NationStates

OOC
Now _
Approvals: 61 (Dunmoyle, Hatzisland, Kolkatta, United Western State, White Bluff, Freedonianism, Nonadia, Pantseria, Simbolon, Ualoi, Jocospor, Hfhbsd, Greater Germany, Independant Canada, New Mexican Republics, Libonesia, Karteria, Vordia, Merni, Dragons of Power, Arrstotzka, German Byzantium, Refuge Isle, Toopaka, Alistia, Leskya, Ellenburg, New Zacharianasville, Flopdania, The Tomerlands, Stoner Anime Gang, Dragoonite, The Montonian, Grand-Turinia, The Chicago Economic States, Funky Goats, The Jazz Masters, Gay Elysium, Bruhhhhhhhhhhh, Republic Of Sumpra, Boku no Pica, Arpad, Greater Slavicland, Astrum Nigrum, Faniviace, Peoples Republic of California, Vampz, ScottishCanadia, Iciaros, Vampirism, Ryhnn, Pius Desurongcrandis, Fearsburg, Standardized Tests, Mombombu, Stolkland, Amerigaia, Chin chin, Isle of Xay, The Eireann WA Delegation, Woods Is Back)

10 hours to go.

Marxist Germany wrote:

Bears Armed wrote:OOC
Needs 13 more approvals in 13 hours.
Currently _
Approvals: 58 (Dunmoyle, Hatzisland, Kolkatta, United Western State, White Bluff, Freedonianism, Nonadia, Pantseria, Simbolon, Ualoi, Jocospor, Hfhbsd, Greater Germany, Independant Canada, New Mexican Republics, Libonesia, Karteria, Vordia, Merni, Dragons of Power, Arrstotzka, German Byzantium, Refuge Isle, Toopaka, Alistia, Leskya, Ellenburg, New Zacharianasville, Flopdania, The Tomerlands, Stoner Anime Gang, Dragoonite, The Montonian, Grand-Turinia, The Chicago Economic States, Funky Goats, The Jazz Masters, Gay Elysium, Bruhhhhhhhhhhh, Republic Of Sumpra, Ashrstan, Boku no Pica, Arpad, Greater Slavicland, Astrum Nigrum, Faniviace, Peoples Republic of California, Vampz, ScottishCanadia, Iciaros, Vampirism, Ryhnn, Pius Desurongcrandis, Fearsburg, Standardized Tests, Mombombu, Stolkland, Amerigaia).

21 in 10 hours, just need to send out more campaign TGs and this should hopefully make it, otherwise I will be postponing the submission for at least a month

(OOC: I hope it does. I believe that, if this reaches quorum, it should be able to pass. It’s just the first hurdle that is causing difficulty.)

Kenmoria wrote:

Marxist Germany wrote:21 in 10 hours, just need to send out more campaign TGs and this should hopefully make it, otherwise I will be postponing the submission for at least a month

(OOC: I hope it does. I believe that, if this reaches quorum, it should be able to pass. It’s just the first hurdle that is causing difficulty.)

OOC: Yeah, I think as well

Bears Armed wrote:OOC
Now _
Approvals: 61 (Dunmoyle, Hatzisland, Kolkatta, United Western State, White Bluff, Freedonianism, Nonadia, Pantseria, Simbolon, Ualoi, Jocospor, Hfhbsd, Greater Germany, Independant Canada, New Mexican Republics, Libonesia, Karteria, Vordia, Merni, Dragons of Power, Arrstotzka, German Byzantium, Refuge Isle, Toopaka, Alistia, Leskya, Ellenburg, New Zacharianasville, Flopdania, The Tomerlands, Stoner Anime Gang, Dragoonite, The Montonian, Grand-Turinia, The Chicago Economic States, Funky Goats, The Jazz Masters, Gay Elysium, Bruhhhhhhhhhhh, Republic Of Sumpra, Boku no Pica, Arpad, Greater Slavicland, Astrum Nigrum, Faniviace, Peoples Republic of California, Vampz, ScottishCanadia, Iciaros, Vampirism, Ryhnn, Pius Desurongcrandis, Fearsburg, Standardized Tests, Mombombu, Stolkland, Amerigaia, Chin chin, Isle of Xay, The Eireann WA Delegation, Woods Is Back)

10 hours to go.

It's going to be real close. I think it will easily pass if it reaches enough approvals, it just needs to get them. Let's hope it does.

Edit: 9 more in 5 hours! Let's finish this!

