[PASSED] Commend The MT Army

[New Villin]

No need to be rude now. You are just mistakenly assuming they are RP fascists, and don't know the history of the region your defending.

Again, irrelevant to the facts. Do you have an aversion to reason?

If you think my comment is rude, perhaps you are actively seeking insults. Perhaps this is the root of your reason-free emotional responses. If you are constantly seeking insults, you will no doubt find them. If I was intentionally insulting you, it would not be ambiguous.

Rather than clog up the message board with my repeated examples of your lack of anything but heresay, errors of reason and emotional rationale, I will accept that you have no basis for argument (as you have clearly demonstrated beyond question) and refrain from indulging you further. Thank you.

[The Stalker]

Again rude. Do your own research. Nazi Europa/e is a raider Nazi region who destroyed a bunch of regions. Including raiding my region Hell, ejected 40 something nations.

You think everyone who destroyed them should be condemned? That includes the North Pacific, the East Pacific, and a dozen others. Go look; Nazi Europe

I don't know why I bothered, since you so blindly wanna defend not knowing anything about them.

[Ransium]

To echo Wrapper, just about everyone in this thread really needs to tone down the personal attacks and rhetoric, as well as avoid discussion of RL antifa and fascism, which belongs elsewhere.

[Kassimo]

I will avoid NSG political debate in my replies, but I'm open to telegrams if anyone wants to discuss the politics of my previous post.

But using violence to achieve your goals shows the hypocrisy of your ideals ... [snip]

In this context, the 'violence' is raiding. We [Antifa] are anti-fascist, not anti-raider. We oppose fascist regions not because they raid, nor because they use force against their enemies; we oppose them, rather, on an political level (debate about which belongs in NSG or telegrams) and because this is a political simulator game we are acting out our political role of militant anti-fascism through the game mechanic of raiding. If you are opposed to raiding, then your rejection of The MT Army is understandable. But equating raiding with fascism is in poor taste.

If you want fight fascists, use what they fear most. Democracy. If you want to help them, use their favorite tool. Violence. [snip]

The effectiveness of militant anti-fascism over liberal tolerance (purely in the context of this game) is demonstrated by the current strength and unity of Antifa and the NSLeft, and the current weakness of fascist regions.

Maintaining a force for over fourteen years in this game is a remarkable feat, especially considering that it is a solid group of players, not just the name of an organisation, that has lived on. But what makes this dedication commendable is their unwavering commitment to their ideal: resisting the forces of fascism.

Why is this important? This is not the real world ... [snip]

Hence my referring to "players" in this "game". This is a political simulator game where political stances such as militant anti-fascism are very much relevant.

[snip]...this is a game where people can experiment with a broad political spectrum. Would you call for all pro-fascist (however you like to define it) issues to be purged and the far right be removed as a possible destination within the game?

I am not in favour of game admins/moderators banning fascism from the game if that's what you mean. (Speaking only for myself). Players should be free to build fascist regions, and we are free to raid them.

Maintaining a force for over fourteen years

Except the MT Army haven't, if you'd have taken the time to look at their WFE. They raided in the mid-2000s, and then for about a year from mid-2012, and then the summer of 2014, and then since September 2016. That is, all in all, about four-and-a-half years of raiding - hardly the "fourteen" you claim it to be. The MT Army has been theoretically existent for the past fourteen-and-a-half years, but they have barely been active for a third of that period.

My statement was inaccurate, I apologise.

But you aren't fighting fascists. You're ruining roleplay for someone else in a virtual country videogame.

We are roleplaying (using gameplay mechanics) fighting fascism in a virtual country videogame. And as a side note, the raiding is mutual, NationStates' fascist regions are not poor, innocent victims (although their current weakness does give that image, granted ).

[RiderSyl]

Again rude. Do your own research. Nazi Europa/e is a raider Nazi region who destroyed a bunch of regions. Including raiding my region Hell, ejected 40 something nations.

You think everyone who destroyed them should be condemned? That includes the North Pacific, the East Pacific, and a dozen others. Go look; Nazi Europe

I don't know why I bothered, since you so blindly wanna defend not knowing anything about them.

I can confirm that what Stalker's been saying. I was a raider back when Nazi Europe fell, and a Lieutenant in the The Black Riders. The Black Riders were one of the participating militaries, despite being unlisted on the WFE.

[Captain Woodhouse]

Do your own research.

The Black Riders were one of the participating militaries, despite being unlisted on the WFE.

Maybe TBR ain't credited because they're considered at least as odious as NE, ya think?

You really don't want to recommend that anyone do any research here. They might learn that Proletaurus, aka Cora, founded Antifa and handed it to his dear friend, Vippertooth33. All kinds of nasty assumptions are made in this game. Wouldn't want anyone connecting Vip to Cora.

