[DEFEATED] Liberate Antalia

[Aimdar-Goomdar]

Curious to see how you take the forums and visiting them for granted.

The natives of Antalia are incapable of visiting and posting on the NS forums? If they have such an issue, you should probably start a thread in the Technical forum for them so the site admin can sort it out, since you seem to be their spokesperson.

You have not addressed any points that I have made about your proposal. If you having any problems responding, I urge you to head to the Technical forum so any issues you have can be fixed.

Parsons appears, chuckling, round the corner from the General Assembly, 'Turns out the gnomes don't play tug-of-war over regions when Liberations are passed'.

It is actually us marsupials who do this. We pull all the strings.

No.

It seems that you do not have knowledge of nations who simply don't know about or are used to using the forums.

[Imperium Anglorum]

I am Delegate of Europe. I can eject some reasonably high number of nations before my influence runs out. On the other hand, EuroFounder, the Founder of Europe, could eject everyone tomorrow, password the region, and there is literally nothing you can do about it within the game mechanics. Natives do not mean diddly-squat compared to the Founder. They should only come into the picture when the region is founder-less.

Even ignoring the criticism which Mikeswill has levied at the SC for ages, talking about how the SC is basically just a way for defenders to up-end the rules of the game when they lose, the fact that this region is not passworded and, with an active founder, quite secure, means that you and anyone else can take a walk down the road to this Anatalia and free it today. The fact you've instead gone to the Security Council instead of embarking on a overwhelmingly likely to succeed one-man mission to save this region you ostensibly care so much about is why people are saying this is a badge hunt.

I hate the phrase badge-hunt. It is often used to malign the motives of new authors and dodge having to talk about a proposal's merits. But with this proposal, there are no merits. This proposal is basically pointless and the plain obviousness of the solution to this oversold crisis is why people are claiming this is a badge-hunt. I'm inclined to agree.

To vote in favour of this thing, I need to believe in so many conspiracies, manipulations, and plots that the arguments in favour of this thing are closer to 9/11 truther conspiracy theories than anything remotely resembling the truth.

[Neo Libertalius]

How could someone not know about (or how to use, for that matter. This site's organization isn't much different from many other forums) the forum when there is a thing in the sidebar that lists forum topics, a button that leads directly to the forums, and even a "Debate this resolution in the Security Council forum." button by the actual vote itself?

I find that to be a bit of a stretch, honestly. Even if a nation does not actively post, they're still most likely aware of the existence of forums, especially this specific one.

[East Chimore]

A security council resolution to break down delegate imposed password on Altalia.

Proposal by Aimdar-Goomdar

Acknowledging Imperialist Battalions' invasion of Antalia, a small but growing region;

Observing that the native Founder of Antalia, The Incorporated States of CyanX, has done nothing to protect the region;

Alarmed by the fact that the misinformed natives seem to be inadvertently supporting the Imperialist Battalions' occupation of their region unknowingly;

Fearing that Imperialist Battalions' occupation of Antalia may potentially lead to regional destruction;

Anticipating that without Security Council intervention, Antalia may become irreversibly refounded into Imperialist Battalions' control;

Hereby Liberates Antalia.

[Imperium Anglorum]

While confusing, it's been posted: viewtopic.php?f=24&t=397587

[Aimdar-Goomdar]

While confusing, it's been posted: viewtopic.php?f=24&t=397587

Yes, though I don't have control over that thread.

[Aimdar-Goomdar]

I am Delegate of Europe. I can eject some reasonably high number of nations before my influence runs out. On the other hand, EuroFounder, the Founder of Europe, could eject everyone tomorrow, password the region, and there is literally nothing you can do about it within the game mechanics. Natives do not mean diddly-squat compared to the Founder. They should only come into the picture when the region is founder-less.

Even ignoring the criticism which Mikeswill has levied at the SC for ages, talking about how the SC is basically just a way for defenders to up-end the rules of the game when they lose, the fact that this region is not passworded and, with an active founder, quite secure, means that you and anyone else can take a walk down the road to this Anatalia and free it today. The fact you've instead gone to the Security Council instead of embarking on a overwhelmingly likely to succeed one-man mission to save this region you ostensibly care so much about is why people are saying this is a badge hunt.

I hate the phrase badge-hunt. It is often used to malign the motives of new authors and dodge having to talk about a proposal's merits. But with this proposal, there are no merits. This proposal is basically pointless and the plain obviousness of the solution to this oversold crisis is why people are claiming this is a badge-hunt. I'm inclined to agree.

To vote in favour of this thing, I need to believe in so many conspiracies, manipulations, and plots that the arguments in favour of this thing are closer to 9/11 truther conspiracy theories than anything remotely resembling the truth.

Yes; I would definitely endorse the nations that support the current invading Delegate. Of course.

And secondly: the Founder is pretty much a rubber stamp at this point. He hasn't even reacted to the invading organization's poll of "What should we do with this region?" and has even endorsed the invading Delegate. I do believe that is cause for concern.