Hatzisland wrote:

Bears Armed wrote:OOC
Now _
Approvals: 61 (Dunmoyle, Hatzisland, Kolkatta, United Western State, White Bluff, Freedonianism, Nonadia, Pantseria, Simbolon, Ualoi, Jocospor, Hfhbsd, Greater Germany, Independant Canada, New Mexican Republics, Libonesia, Karteria, Vordia, Merni, Dragons of Power, Arrstotzka, German Byzantium, Refuge Isle, Toopaka, Alistia, Leskya, Ellenburg, New Zacharianasville, Flopdania, The Tomerlands, Stoner Anime Gang, Dragoonite, The Montonian, Grand-Turinia, The Chicago Economic States, Funky Goats, The Jazz Masters, Gay Elysium, Bruhhhhhhhhhhh, Republic Of Sumpra, Boku no Pica, Arpad, Greater Slavicland, Astrum Nigrum, Faniviace, Peoples Republic of California, Vampz, ScottishCanadia, Iciaros, Vampirism, Ryhnn, Pius Desurongcrandis, Fearsburg, Standardized Tests, Mombombu, Stolkland, Amerigaia, Chin chin, Isle of Xay, The Eireann WA Delegation, Woods Is Back)

10 hours to go.

It's going to be real close. I think it will easily pass if it reaches enough approvals, it just needs to get them. Let's hope it does.

Edit: 9 more in 5 hours! Let's finish this!

13 minutes ago: The General Assembly proposal "Protecting Personal Data" [Marxist Germany] failed to achieve quorum.
64 minutes ago: Sorovo approved the World Assembly proposal "Protecting Personal Data".

Short six approvals

(OOC: Aww. Well, now that we're here, what's next? What does Marxist Germany have to do before they can submit this again, if at all?)

Iciaros wrote:(OOC: Aww. Well, now that we're here, what's next? What does Marxist Germany have to do before they can submit this again, if at all?)

OOC: Given that it was presumably legal, nothing.

Iciaros wrote:(OOC: Aww. Well, now that we're here, what's next? What does Marxist Germany have to do before they can submit this again, if at all?)

"We'll wait 2 weeks before next submission"

“In 2a, ‘or it would be impractical to do so’. Although, in the age of the internet, it is possible for most companies to trace the ages of people taking part in anonymous surveys, that probably shouldn’t be encouraged.”

Marxist Germany wrote:

Iciaros wrote:(OOC: Aww. Well, now that we're here, what's next? What does Marxist Germany have to do before they can submit this again, if at all?)

"We'll wait 2 weeks before next submission"

You should definitely stick with this. This has the support, and will pass if you keep trying.

Spam submitting isn't appreciated. And honestly the proposal doesn't adequately address the issue at all. It seems to not understand how warrants work and greatly harms the ability for the government to collect data for reasons beyond criminal investigations.

Kranostav wrote:Spam submitting isn't appreciated. And honestly the proposal doesn't adequately address the issue at all. It seems to not understand how warrants work and greatly harms the ability for the government to collect data for reasons beyond criminal investigations.

(OOC: My understanding of the draft (clause 2c specifically) is that the ability for governments to collect information is not really impaired unless they are going through businesses to do it? So they should still be fine collecting info through national surveys and censuses (censi?) and such so long as they don't go through businesses to do it. Though, now that I'm looking at it again, I wonder what the potential impact of 3c is on government retention of information - I can imagine both a very restrictive effect and a very liberal one depending on how one interprets the word 'purpose'.)

Kranostav wrote:Spam submitting isn't appreciated. And honestly the proposal doesn't adequately address the issue at all. It seems to not understand how warrants work and greatly harms the ability for the government to collect data for reasons beyond criminal investigations.

OOC:
1) As I said, I'm not submitting this for a while
2) How doesn't it address the issue adequately?
3) Changed warrant to search warrant
4) Why would a government want to collect data from its citizens through a business other than for criminal investigations?

Marxist Germany wrote:4) Why would a government want to collect data from its citizens through a business other than for criminal investigations?

"For all the reasons businesses want it. Data allows efficient analysis of trends and needs, and allows predictive patterns. Theoretically, states have an interest in monitoring data to determine something as mundane as the length of red lights during peak transit hours based on population concentration and public preference for route."

OOC: there absolutely is a disconnect between at least US law regarding warrants and private data. I cannot speak to other jurisdictions because I've no experience with their law, so don't think I'm trying to argue that US law is the only law worth modeling, but that disconnect raised eyebrows. This is a nuanced area of the law that is even now unfolding, but the proposal deals with the entirety of government use of data in criminal proceedings with one, relatively ungraceful swoop.

Separatist Peoples wrote:

Marxist Germany wrote:4) Why would a government want to collect data from its citizens through a business other than for criminal investigations?

"For all the reasons businesses want it. Data allows efficient analysis of trends and needs, and allows predictive patterns. Theoretically, states have an interest in monitoring data to determine something as mundane as the length of red lights during peak transit hours based on population concentration and public preference for route."