[*]protecting the legacy of antifascist action in the world, including helping to maintain the region Genesis Defense Project

GDP doesn't require help maintaining their region. They're very much alive and kicking in the game. GDP HMS Dover paid a visit to my RMB this morning to call my members losers and neo-Nazis, among other things.

Vip's pup is in GDP because he's as much GDP as he is Antifa and MT. He supports everything they do, including trolling non-fascist regions. The three orgs are separated only in the far Left’s imagination.

[RiderSyl]

Maybe TBR ain't credited because they're considered at least as odious as NE, ya think?

Nope. This is one of those things that I can comment on with first-hand knowledge of. At the time of the Nazi Europe operation, TBR's reputation wasn't anywhere close to that of NE's. The reason it wasn't credited was because TNP's military didn't want to be seen associating with what was the largest raider organization in the game.

The fact regions were willing to work with TBR to take down NE shows that, when the target is a fascist region, the status quo goes out the window.

You really don't want to recommend that anyone do any research here. They might learn that Proletaurus, aka Cora, founded Antifa and handed it to his dear friend, Vippertooth33. All kinds of nasty assumptions are made in this game. Wouldn't want anyone connecting Vip to Cora.

I'm sure you're very concerned for Vippertooth33..

[The Eden of the East]

Question: Would you commend a region that has invaded another region because it had the tag Communist and an embassy with a Communist region? If not then on what basis are you doing the reverse?
An example after a "mt army site:nationstates.net/region" search, there are possibly better ones out there among the plethora of results.
https://www.nationstates.net/region=gra ... onary_army
"Territory of The MT Army!!!

Captured: 07.11.14

This region was an allly and supporter of Nazism, having embassies with The Greater German Reich.

It was captured by the Mighty Anti-Fascist Warriors of The MT Army.

Hate mongering will not be tolerated by the truly free people of this world. We cannot allow hate to spread to the young and impressionable of society, because it will only hurt/slow the progression of humanity in the long run.

Previous WFE: LinkLink

We are ANTIFA and we are everywhere!

Vippertooth33: The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do nothing!"

https://web.archive.org/web/20141018035 ... onary_army
"Welcome to the Grand Revolutionary Army!
Join the World Assembly and enlist in our military.
Or, for non-WA join the Parliament and tell the king what the people want.
Fight in the Revolutionary Front!
King: The Francoist Empire

11
Treaty of the Greater Regional Alliance

Bulletin → Policy by The New Jewish State of Sivania 11 days ago. 225 reads.
1
Constitution of the Grand Revolutionary Army

Factbook → Politics by The Francoist Empire 51 days ago. 20 reads.

Embassies: The Revolutionary Council, Zionist Empire, Eastern Roman Empire, the Greater German Reich, Greater Regional Alliance, The Germanei Sivanian Alliance, Markarth, Crusaders of Justice, The Greater Regional Alliance, and The Judean League.

Tags: Industrial, Fascist, Monarchist, Independent, Mercenary, Conservative, Regional Government, Human-Only, Democratic, Totalitarian, Defender, International Federalist, and 7 others.

Grand Revolutionary Army contains 2 nations."

[Bears Armed]

But you aren't fighting fascists. You're ruining roleplay for someone else in a virtual country videogame.

Stop taking yourself so serious.

Lol most far right regions are fill with with far right people, fascists and Nazis are on this game.

If you wanna role play, you can join a role playing region.

As far as Nazi Europe goes, everyone was involved in their destruction. They are a Nazi raider region filled with actual racist.

Any comment that begins "Lol" is probably not worth reading.

[The Stalker]

Lol most far right regions are fill with with far right people, fascists and Nazis are on this game.

If you wanna role play, you can join a role playing region.

As far as Nazi Europe goes, everyone was involved in their destruction. They are a Nazi raider region filled with actual racist.

Any comment that begins "Lol" is probably not worth reading.

But apparently worth commenting on? Do you disagree with my assessment of NE or are you just being snide?

[Main]

Voting Against because of the section about them being partly responsible for the creation of the Red Fleet, which raided (and not just a tag raid) Ireland several months ago because of two embassies that didn't conform with their standards. I strongly oppose oppression in the name of liberation.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

I am fundamentally against this resolution, and any resolution that is commending so-called 'antifascists.'

These regions use politics as a thin layer of varnish to attempt to clean up their regular destruction of innocent regional communities that posed no threat to them, and which had no alignment in the r/d game. While other regions often simply tag-raid, antifa operations are almost always done with the objective of the complete destruction of the region in question, and the community that was created by it. I participated in the rather desperate defence of Nazi Europe when it was being targeted by many of the worlds so-called 'progressive' regions, and what I joined for the brief time I did was not a hate-filled region, it was a region that wished simply to stay alive. I'm not a fascist, or a Nazi, I believe in free speech and freedom of expression, and that is why I cannot in good conscience support the commendation of an organisation that supports stifling that.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

Voting Against because of the section about them being partly responsible for the creation of the Red Fleet, which raided (and not just a tag raid) Ireland several months ago because of two embassies that didn't conform with their standards. I strongly oppose oppression in the name of liberation.

