[DEFEATED/DISCARDED] Lib. Federation Of Conservative Nations

[Caracasus]

Jokes, again? Alright - this one seems appropriate.

Q. When is a fascist joke about genocide not a joke?

A. When you agree with them.

Look, we know how this works by now, and the usual lies remain just that, lies. Yes, it probably did fool some people a while ago when you held up your hands and said "but... but I was just joking? Can't you take a joke?" Thing is, we know that's a massive lie now.

The standard cowardly tactic of fascists (or the alt-right - when your ideology is so toxic you have to rebrand it) is to crack edgy jokes. That way if someone acts as if they're upset or repulsed you get away with it, because it was just a joke. Of course, if someone laughs and even sounds like they start to agree then you know you've got a potential fellow fascist. I mean, it kinda worked for a while, but it's getting really old and really boring, to the extent that almost word for word this same exchange happened in pretty much every liberation of a fascist region.

[Prydania]

I’ve seen Kavagrad’s evidence. I’ve seen New Waldensia‘s evidence, that proves that FCN did indeed try to crack down on this behaviour, and eventually managed to accomplish that goal.

The evidence provided by Kavagrad is pretty bad and is proof that the individuals are pretty damn irredeemable. I do not disagree with Kavagrad or anyone else who finds that behaviour totally unacceptable. Like them I want it pushed out of our community. Made to feel as if it has no place here.

That being said...The screenshots provided by New Waldensia prove that FCN leadership saw this behaviour as a problem as well and took steps to stop it.
Did FCN act foolish in allowing game mechanics to trump basic human decency? Yeah. To be frank such behaviour should have recieved a ban straight away rather than the kicks that did occur (New Waldensia’s evidence documents this). And the whole constitutional amendment stuff never should have gotten as far as it did.

That said, a distinction has to be made.
When KREICH was offensively Liberated we had pages of screenshots that proved sever members of that region were engaged in anti-Semitic, racist, and homophobic jokes and discussions. This seemed to confirm earlier suspicions that KREICH was a secretly fascist/neo-Nazi region rather than being just an ode to pre-1919 Imperial Germany.
When this proof came out KREICH faced a choice. They could have admitted that they let toxic behaviour continue on, and that they were committed to stamping it out. They could have made a public show of punishing those responsible and denouncing such horrid beliefs.
Instead KREICH tried to excuse or justify that behaviour.

With FCN? I can see, again via New Waldensia’s evidence, that the horrid behaviour documented by Kavagrad’s evidence was opposed by FCN leadership, which ultimately prevailed in expelling the offending parties. And FCN managed this prior to this offensive Liberation being submitted.

It’s because of this that I cannot support an offensive Liberation against FCN. They let themselves get hamstrung by game mechanics when they shouldn’t have been, but they actively tried to oppose the horrid behaviour that was infecting their region. And ultimately succeeded.

To Kavagrad and others who support this resolution. I agree with the sentiment but I feel as if you’re targeting the wrong people. I would suggest looking into the Union of Conservative States, a region founded by the people responsible for the indefensible and horrid behaviour we saw in FCN after they were finally forced out.

[Prydania]

This "racism" you speak of them all having is a joke. It is a bunch of edgy dudes having a laugh together on a discord channel.

I’m gonna stop you right there.

Aside from the obvious “it was just a joke, bro!” defence fascists use when they get called out for their garbage? The fact remains that the behaviour isn’t funny to begin with.

“Edgy dudes” is just code for “asshole teenagers who don’t comprehend the totality of the bs they’re spewing.”
Now someone’s obviously failed them in the realm of education, but that doesn’t excuse them. Being a teen is about learning personal responsibility, and being “an edgy dude” isn’t really an excuse to sidestep that.
Going on about killing blacks, gays, and Jews because of “the jokes” isn’t funny. It’s not even a joke! It’s just being an ass. And while everyone has the right to be an ass? They also have the responsibility of facing consequences for being an ass.