How could someone not know about (or how to use, for that matter. This site's organization isn't much different from many other forums) the forum when there is a thing in the sidebar that lists forum topics, a button that leads directly to the forums, and even a "Debate this resolution in the Security Council forum." button by the actual vote itself?

I find that to be a bit of a stretch, honestly. Even if a nation does not actively post, they're still most likely aware of the existence of forums, especially this specific one.

Many nations simply answer issues and don't even click on the "Forums" tab.

[The Marsupial Illuminati]

No.

It seems that you do not have knowledge of nations who simply don't know about or are used to using the forums.

Oh my! They don't know how to use the forums! Well, since I'm such a kind person, I sent all the native nations in Antalia (those in the region before the raid) a telegram explaining how to use the forums:

Now, the nations of Antalia are well-equipped with the insider knowledge needed to use this incredibly complicated forum site. They can now tell their stories of the oppression and immense fear that they experienced during the raid of their region.

[Aimdar-Goomdar]

No.

It seems that you do not have knowledge of nations who simply don't know about or are used to using the forums.

Oh my! They don't know how to use the forums! Well, since I'm such a kind person, I sent all the native nations in Antalia (those in the region before the raid) a telegram explaining how to use the forums:

Now, the nations of Antalia are well-equipped with the insider knowledge needed to use this incredibly complicated forum site. They can now tell their stories of the oppression and immense fear that they experienced during the raid of their region.

Well, thank you for your telegram. It will immensely help our efforts.

[Aimdar-Goomdar]

I WILL say this: if a region liberates Antalia and restores its post-Invasion status, this Liberation may be deemed invalid immediately. However, since no defender organization has done this yet, this Liberation still applies.

If another invader/raider organization SUPPORTS the occupation... we're under even greater trouble.

[The Marsupial Illuminati]

I just realized that Coalition of the Bloodbath, a native of Antalia, is now the delegate of Antalia. For the hundredth time, this proposal is useless. It has no native support; nothing seriously bad is happening to the region; this region has done nothing to deserve the protection of the SC. Can the author address these points, or will you not respond?

[Neo Libertalius]

I just realized that Coalition of the Bloodbath, a native of Antalia, is now the delegate of Antalia. For the hundredth time, this proposal is useless. It has no native support; nothing seriously bad is happening to the region; this region has done nothing to deserve the protection of the SC. Can the author address these points, or will you not respond?

I also noticed that the only other nation we have proof of questioning the occupation, The Republic of Ironforge, is less than a day old.

Maybe I'm being overly suspicious, but...

[Appalachia]

If the natives aren't actively opposing an 'invasion' - as the resolution's text CLEARLY states - then why even bother proposing a liberation. How did this get through?

This is possibly the most absurd security council proposal I've seen and I've been around (under different nations) for as long as the SC has existed. Passing this would be an incredibly authoritarian move.

[The Marsupial Illuminati]

Also, negative feedback about the Occupation by native Gothistan. This is the whole telegram:

Well, I'm probably not the biggest fan an oppressive regime that completely stripped the region of all its unique attributes and sovereignty, and turn it into a satellite state of raider scum.
But they haven't banned and locked the region down yet, which is uncommon.

Lies.

Gothistan is a nation with a population of 8 million and has been a resident of Antalia for less than 4 days. Hardly a native.

If natives of Antalia are being oppressed, why don't they post here to voice their grievances?

I also noticed that the only other nation we have proof of questioning the occupation, The Republic of Ironforge, is less than a day old.

Maybe I'm being overly suspicious, but...

Aimdar-Goomdar, you also have not addressed my point about Gothistan. Are you puppet wanking to feign support for this proposal? Are you puppet spamming Antalia to feign opposition to the raiders, who no longer have control of the region?

I am anticipating that you will dodge the question.

[Unowtican]

If the natives aren't actively opposing an 'invasion' - as the resolution's text CLEARLY states - then why even bother proposing a liberation. How did this get through?

This is possibly the most absurd security council proposal I've seen and I've been around (under different nations) for as long as the SC has existed. Passing this would be an incredibly authoritarian move.

The last proposal to liberate a region passed despite its inaccuracies

[Central Asian Republics]

Observing that the native Founder of Antalia, The Incorporated States of CyanX, has done nothing to protect the region;

So the SC has to waste time and resources to deal the result of the Founder's laziness?

Alarmed by the fact that the misinformed natives seem to be inadvertently supporting the Imperialist Battalions' occupation of their region unknowingly;

How are they supporting them unknowingly, their World Factbook Entry clearly states who the raiders are. If the natives don't care, why should we?

Fearing that Imperialist Battalions' occupation of Antalia may potentially lead to regional destruction;

Must be the most democratic destruction I've ever seen.

