[DEFEATED] Condemn New Edom

[Sedgistan]

Since the OP of the last attempt just abandoned his attempt at the resolution, I'm taking this to a new thread. This is the current draft:

Category: Condemn || Nominee: New Edom || Proposed by: Bodobol

The Security Council,

RECOGNIZING that each World Assembly member nation has a duty to adhere to each of its resolutions,

DISGUSTED that New Edom, a member of the World Assembly, has repeatedly violated several resolutions, including General Assembly Resolutions #9, #15, #23, #30, #35, #38 and #160, and shows no signs of trying to adhere to its duty,

APALLED that said nation has committed acts of genocide against the native Elwe people inside its own borders and denied several rights to LGBT citizens, including those outlined in GA Resolutions #15 and #35,

SHOCKED at the discriminatory actions of the government against those who criticize it, including forcibly disbanding the Feminist Party and sentencing its members to hard labor or execution and jailing and raiding the homes of anarchists and socialists,

DEPLORING the government of New Edom for doing little to stop widespread discrimination against its own LGBT citizens, and actually encouraging it by making homosexuality appear abnormal via the establishment of several, albeit voluntary, re-education camps throughout the nation,

DENOUNCES New Edom as a misogynistic, homophobic nation whose human rights abuses include allowing women to be forced into marriages,

HEREBY CONDEMNS New Edom.

And some background on the resolution...

15- Freedom of Marriage Act

EXAMPLES:

Exhibit A

---

30- Freedom of Expression

EXAMPLES:
Exhibit A
Exhibit B
Exhibit C

---

35- Charter of Civil Rights I won't post examples; I've already made it clear that he's violated Article 1C.

---

38- Convention Against Genocide

EXAMPLES:

Exhibit A
Exhibit B
Exhibit C

---

160- Forced Marriages Ban Act

EXAMPLES:

Exhibit A

Constructive criticism is appreciated (also, I only noticed some WA violations after gathering up all the examples- the ones I found afterward are mentioned in the resolution, but not in the spoiler).

[Ikania]

I didn't abandon the attempts, I just figured that he's an okay person and hasn't broken a single WA law that you mentioned.

[Bodobol]

I didn't abandon the attempts, I just figured that he's an okay person and hasn't broken a single WA law that you mentioned.

We literally just went over this.

And you asked the mods to lock your thread. I think that classifies as abandoning the attempt.

[Ikania]

I didn't abandon the attempts, I just figured that he's an okay person and hasn't broken a single WA law that you mentioned.

We literally just went over this.

And you asked the mods to lock your thread. I think that classifies as abandoning the attempt.

But see, it's not an attempt if I'm actually defending him now.

[Bodobol]

We literally just went over this.

And you asked the mods to lock your thread. I think that classifies as abandoning the attempt.

But see, it's not an attempt if I'm actually defending him now.

You abandoned your attempt to condemn him. I did not. Now let's stop the needless bickering and actually discuss the resolution, okay?

[Ikania]

But see, it's not an attempt if I'm actually defending him now.

You abandoned your attempt to condemn him. I did not. Now let's stop the needless bickering and actually discuss the resolution, okay?

Okay fine. I don't like it and will not support it. Done.

[Orentor]

Although I am intially against homosexuality I do not like that New Edom has persecuted them, well done Bodobol!

[Ikania]

Although I am intially against homosexuality I do not like that New Edom has persecuted them, well done Bodobol!

New Edom isn't persecuting them at all.
Start from around the bottom of the page and see the telegrams we exchange. See how New Edom is doing a service to actually save gays from being discriminated by society. Although it isn't very good that they're being taught to cover instinct instead of showing pride, it's better than being called a fgt all the time.
Sorry if that was offensive...

[Bodobol]

Although I am intially against homosexuality I do not like that New Edom has persecuted them, well done Bodobol!

New Edom isn't persecuting them at all.
Start from around the bottom of the page and see the telegrams we exchange. See how New Edom is doing a service to actually save gays from being discriminated by society. Although it isn't very good that they're being taught to cover instinct instead of showing pride, it's better than being called a fgt all the time.
Sorry if that was offensive...