Sorry for the double post.
These regions also raided several regions that I was in in the past, admittedly after I had left them. They weren't Nazi regions, or fascist ones, they were simply rp regions.

[The Wallenburgian World Assembly Offices]

We're commending raiders now?

[United Massachusetts]

We're commending raiders now?

We already do. "Commend 'The Red Fleet.'"

Furthermore, this proposal is basically Commend TRF 2.0.

[Caelapes]

Furthermore, this proposal is basically Commend TRF 2.0.

It isn't, no matter how much you keep saying that.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

Furthermore, this proposal is basically Commend TRF 2.0.

It isn't, no matter how much you keep saying that.

If you would like to prove to the world that the mt army/trf/whatever other name Antifa wants to use this week is a force for good and not simply a raider region, please give me control of the following two regions:

Kolovo
Alliance of the axis powers

Neither of these regions was fascist, despite the latter regions rather interesting name, and both were highly important in the creation of the region of Global powers, a region which I was a long term resident of. I will preserve the regions and detail what their roles were in the creation of global powers.

However...I believe I asked you to do this 4 years ago and you ignored me even when I could present proof that they weren't Nazi/fascist regions, so I'm not holding out much hope given that you're just another raider group.

[Caelapes]

However...I believe I asked you to do this 4 years ago and you ignored me even when I could present proof that they weren't Nazi/fascist regions, so I'm not holding out much hope given that you're just another raider group.

Alliance of Axis Powers openly admitted to being a fascist region:

http://udl.taijitu.org/wfe_index/?allia ... 2011-03-09

Not to mention the fact that the only Archive.org snapshot of the region prior to its seizure by The MT Army features the in-construction embassy with GGR:

https://web.archive.org/web/20110322200 ... xis_powers

As for Kolovo, that's a holding of The Red Fleet and irrelevant to the MT Army.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

However...I believe I asked you to do this 4 years ago and you ignored me even when I could present proof that they weren't Nazi/fascist regions, so I'm not holding out much hope given that you're just another raider group.

Alliance of Axis Powers openly admitted to being a fascist region:

http://udl.taijitu.org/wfe_index/?allia ... 2011-03-09

Not to mention the fact that the only Archive.org snapshot of the region prior to its seizure by The MT Army features the in-construction embassy with GGR:

https://web.archive.org/web/20110322200 ... xis_powers

As for Kolovo, that's a holding of The Red Fleet and irrelevant to the MT Army.

Whoever used the name following our leaving of it, we'd like it back, please.

[The Grand Puffle Republic]

I am in support.

When did you change your mind? You sent out mass TGs against the Commendation.

[RiderSyl]

I am in support.

When did you change your mind? You sent out mass TGs against the Commendation.

You misunderstand. Sending mass TG's against a Commendation is the quickest way to churn out FOR votes.

[Tribe of Rinos]

I refuse to commend a region with the word “Army” in it.

[Scotrun]

Fascism accusations (both real and unfounded) aside, you are using raiding to suppress the political opinions of other nations and regions. Neither do you even define what makes a nation "fascist". Is it being just left wing of full on communism? Is all right wing ideology considered fascist?

This is an thinly veiled attempt to have the WA endorse a militant communist region that raids others not even affiliated with the r/d mechanics of modern raiding.

Militant Anti-Fascism is admirable when in retaliation to raiding, but apparently even peaceful "fascist" regions are given the green light for anti fascists to raid and eject everyone who is a supposed "fascist."

If you didn't already infer, I am against this resolution because it encourages the Anti-Facist movement to continue to target both peaceful and r/d right wing nations to institute Communiam and destroy them.

[Fauxia]

Fascism accusations (both real and unfounded) aside, you are using raiding to suppress the political opinions of other nations and regions. Neither do you even define what makes a nation "fascist". Is it being just left wing of full on communism? Is all right wing ideology considered fascist?

This is an thinly veiled attempt to have the WA endorse a militant communist region that raids others not even affiliated with the r/d mechanics of modern raiding.

Militant Anti-Fascism is admirable when in retaliation to raiding, but apparently even peaceful "fascist" regions are given the green light for anti fascists to raid and eject everyone who is a supposed "fascist."

If you didn't already infer, I am against this resolution because it encourages the Anti-Facist movement to continue to target both peaceful and r/d right wing nations to institute Communiam and destroy them.

The Red Fleet is a militant communist region already commended

For the most part, TRF is antifascist, but it is a left-wing region and some of its actions haven’t been entirely antifascist

[Indera Kayangan]

A vote AGAINST is just perfect for a bunch of warmongering thugs hiding behind their mask of "anti-fascism".