And hey! FCN recognizes that, because they eventually pushed the offending parties out of their region. So huzzah. A win for decency.

Please take your edgelord behaviour and your piss-poor “jokes brah!” justification and go find another corner of the internet to squat in. K, thx.

[Chalanka]

I sneezed and it hurt. That's how dumb this resolution is....

[The Nexus Union]

I think its about time we let this proposal self destruct on its own rhetoric and stupidity. So much for "Spreading interregional peace and goodwill"

[Calamari]

Jokes, again? Alright - this one seems appropriate.

Q. When is a fascist joke about genocide not a joke?

A. When you agree with them.

Look, we know how this works by now, and the usual lies remain just that, lies. Yes, it probably did fool some people a while ago when you held up your hands and said "but... but I was just joking? Can't you take a joke?" Thing is, we know that's a massive lie now.

The standard cowardly tactic of fascists (or the alt-right - when your ideology is so toxic you have to rebrand it) is to crack edgy jokes. That way if someone acts as if they're upset or repulsed you get away with it, because it was just a joke. Of course, if someone laughs and even sounds like they start to agree then you know you've got a potential fellow fascist. I mean, it kinda worked for a while, but it's getting really old and really boring, to the extent that almost word for word this same exchange happened in pretty much every liberation of a fascist region.

I'm sure after posting a picture of a cross burning or whatever they did, they proceeded to dress in all white, hang minorities, and burn a cross in their hometown. A few hours later they were goose-stepping outside city hall and calling for an ethnostate.
Oh, they didn't? Then who cares. Let idiots be idiots, lest you risk them actually being radicalized.
By the way, I've spoken to Gagium before this. He has a damn Roblox profile picture on discord. This isn't a fourth reich in the making.

[Saranidia]

Jokes, again? Alright - this one seems appropriate.

Q. When is a fascist joke about genocide not a joke?

A. When you agree with them.

Look, we know how this works by now, and the usual lies remain just that, lies. Yes, it probably did fool some people a while ago when you held up your hands and said "but... but I was just joking? Can't you take a joke?" Thing is, we know that's a massive lie now.

The standard cowardly tactic of fascists (or the alt-right - when your ideology is so toxic you have to rebrand it) is to crack edgy jokes. That way if someone acts as if they're upset or repulsed you get away with it, because it was just a joke. Of course, if someone laughs and even sounds like they start to agree then you know you've got a potential fellow fascist. I mean, it kinda worked for a while, but it's getting really old and really boring, to the extent that almost word for word this same exchange happened in pretty much every liberation of a fascist region.

I'm sure after posting a picture of a cross burning or whatever they did, they proceeded to dress in all white, hang minorities, and burn a cross in their hometown. A few hours later they were goose-stepping outside city hall and calling for an ethnostate.
Oh, they didn't? Then who cares. Let idiots be idiots, lest you risk them actually being radicalized.
By the way, I've spoken to Gagium before this. He has a damn Roblox profile picture on discord. This isn't a fourth reich in the making.

Well Donald Trump was socially awkward also just because they haven’t now doesn’t mean they never will. But your right that there is no hard evidence of a 4th Reich.

[Quebecshire]

Couldn’t be prouder of how my region-mates are handling this.

This resolution continues to be full of pure useless rhetoric putting an innocent region in the crosshairs of the global (attempted) police. It’s failure thus far puts a smile on my face, so thank you to the World Assembly for giving me a needed one.

[Calamari]

I'm sure after posting a picture of a cross burning or whatever they did, they proceeded to dress in all white, hang minorities, and burn a cross in their hometown. A few hours later they were goose-stepping outside city hall and calling for an ethnostate.
Oh, they didn't? Then who cares. Let idiots be idiots, lest you risk them actually being radicalized.
By the way, I've spoken to Gagium before this. He has a damn Roblox profile picture on discord. This isn't a fourth reich in the making.

Well Donald Trump was socially awkward also just because they haven’t now doesn’t mean they never will. But your right that there is no hard evidence of a 4th Reich.

