[DEFEATED] Condemn The Order of the Grey Wardens

[Shizensky]

I really don't care about that 96.5% number or whatever it actually is. Even if they just dropped in on a Warzone I wouldn't care too much. But TGW is making a pattern out of complaining about regions in the forums for BS reasons (or none at all), and then using that as a pretext to trash them. That is wrong. That, and they keep using Kurnugia to trash talk Kaiserreich, even though he never claimed anything about Nazism until they poached him from his rebellion (which had nothing to do with ideology).

Here we see the author admitting that the content of the proposal has very little to do with the goal of the proposal, but that the contents serve to do little more than mask the fact that this proposal is guided by something as simplistic as a grudge. While this has been clear to others since the onset of this discussion, I do applaud the author for making this point clear to those who are not as up to date on current events.

[Bhang Bhang Duc]

It's been submitted. Here's hoping it fails to make quorum, but even if it does it's going to get stomped.

[Witchcraft and Sorcery]

you know, I'm not even mad at this point. I'll just sit in a corner, silently laughing to myself.

At least it might give me a chance to test my repeal chops, should it manage to pass at all.

[Benevolent Thomas]

why repeal it though?

[Witchcraft and Sorcery]

You know, you've got a very good point. They say laughing is good for your health.

[Cresenthia]

You know, you've got a very good point. They say laughing is good for your health.

Until the laughing chokes you to death.

[Drasnia]

Shocked that when these actions were pointed out, The Grey Wardens denied such claims, calling them “fake news.”

This is just one example of alternative facts! SAD!

[Cresenthia]

Shocked that when these actions were pointed out, The Grey Wardens denied such claims, calling them “fake news.”

This is just one example of alternative facts! SAD!

viewtopic.php?p=31602906#p31602906

[United States of Vietnam]

You know very well that this is going to fail catastrophically, right?

[Drasnia]

Shocked that when these actions were pointed out, The Grey Wardens denied such claims, calling them “fake news.”

This is just one example of alternative facts! SAD!

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The Joke
________

Your Head

[Roavin]

Shocked that when these actions were pointed out, The Grey Wardens denied such claims, calling them “fake news.”

This is just one example of alternative facts! SAD!

viewtopic.php?p=31602906#p31602906

Welcome to class. Today's lesson is a case study in how to do reading comprehension wrong. Let's look at this:

Shocked that when these actions were pointed out, The Grey Wardens denied such claims, calling them “fake news.”

"these actions" referring to:
(1) Femdom Empire raid - yep, we did that.
(2) Griefing Super Reich I - yep, we (as part of a larger group) did that.
(3) Pissing off KAISERREICH - yep, we're doing that (and this is proof!)
(4) Invading Warzone Europe - yep, we did that.

So what were we calling "fake news"? Well, see https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?p=31589017#p31589017 here, where our wonderful Chamberlain acknowledges that we did all of these things that you're complaining about (and more), and despite doing all of that, defensive operations are 97.56% of what we do.

Sometimes, it's easier to understand visually:



So, given that,...

You assumed that they are indeed defenders, a premise which clearly is not accepted by all parties.

[Cresenthia]

viewtopic.php?p=31602906#p31602906

Welcome to class. Today's lesson is a case study in how to do reading comprehension wrong. Let's look at this:

Shocked that when these actions were pointed out, The Grey Wardens denied such claims, calling them “fake news.”

"these actions" referring to:
(1) Femdom Empire raid - yep, we did that.
(2) Griefing Super Reich I - yep, we (as part of a larger group) did that.
(3) Pissing off KAISERREICH - yep, we're doing that (and this is proof!)
(4) Invading Warzone Europe - yep, we did that.

So what were we calling "fake news"? Well, see https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?p=31589017#p31589017 here, where our wonderful Chamberlain acknowledges that we did all of these things that you're complaining about (and more), and despite doing all of that, defensive operations are 97.56% of what we do.

Sometimes, it's easier to understand visually:



So, given that,...

You assumed that they are indeed defenders, a premise which clearly is not accepted by all parties.