Doesn't change the fact that the New Edomite government is encouraging discrimination of gays by making them appear abnormal; that being said, I'll edit my proposal.

[Orentor]

I just wrote persecuting because most of what i've heard has shown NE conducting actions against them sorry if i didn't get my point acroos clearly enough.

[Bodobol]

I just wrote persecuting because most of what i've heard has shown NE conducting actions against them sorry if i didn't get my point acroos clearly enough.

They're still persecuting homosexuals by not allowing them to marry and setting up reeducation camps for them.

[Abacathea]

I just wrote persecuting because most of what i've heard has shown NE conducting actions against them sorry if i didn't get my point acroos clearly enough.

They're still persecuting homosexuals by not allowing them to marry and setting up reeducation camps for them.

Is that really persecution. Are these voluntary camps? Mandatory? This is the level of information your proposal needs to have rather than us having to clarify here on the forum. If we have to here, it's likely those who vote will have similar questions.

[Bodobol]

They're still persecuting homosexuals by not allowing them to marry and setting up reeducation camps for them.

Is that really persecution. Are these voluntary camps? Mandatory? This is the level of information your proposal needs to have rather than us having to clarify here on the forum. If we have to here, it's likely those who vote will have similar questions.

By denying them the same rights heterosexuals have, yes, they are discriminating. The camps are voluntary (I'll edit that in as well), but it still does nothing to shed the public image of homosexuality being abnormal. Plus, New Edom is directly violating GAR #15.

[Ikania]

Lemme sum this up.
1. Gay marriage is technically legal, but you can only get it from pastors and priests, who typically refuse because they're Christian.
2. The camps are completely voluntary, and are not filthy hellpits. They are comfortable, nice places with great food.
3. The camps teach you how to act straight so you can pass off as hetero in public and not be insulted and discriminated in public. As a Christian state, the people would hate an LGBT Pride event, so they resort to this.
4. New Edom has never killed any gays except for those who raped children. That's good, right?
5. So let's see... Freedom of Marriage is technically being followed, Freedom of Expression is being discouraged but not outlawed in any manner. No Genocide, no anything, really. So what's so bad?

[Bodobol]

Lemme sum this up.
1. Gay marriage is technically legal, but you can only get it from pastors and priests, who typically refuse because they're Christian.
2. The camps are completely voluntary, and are not filthy hellpits. They are comfortable, nice places with great food.
3. The camps teach you how to act straight so you can pass off as hetero in public and not be insulted and discriminated in public. As a Christian state, the people would hate an LGBT Pride event, so they resort to this.
4. New Edom has never killed any gays except for those who raped children. That's good, right?
5. So let's see... Freedom of Marriage is technically being followed, Freedom of Expression is being discouraged but not outlawed in any manner. No Genocide, no anything, really. So what's so bad?

1. Linky, please.
2. Doesn't matter, they're still encouraging discrimination against homosexuals.
3. See 2.
4. I never said anything about killing gays.
5. Again, source. And the FoE resolution is being violated- as seen here.

[New Edom]

This is an outrage! New Edom has been attempting to join the Stonewall Alliance, and has had an investigative commission from that alliance exploring the nature of the education centers. As for political dissidents, naturally our governments have defended our people against them. We expect to see the world reject this proposal in favour of justice.

- Count Rufus Pudens,
World Assembly Ambassador

[Aquafireland]

Did you submit this before you put this on the forums. If you have, that's one of the worst moves you could ever make when submitting a proposal. Let other experienced nations check out the proposal for any illegal content. Or risk the proposal removed from the floor. Remember - three proposals yanked from the floor and you lose your WA membership.

[Lamoni]

The Free Republic of Lamoni is hereby AGAINST this condemnation, as all the the Edomite camps have done is to protect the LGBT crowd from discrimination by the rest of the nation's own highly religious population.

Also, we find fault with your accusation that New Edom's government is actively encouraging discrimination against the LGBT crowd. The so-called encouragement in question is coming from the various forms of Christianity practiced within New Edom, and not the government itself. Unless I missed a WA resolution stating that the WA can do something about what religion teaches, then the main thrust of this condemnation simply does not stand up to serious scrutiny.