Anticipating that without Security Council intervention, Antalia may become irreversibly refounded into Imperialist Battalions' control;

What seems to be the problem here? The both the Founder and the WA Delegate have executive powers, if the natives really care, they should do something about it.

[Weedelia]

Clearly the founder doesn't care to be raided and, in fact, it has shown some support in the regional board:



So...

[Rednegsnart]

Now that I know that the region doesn't oppose the invasion, It's obvious that this was just horrifically written out. I don't know if it'd be worth it to even vote for the resolution at this point

[Pergamon]

Not going to happen. Your skills as nazi vehicle are inferior.

.
It has been long seen that though the Delegates of large regions may honor some of their natives' opinions, most of the time, they don't. For example, the administrators of the many major regions in CAIN refuse to release approval ratings from their populace regarding CAIN, and when asked to do so, simply assume that the natives support them.

Are you being serious? Most signatory regions have ratified this treaty over their elected representatives. CAIN even holds quorums over which region to attack. They are actually the good guys, despite your tries to demonize them over and over and over again. If there is someone to demonize, try the NPO and especially me, because I continue to attack National Socialists at any given chance, it brings me absolute enjoyment and I do not need any political or moralist reason to do so: Their existence in the game is absolutely sufficient.
And notice: There are powers quite more arbitrary than CAIN:
looks like a Nazi or Imperialist German Nazi mashup? + Has Google-Translate German? = Time to ruin the day of those beautiful people.

Though it is known that among the active nations in Gameplay that Nazism is unpopular, the same cannot be applied to the average WA member and the average native, many of whom don't participate in Gameplay affairs and often simply vote for the winning side on a World Assembly proposal. It can clearly be shown that there's a tyranny in the World Assembly, ruled by the Delegates of major regions, as their positions gain ever more power while the average nations suffer from their unpopular decisions.

Are you really trying to tell me that National Socialism is actually popular among common nations and "tyrannical Delegates" are ruling over their wishes to leave the poor Reichsbürger alone?
Listen, the day National Socialism goes popular in NationStates is the day that tells me that either the moderation or the gameplay community or both, have failed to contain this stupidity, actually not even stupidity: above anything else National Socialism is no ideology but nothing more than a crime. Only Nazis themselves or absolutely liberal madmen would deny that.

Before one gormless Pillock comes along and cries out loud again: "but commies killed millions as well!!!". Yes they did and they also have had totally villainous rulers and it doesn't makes them better. However their basic (without the abuse of some madman dictator) ideology doesn't promote either the enslavement or total annihilation of several human beings.


To be fair, IRL politics or ideologies shouldn't be part of this game. But it's that way, so the game deals with it in its own way. Try to deal with it.

[Vaniri]

"This.. This is just pointless we vote against lets get this thing out of the way quickly so more important matters can be dealt with"
The Vanirian WA Representative

[Big Bad Badger]

I am disappointed that I fell asleep and Altamoras and Trinnen beat me to voting "against"!

[Mount Seymour]

Hmmm, and it appears you're the author of this proposal?

>> "those meanie people voted against me?!"
>> "They're corrupt and I'm going to call myself the noble silent majority!"

And this is nowhere near a situation that requires a liberation. The founder could decide to wake up. Any native could simply flip an endorsement. Heck, if you're so concerned about this tiny region and interfering in the natives' decision to keep around the raiders who haven't done anything, go and move your WA in there and do it yourself instead of making the SC do it at your beck and call just so you can get your name heard.

[Sedgistan]

I've merged together the three threads on this, one of which had been posted in Gameplay. One discussion thread is quite enough for a proposal.

[Neo Libertalius]

I've merged together the three threads on this, one of which had been posted in Gameplay. One discussion thread is quite enough for a proposal.

Thank you. It was getting a tad difficult trying to keep up with discussion threads everywhere.

Hmmm, and it appears you're the author of this proposal?

>> "those meanie people voted against me?!"
>> "They're corrupt and I'm going to call myself the noble silent majority!"

And this is nowhere near a situation that requires a liberation. The founder could decide to wake up. Any native could simply flip an endorsement. Heck, if you're so concerned about this tiny region and interfering in the natives' decision to keep around the raiders who haven't done anything, go and move your WA in there and do it yourself instead of making the SC do it at your beck and call just so you can get your name heard.

This is essentially what everyone has been saying. I hardly think it's worth it to get the SC involved with a region that A. already has a founder, which seems to be active within the actual game, and B. is a region comprised of mostly raiders, and most of the natives, especially the ones who have spoken up, are very new and arrived there after the raid. I have a suspicion that at least one of them is a puppet, but regarding that, I admit I have nothing more to go on than a little conspiracy theory.

[Bhang Bhang Duc]

I am disappointed that I fell asleep and Altamoras and Trinnen beat me to voting "against"!

Bad Delegate, no more Neenee glitter and cookies for you.

But seriously it is an absolute joy to see this pile of manure masquerading as a proposal getting put to the sword.