OOC: there absolutely is a disconnect between at least US law regarding warrants and private data. I cannot speak to other jurisdictions because I've no experience with their law, so don't think I'm trying to argue that US law is the only law worth modeling, but that disconnect raised eyebrows. This is a nuanced area of the law that is even now unfolding, but the proposal deals with the entirety of government use of data in criminal proceedings with one, relatively ungraceful swoop.

OOC:Can you recognise someone by the amount of time they waited at a red light? If the answer is no then this isn't covered by the proposal

Marxist Germany wrote:

Separatist Peoples wrote:"For all the reasons businesses want it. Data allows efficient analysis of trends and needs, and allows predictive patterns. Theoretically, states have an interest in monitoring data to determine something as mundane as the length of red lights during peak transit hours based on population concentration and public preference for route."

OOC: there absolutely is a disconnect between at least US law regarding warrants and private data. I cannot speak to other jurisdictions because I've no experience with their law, so don't think I'm trying to argue that US law is the only law worth modeling, but that disconnect raised eyebrows. This is a nuanced area of the law that is even now unfolding, but the proposal deals with the entirety of government use of data in criminal proceedings with one, relatively ungraceful swoop.

OOC:Can you recognise someone by the amount of time they waited at a red light? If the answer is no then this isn't covered by the proposal

(OOC: Perhaps you should add something in your definition of ‘personal data’ to clarify that the data must be able to identify a sapient by itself. If, for example, there were two identical twins with the same name who waited at a traffic light for different times, that data could be used to identify them.)

Kenmoria wrote:

Marxist Germany wrote:OOC:Can you recognise someone by the amount of time they waited at a red light? If the answer is no then this isn't covered by the proposal

(OOC: Perhaps you should add something in your definition of ‘personal data’ to clarify that the data must be able to identify a sapient by itself. If, for example, there were two identical twins with the same name who waited at a traffic light for different times, that data could be used to identify them.)

OOC: Fixed

Kenmoria wrote:“In 2a, ‘or it would be impractical to do so’. Although, in the age of the internet, it is possible for most companies to trace the ages of people taking part in anonymous surveys, that probably shouldn’t be encouraged.”

"Can you elaborate more on that please"

OOC: Minor wording issue I noticed in the definitions, "A "Guardian" as any legal parent of a minor, or if none, the biological parent;" I think you meant "as any legal guardian" instead of "any legal parent", since an orphaned ward of the state living in an orphaned children's facility wouldn't have parents, biological or otherwise, but would have legal guardian(s).

Araraukar wrote:OOC: Minor wording issue I noticed in the definitions, "A "Guardian" as any legal parent of a minor, or if none, the biological parent;" I think you meant "as any legal guardian" instead of "any legal parent", since an orphaned ward of the state living in an orphaned children's facility wouldn't have parents, biological or otherwise, but would have legal guardian(s).

OOC:Using the word being defined in the definition should be avoided; nevertheless I'll do it.

Marxist Germany wrote:

Araraukar wrote:OOC: Minor wording issue I noticed in the definitions, "A "Guardian" as any legal parent of a minor, or if none, the biological parent;" I think you meant "as any legal guardian" instead of "any legal parent", since an orphaned ward of the state living in an orphaned children's facility wouldn't have parents, biological or otherwise, but would have legal guardian(s).

OOC:Using the word being defined in the definition should be avoided; nevertheless I'll do it.

OOC: 'Guardian' is a commonly known English word with an accepted definition, so it's perfectly fine to use it in your definition. All you're doing with your definition is just show who would be affected by your proposal, not explain the meaning of a word to someone who has no idea what it means.

Maowi wrote:

Marxist Germany wrote:OOC:Using the word being defined in the definition should be avoided; nevertheless I'll do it.

OOC: 'Guardian' is a commonly known English word with an accepted definition, so it's perfectly fine to use it in your definition. All you're doing with your definition is just show who would be affected by your proposal, not explain the meaning of a word to someone who has no idea what it means.

OOC:Alright

“For Claude 3b, what about sensitive or confidential information? For example, care homes, which can be privatised, may keep sensitive information on children that would be best not revealed until the children are older. I suggest adding ‘unless release of the data would compromise the well-being of the user or others’.”

Kenmoria wrote:“For Claude 3b, what about sensitive or confidential information? For example, care homes, which can be privatised, may keep sensitive information on children that would be best not revealed until the children are older. I suggest adding ‘unless release of the data would compromise the well-being of the user or others’.”

OOC: Done

“In 1b, I believe the clause would flow better were there to be added the word ‘exist’ after ‘none’.”