The government of New Edom is attempting to help their LGBT citizens to survive against persecution from more religious members of Edomite society.

[SkyDip]

Remember - three proposals yanked from the floor and you lose your WA membership.

What, exactly, are you basing that on?

[Aquafireland]

Remember - three proposals yanked from the floor and you lose your WA membership.

What, exactly, are you basing that on?

On the resolution. Was this proposal submitted before it was put on the forums or the other way around?

[Bodobol]

Did you submit this before you put this on the forums. If you have, that's one of the worst moves you could ever make when submitting a proposal. Let other experienced nations check out the proposal for any illegal content. Or risk the proposal removed from the floor. Remember - three proposals yanked from the floor and you lose your WA membership.

I let it sit here for about a day, but being the impatient person that I am, I will admit that I submitted it before any of the experienced nations got to it.

The Free Republic of Lamoni is hereby AGAINST this condemnation, as all the the Edomite camps have done is to protect the LGBT crowd from discrimination by the rest of the nation's own highly religious population.

Also, we find fault with your accusation that New Edom's government is actively encouraging discrimination against the LGBT crowd. The so-called encouragement in question is coming from the various forms of Christianity practiced within New Edom, and not the government itself. Unless I missed a WA resolution stating that the WA can do something about what religion teaches, then the main thrust of this condemnation simply does not stand up to serious scrutiny.

The government of New Edom is attempting to help their LGBT citizens to survive against persecution from more religious members of Edomite society.

...You know, I would try to argue against this, but you're right. My train of thought was that the camps were being set up, thereby making homosexuals feel abnormal and in need of being 'reeducated', but your post has brought me to the realization that that is not the case. Unfortunately, the proposal has already been submitted and I can't remove that clause from it. Apologies.

[Aquafireland]

Did you submit this before you put this on the forums. If you have, that's one of the worst moves you could ever make when submitting a proposal. Let other experienced nations check out the proposal for any illegal content. Or risk the proposal removed from the floor. Remember - three proposals yanked from the floor and you lose your WA membership.

I let it sit here for about a day, but being the impatient person that I am, I will admit that I submitted it before any of the experienced nations got to it.

The Free Republic of Lamoni is hereby AGAINST this condemnation, as all the the Edomite camps have done is to protect the LGBT crowd from discrimination by the rest of the nation's own highly religious population.

Also, we find fault with your accusation that New Edom's government is actively encouraging discrimination against the LGBT crowd. The so-called encouragement in question is coming from the various forms of Christianity practiced within New Edom, and not the government itself. Unless I missed a WA resolution stating that the WA can do something about what religion teaches, then the main thrust of this condemnation simply does not stand up to serious scrutiny.

The government of New Edom is attempting to help their LGBT citizens to survive against persecution from more religious members of Edomite society.

...You know, I would try to argue against this, but you're right. My train of thought was that the camps were being set up, thereby making homosexuals feel abnormal and in need of being 'reeducated', but your post has brought me to the realization that that is not the case. Unfortunately, the proposal has already been submitted and I can't remove that clause from it. Apologies.

My friend, I have been quite eager to do that in the past. Don't let impatience beat you to the finish line. The Security Council and the proposal are not going anywhere. Next time you do something, make sure you take my advice.

[SkyDip]

What, exactly, are you basing that on?

On the resolution. Was this proposal submitted before it was put on the forums or the other way around?

You didn't answer my question. Remotely.

[Frattastan II]

Remember - three proposals yanked from the floor and you lose your WA membership.

What, exactly, are you basing that on?

GA rules, though I have no idea if it applies to the SC too.
No reason why it shouldn't, but doesn't really matter since even for the GA there are exceptions to three proposals rule.

In general, you get two "freebies" before you're chucked. Usually, after your second deleted Proposal, you'll get a little note letting you know you're on your last chance (but if you don't, don't come crying to the Mods, ignorance of the law and all...). After the third deleted Proposal, you're out.

[Sedgistan]

It's done on a case by case basis really. Unless you submit something extremely offensive, utterly spammy or similar, you won't be removed before 3 illegal proposals. If it's a player making honest mistakes, we won't kick them for three. It very much depends on the circumstances.