And if they do, they will be subject to the law. We don't punish people because they might do something wrong

[Definitely Not A Front For The Imperium]

Jokes, again? Alright - this one seems appropriate.

Q. When is a fascist joke about genocide not a joke?

A. When you agree with them.

Look, we know how this works by now, and the usual lies remain just that, lies. Yes, it probably did fool some people a while ago when you held up your hands and said "but... but I was just joking? Can't you take a joke?" Thing is, we know that's a massive lie now.

The standard cowardly tactic of fascists (or the alt-right - when your ideology is so toxic you have to rebrand it) is to crack edgy jokes. That way if someone acts as if they're upset or repulsed you get away with it, because it was just a joke. Of course, if someone laughs and even sounds like they start to agree then you know you've got a potential fellow fascist. I mean, it kinda worked for a while, but it's getting really old and really boring, to the extent that almost word for word this same exchange happened in pretty much every liberation of a fascist region.

Why would it make sense for somebody to mock their own ideology? Do you have any evidence whatsoever that they actually believe and act out their belief in their "sinister jokes." who would follow an ideology that considers itself a joke? That's shit rebranding.

[Glen-Rhodes]

Couldn’t be prouder of how my region-mates are handling this.

This resolution continues to be full of pure useless rhetoric putting an innocent region in the crosshairs of the global (attempted) police. It’s failure thus far puts a smile on my face, so thank you to the World Assembly for giving me a needed one.

Your regionmates said gay people should be sent to the gas chamber, and your founder casually chatted with them like it was no big deal. If I had access, I would be gathering all those message IDs and sending them to the Discord Trust & Safety team. In fact, anybody who does have access should do that: https://support.discordapp.com/hc/en-us ... ust-Safety

Anyone believing the sob story about how this region is changing needs to reassess their relationships. The screenshots floating around were barely 3.5 months old.

[The Nexus Union]

Couldn’t be prouder of how my region-mates are handling this.

This resolution continues to be full of pure useless rhetoric putting an innocent region in the crosshairs of the global (attempted) police. It’s failure thus far puts a smile on my face, so thank you to the World Assembly for giving me a needed one.

Your regionmates said gay people should be sent to the gas chamber, and your founder casually chatted with them like it was no big deal. If I had access, I would be gathering all those message IDs and sending them to the Discord Trust & Safety team. In fact, anybody who does have access should do that: https://support.discordapp.com/hc/en-us ... ust-Safety

Anyone believing the sob story about how this region is changing needs to reassess their relationships. The screenshots floating around were barely 3.5 months old.

what the hell kind of planet are you on?

[Caracasus]

Jokes, again? Alright - this one seems appropriate.

Q. When is a fascist joke about genocide not a joke?

A. When you agree with them.

Look, we know how this works by now, and the usual lies remain just that, lies. Yes, it probably did fool some people a while ago when you held up your hands and said "but... but I was just joking? Can't you take a joke?" Thing is, we know that's a massive lie now.

The standard cowardly tactic of fascists (or the alt-right - when your ideology is so toxic you have to rebrand it) is to crack edgy jokes. That way if someone acts as if they're upset or repulsed you get away with it, because it was just a joke. Of course, if someone laughs and even sounds like they start to agree then you know you've got a potential fellow fascist. I mean, it kinda worked for a while, but it's getting really old and really boring, to the extent that almost word for word this same exchange happened in pretty much every liberation of a fascist region.

Why would it make sense for somebody to mock their own ideology? Do you have any evidence whatsoever that they actually believe and act out their belief in their "sinister jokes." who would follow an ideology that considers itself a joke? That's shit rebranding.

Tell me about it, when the only defense of your ideology is that it's a joke, it's a really bad ideology.

[Quebecshire]

Couldn’t be prouder of how my region-mates are handling this.

