players haven't had the opportunity to properly experience NationStates yet. It's not fair on them, or NationStates as a whole, to start perpetuating false understandings of what this game is.

Please approve this proposal. It seems the right thing to do, and will hopefully encourage the benefactors of the Civil Defence Siren to reconsider their actions.

Thanks everyone. Have a good day.

- Jocospor

NGL, he could have put 'greater vakolicci haven' at the end of that campaign telegram and I wouldn't have minded, the civil defence siren is one of the worst things about ns Antifa, as it spreads unproveable garbage to new people who don't know better.

[The Black Party]

The Imperial Empire of Jocospor → Slackertown, tag: delegates
1 day 18 hours ago
This one's OOC today.

A nation in my region, Slackertown, has recently written a Security Council proposal to Condemn Civil Defence Siren.

For those who don't know what this is, a handful of regions have been blacklisted by this "siren" - when a new nation joins one of the regions, they get a telegram along the lines of "Don't live here. Bad. Horrible place."

In my opinion, and I'm sure not everyone will agree, but this is unnecessary and, to be honest, pretty rude. Each of us are entitled to be allowed to create our own communities the way we want to. If you're not happy with someone's community, just don't be a part of it. And, on that, a lot of people who don't like certain communities just don't understand them. I'd encourage people to send puppets here and there if they really want to learn about a region's workings, not just fire off misrepresenting telegrams.

More so, a lot of the players who get the Civil Defence Siren are new (I think that must be specified in the API or something). These new players haven't had the opportunity to properly experience NationStates yet. It's not fair on them, or NationStates as a whole, to start perpetuating false understandings of what this game is.

Please approve this proposal. It seems the right thing to do, and will hopefully encourage the benefactors of the Civil Defence Siren to reconsider their actions.

Thanks everyone. Have a good day.

- Jocospor

almost makes sense

[Novum Vallis]

I guess I'll be the one to provide the campaign telegram here for perusal.

The Imperial Empire of Jocospor → Slackertown, tag: delegates
1 day 18 hours ago
This one's OOC today.

A nation in my region, Slackertown, has recently written a Security Council proposal to Condemn Civil Defence Siren.

For those who don't know what this is, a handful of regions have been blacklisted by this "siren" - when a new nation joins one of the regions, they get a telegram along the lines of "Don't live here. Bad. Horrible place."

In my opinion, and I'm sure not everyone will agree, but this is unnecessary and, to be honest, pretty rude. Each of us are entitled to be allowed to create our own communities the way we want to. If you're not happy with someone's community, just don't be a part of it. And, on that, a lot of people who don't like certain communities just don't understand them. I'd encourage people to send puppets here and there if they really want to learn about a region's workings, not just fire off misrepresenting telegrams.

More so, a lot of the players who get the Civil Defence Siren are new (I think that must be specified in the API or something). These new players haven't had the opportunity to properly experience NationStates yet. It's not fair on them, or NationStates as a whole, to start perpetuating false understandings of what this game is.

Please approve this proposal. It seems the right thing to do, and will hopefully encourage the benefactors of the Civil Defence Siren to reconsider their actions.

Thanks everyone. Have a good day.

- Jocospor

NGL, he could have put 'greater vakolicci haven' at the end of that campaign telegram and I wouldn't have minded, the civil defence siren is one of the worst things about ns Antifa, as it spreads unproveable garbage to new people who don't know better.

Antifa has nothing to do with the Civil Defence Siren. It was implemented entirely by the New Pacific Order.