I don't think anyone said that you aren't defending at all. But your claim that Super Reich I was a Nazi region is a load of baloney. At the time it was being held by Femdom forces primarily. Let me guess: Femdom is a Nazi region because NE stepped in after CAIN got involved. And CAIN got involved because Kaiserreich was defending Femdom? So, let me get this straight:

1. Femdom loses their founder, and calls in Kaiserreich to help.
2. Kaiserreich starts defending Femdom so a password can be established to help the natives, but CAIN starts attacking.
3. NE joins in at this opportunity to fight CAIN.
4. Presuming that Femdom was Nazi because NE got involved (when they just came in to score cheap points against CAIN), TGW and CAIN attack SRI.

Really, your problem is with Nazi Europa and actual fascist regions. But still, you might claim that you only had 12 non-defender actions, but they are still contrary to your supposed mission to fight Darkspawn. Is it really your argument that there are so few invader actions that they are irrelevant? The saying about a cup of piss in a barrel of wine comes to mind.

[Nakari]

I don't think anyone said that you aren't defending at all. But your claim that Super Reich I was a Nazi region is a load of baloney. At the time it was being held by Femdom forces primarily. Let me guess: Femdom is a Nazi region because NE stepped in after CAIN got involved. And CAIN got involved because Kaiserreich was defending Femdom? So, let me get this straight:

1. Femdom loses their founder, and calls in Kaiserreich to help.
2. Kaiserreich starts defending Femdom so a password can be established to help the natives, but CAIN starts attacking.
3. NE joins in at this opportunity to fight CAIN.
4. Presuming that Femdom was Nazi because NE got involved (when they just came in to score cheap points against CAIN), TGW and CAIN attack SRI.

Really, your problem is with Nazi Europa and actual fascist regions. But still, you might claim that you only had 12 non-defender actions, but they are still contrary to your supposed mission to fight Darkspawn. Is it really your argument that there are so few invader actions that they are irrelevant? The saying about a cup of piss in a barrel of wine comes to mind.

Not straight enough.

1. Femdom loses their founder.
2. TGW attack because Femdom is a raider region.
3. Kaiserreich and NE get involved to pile on Femdom.
4. CAIN get involved to work against NE and Kaiserreich.
5. When SRI is piled on by raider regions, it is therefore working with/valued by them, therefore both fascist and raider aligned - a legitimate target.

Our mission is to fight darkspawn. Our non-defender actions were mainly to invade raider regions. Fighting darkspawn = invading raider regions.

[Cresenthia]

I don't think anyone said that you aren't defending at all. But your claim that Super Reich I was a Nazi region is a load of baloney. At the time it was being held by Femdom forces primarily. Let me guess: Femdom is a Nazi region because NE stepped in after CAIN got involved. And CAIN got involved because Kaiserreich was defending Femdom? So, let me get this straight:

1. Femdom loses their founder, and calls in Kaiserreich to help.
2. Kaiserreich starts defending Femdom so a password can be established to help the natives, but CAIN starts attacking.
3. NE joins in at this opportunity to fight CAIN.
4. Presuming that Femdom was Nazi because NE got involved (when they just came in to score cheap points against CAIN), TGW and CAIN attack SRI.

Really, your problem is with Nazi Europa and actual fascist regions. But still, you might claim that you only had 12 non-defender actions, but they are still contrary to your supposed mission to fight Darkspawn. Is it really your argument that there are so few invader actions that they are irrelevant? The saying about a cup of piss in a barrel of wine comes to mind.

Not straight enough.

1. Femdom loses their founder.
2. TGW attack because Femdom is a raider region.
3. Kaiserreich and NE get involved to pile on Femdom.
4. CAIN get involved to work against NE and Kaiserreich.
5. When SRI is piled on by raider regions, it is therefore working with/valued by them, therefore both fascist and raider aligned - a legitimate target.

Our mission is to fight darkspawn. Our non-defender actions were mainly to invade raider regions. Fighting darkspawn = invading raider regions.

Raider, perhaps. But NE never played a role in SRI, so any claim that it was fascist is nothing short of bullshit. And it was entirely framed at the time as anti-fascist, not anti-invader. Actually get your story straight before telling me it is.

[Kurnugia]

Not straight enough.