This resolution continues to be full of pure useless rhetoric putting an innocent region in the crosshairs of the global (attempted) police. It’s failure thus far puts a smile on my face, so thank you to the World Assembly for giving me a needed one.

Your regionmates said gay people should be sent to the gas chamber, and your founder casually chatted with them like it was no big deal. If I had access, I would be gathering all those message IDs and sending them to the Discord Trust & Safety team. In fact, anybody who does have access should do that: https://support.discordapp.com/hc/en-us ... ust-Safety

Anyone believing the sob story about how this region is changing needs to reassess their relationships. The screenshots floating around were barely 3.5 months old.

Everything you just said was wrong for one simple reason. Check my forum signature. I figured you guys could at least commit to the rational argument to that degree.

[Definitely Not A Front For The Imperium]

Why would it make sense for somebody to mock their own ideology? Do you have any evidence whatsoever that they actually believe and act out their belief in their "sinister jokes." who would follow an ideology that considers itself a joke? That's shit rebranding.

Tell me about it, when the only defense of your ideology is that it's a joke, it's a really bad ideology.

Or maybe they don't actually believe in that ideology?

[Calamari]

Couldn’t be prouder of how my region-mates are handling this.

This resolution continues to be full of pure useless rhetoric putting an innocent region in the crosshairs of the global (attempted) police. It’s failure thus far puts a smile on my face, so thank you to the World Assembly for giving me a needed one.

Your regionmates said gay people should be sent to the gas chamber, and your founder casually chatted with them like it was no big deal. If I had access, I would be gathering all those message IDs and sending them to the Discord Trust & Safety team. In fact, anybody who does have access should do that: https://support.discordapp.com/hc/en-us ... ust-Safety

Anyone believing the sob story about how this region is changing needs to reassess their relationships. The screenshots floating around were barely 3.5 months old.

Discord is blocked on the network I'm on, but we have 2 openly gay people in our region that talks on discord with us, along with just about every ethnicity you could think of, Europeans, South Americans, Asians, Russians, Australians, Mormons, oh my!

I think you have the wrong region bud.

[XCOM Project]

Can everyone in this forum be blocked for spamming my WA with these little kid arguing resolution? At least if you want to make these jokes have the courage of using your real nation.

Nuff said.

[Kavagrad]

Can everyone in this forum be blocked for spamming my WA with these little kid arguing resolution? At least if you want to make these jokes have the courage of using your real nation.

Nuff said.

Oh damn, the owner of the WA is here to shut us all down.

Guess we're blocked.

Nuff said.

[The New Fandom Republic]

Couldn’t be prouder of how my region-mates are handling this.

This resolution continues to be full of pure useless rhetoric putting an innocent region in the crosshairs of the global (attempted) police. It’s failure thus far puts a smile on my face, so thank you to the World Assembly for giving me a needed one.

Your regionmates said gay people should be sent to the gas chamber, and your founder casually chatted with them like it was no big deal. If I had access, I would be gathering all those message IDs and sending them to the Discord Trust & Safety team. In fact, anybody who does have access should do that: https://support.discordapp.com/hc/en-us ... ust-Safety

Anyone believing the sob story about how this region is changing needs to reassess their relationships. The screenshots floating around were barely 3.5 months old.

Wow, you must be all the rage at parties. This proposal is inherently flawed considering the fact it's using off site stuff as evidence. That's the equivalent of prosecuting someone for murder over a joke about murder meant for the ears of friends. Also just admit you got a problem with edgy jokes and let this proposal burn, because honestly you're not doing yourself any favors by supporting a proposal that would set a bad precedent for future liberations.

[United Massachusetts]

Couldn’t be prouder of how my region-mates are handling this.

This resolution continues to be full of pure useless rhetoric putting an innocent region in the crosshairs of the global (attempted) police. It’s failure thus far puts a smile on my face, so thank you to the World Assembly for giving me a needed one.

Your regionmates said gay people should be sent to the gas chamber, and your founder casually chatted with them like it was no big deal. If I had access, I would be gathering all those message IDs and sending them to the Discord Trust & Safety team. In fact, anybody who does have access should do that: https://support.discordapp.com/hc/en-us ... ust-Safety

Anyone believing the sob story about how this region is changing needs to reassess their relationships. The screenshots floating around were barely 3.5 months old.

A lot has happened in FCN since them. I'd give New Wald a chance, because he just talked to me about repealing a law enacted by the far-right (now gone, for the most part) elements which established ridiculously widespread "free speech" protections. It looks like FCN is handling this seriously and professionally.

But yes, the posts in question should be reported.

Also, Quebecshire isn't in FCN. He's in the League of Conservative Nations, or LCN. Totally different regions.

[Kavagrad]

Your regionmates said gay people should be sent to the gas chamber, and your founder casually chatted with them like it was no big deal. If I had access, I would be gathering all those message IDs and sending them to the Discord Trust & Safety team. In fact, anybody who does have access should do that: https://support.discordapp.com/hc/en-us ... ust-Safety

Anyone believing the sob story about how this region is changing needs to reassess their relationships. The screenshots floating around were barely 3.5 months old.

Wow, you must be all the rage at parties. This proposal is inherently flawed considering the fact it's using off site stuff as evidence. That's the equivalent of prosecuting someone for murder over a joke about murder meant for the ears of friends. Also just admit you got a problem with edgy jokes and let this proposal burn, because honestly you're not doing yourself any favors by supporting a proposal that would set a bad precedent for future liberations.

There is a precedent for offensive liberations on the basis of off-site behaviour. It's not setting a precedent, it's following one.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

Your regionmates said gay people should be sent to the gas chamber, and your founder casually chatted with them like it was no big deal. If I had access, I would be gathering all those message IDs and sending them to the Discord Trust & Safety team. In fact, anybody who does have access should do that: https://support.discordapp.com/hc/en-us ... ust-Safety

Anyone believing the sob story about how this region is changing needs to reassess their relationships. The screenshots floating around were barely 3.5 months old.

A lot has happened in FCN since them. I'd give New Wald a chance, because he just talked to me about repealing a law enacted by the far-right (now gone, for the most part) elements which established ridiculously widespread "free speech" protections. It looks like FCN is handling this seriously and professionally.

But yes, the posts in question should be reported.

Also, Quebecshire isn't in FCN. He's in the League of Conservative Nations, or LCN. Totally different regions.

I never see harm in speech.

[Eminople]

This resolution is complete and utter nonsense. The LCN and I have have great relations with the FCN and have been in the FCN's discord for forever. The FCN isn't racist nor are they fascist. If they do make a fascist/racist comment it will be a joke in which most people don't agree with but find it funny. Now of course there will be those outliers but every region has those. This resolution is clearly either a plot to make a great region seem bad and racist or just someone who got pissed off that they were kicked out. I'm very disappointed that the WA has now become a place of bs resolutions where people try to ruin a good region. My regionmates can also stand by me on this because a man by the name of Nagarno tried the same thing against the LCN (It wasn't about racist comments though).

[Sperio]

*starts to tear up.

I can’t tell you how happy I am that the world is final taking a stand against the flux of liberation abuse.

[Quebecshire]

Wow, you must be all the rage at parties. This proposal is inherently flawed considering the fact it's using off site stuff as evidence. That's the equivalent of prosecuting someone for murder over a joke about murder meant for the ears of friends. Also just admit you got a problem with edgy jokes and let this proposal burn, because honestly you're not doing yourself any favors by supporting a proposal that would set a bad precedent for future liberations.

There is a precedent for offensive liberations on the basis of off-site behaviour. It's not setting a precedent, it's following one.

If a Libertion is going to be used offensively it should be to handle a legitimate and common threat to the NationStates community, and even so it should be more diplomatic for affairs in the WA. This isn’t that. This is you targeting a region just because you don’t like it. This is, as my Prime Minister said, complete and utter nonsense.