1. Femdom loses their founder.
2. TGW attack because Femdom is a raider region.
3. Kaiserreich and NE get involved to pile on Femdom.
4. CAIN get involved to work against NE and Kaiserreich.
5. When SRI is piled on by raider regions, it is therefore working with/valued by them, therefore both fascist and raider aligned - a legitimate target.

Our mission is to fight darkspawn. Our non-defender actions were mainly to invade raider regions. Fighting darkspawn = invading raider regions.

Raider, perhaps. But NE never played a role in SRI, so any claim that it was fascist is nothing short of bullshit. And it was entirely framed at the time as anti-fascist, not anti-invader. Actually get your story straight before telling me it is.

You forgot that KReich is widely seen as fascist so....

[The Gipper]

1. Femdom loses their founder, and calls in Kaiserreich to help.
2. Kaiserreich starts defending Femdom so a password can be established to help the natives, but CAIN starts attacking.
3. NE joins in at this opportunity to fight CAIN.
4. Presuming that Femdom was Nazi because NE got involved (when they just came in to score cheap points against CAIN), TGW and CAIN attack SRI.

Did the natives attempt to prevent NE from supporting them when they tried? If not, I don't see how anyone can complain.

The lesson that Nazi/Fascist regions are going to bring more enemies into a situation than they can bring troops. Which is the point in doing so, I'd assume, so people are discouraged from turning to radical groups for help.

[Kurnugia]

1. Femdom loses their founder, and calls in Kaiserreich to help.
2. Kaiserreich starts defending Femdom so a password can be established to help the natives, but CAIN starts attacking.
3. NE joins in at this opportunity to fight CAIN.
4. Presuming that Femdom was Nazi because NE got involved (when they just came in to score cheap points against CAIN), TGW and CAIN attack SRI.

Did the natives attempt to prevent NE from supporting them when they tried? If not, I don't see how anyone can complain.

The lesson that Nazi/Fascist regions are going to bring more enemies into a situation than they can bring troops. Which is the point in doing so, I'd assume, so people are discouraged from turning to radical groups for help.

I was a footsoldier in the Femdom defence. As far as I am aware no.

[Cresenthia]

Did the natives attempt to prevent NE from supporting them when they tried? If not, I don't see how anyone can complain.

The lesson that Nazi/Fascist regions are going to bring more enemies into a situation than they can bring troops. Which is the point in doing so, I'd assume, so people are discouraged from turning to radical groups for help.

I was a footsoldier in the Femdom defence. As far as I am aware no.

There is no way of knowing what Eskvor has done now that he is so inactive, but neither the Reichstag, the Chancellor, nor the Kaiser requested the support of any fascist forces. It is possible that Femdom requested support from fascists, but at that point, we were already committed to their support (through a contract that they ended up breaking I might add).

[Tim-Opolis]

I for one encourage all of our friends with high delegate endorsements to vote FOR this proposal.

[Bhang Bhang Duc]

I for one encourage all of our friends with high delegate endorsements to vote FOR this proposal.

Really? Why should we give a fascist a badge?

Edit: sorry fascist apologist.

[Witchcraft and Sorcery]

Really it's more for the lolz than anything else. I personally don't care one way or the other - if it passes, whatever. If not... well, it's a really poorly written resolution that totally ignores any semblance of the facts.

[Drop Your Pants]

I for one encourage all of our friends with high delegate endorsements to vote FOR this proposal.

And those regions who don't need asking go on the big list of 'Nah not defending you today'

[Lenlyvit]

I'm just gonna drop this here..... https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=730159
Proof of KREICH Protektorates fallen to Jadny's hand.........................

[Cresenthia]

I'm just gonna drop this here..... https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=730159
Proof of KREICH Protektorates fallen to Jadny's hand.........................

I'm not sure why this is news to anyone.

[Tim-Opolis]

I for one encourage all of our friends with high delegate endorsements to vote FOR this proposal.

Really? Why should we give a fascist a badge?

Edit: sorry fascist apologist.

Oh, I just think it would be hilarious if we got the Condemnation badge, with how much flak we get for being "unsportsmanlike" and "mean" towards raiders.

For the sake of the Security Council, though, I really would rather this ultimately fails. We already had to deal with one awful resolution this month, I don't think we'd survive a second one.