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[PASSED] Liberate Nazi Europe

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Galiantus II
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Founded: Jan 07, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Galiantus II » Tue Mar 12, 2013 2:47 pm

Blu Mount wrote:Look, I'm not a member of the "Nazi Europe" region, but, really? Is it necesary to "Liberate" a region with a different opinion? Geez, that's even more intolerant that nazis! (And I'm a national socialist)
In that case, we could start "liberating" another extremist regions such as communist ones

And c'mon it's a joke


How about we go coup all the regional delegates who approve this, and make plans to use this tactic on the passworded region with the largest vote on this? And then we could also invade the founderless delegates approving it! Anyone who thinks this proposal is okay had better be okay with armies marching in to take their delegacy and take them out of power.
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Netherheim
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Founded: Dec 22, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Netherheim » Tue Mar 12, 2013 2:52 pm

Galiantus II wrote:
Blu Mount wrote:Look, I'm not a member of the "Nazi Europe" region, but, really? Is it necesary to "Liberate" a region with a different opinion? Geez, that's even more intolerant that nazis! (And I'm a national socialist)
In that case, we could start "liberating" another extremist regions such as communist ones

And c'mon it's a joke


How about we go coup all the regional delegates who approve this, and make plans to use this tactic on the passworded region with the largest vote on this? And then we could also invade the founderless delegates approving it! Anyone who thinks this proposal is okay had better be okay with armies marching in to take their delegacy and take them out of power.


The Empire of Netherheim Approves of this idea.

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Feux
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Founded: Mar 20, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Feux » Tue Mar 12, 2013 3:08 pm

Netherheim wrote:
Galiantus II wrote:
How about we go coup all the regional delegates who approve this, and make plans to use this tactic on the passworded region with the largest vote on this? And then we could also invade the founderless delegates approving it! Anyone who thinks this proposal is okay had better be okay with armies marching in to take their delegacy and take them out of power.


The Empire of Netherheim Approves of this idea.


:rofl:
Last edited by Feux on Tue Mar 12, 2013 3:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Rupture Farms co
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Founded: Oct 03, 2008
Ex-Nation

Postby Rupture Farms co » Tue Mar 12, 2013 3:14 pm

Captain Woodhouse wrote:
Mengsk wrote:The delegation of Mengsk votes AGAINST this bill. Let Nazi Europe live in its own little delusional world.


My delusional world begins and ends with a fantasy of teaching the GCRs the difference between the singular possessive and plural forms of Nazi.

I harbor little hope that the world will recognize this unedited legislation for what it is: payback for my educational crusade. Gregorach is correct. Should you sink us with shit that reads as if you channeled Dogberry and Verges, by God there will be blood. I'm talking fire and brimstone coming down from the skies. Rivers and seas boiling! Forty years of darkness! Earthquakes, volcanoes, the dead rising from the grave, human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together, mass hysteria!

Moderation has given us the green light to create NAZI EUROPE II: The Empire Strikes Back.

Wait for it.

Namaste,
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Imperium of Tanith
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Founded: Sep 29, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Imperium of Tanith » Tue Mar 12, 2013 3:19 pm

Mad Jack wrote:
Imperium of Tanith wrote:I am voting against this, not because that I'm a Nazi lover, but because I know for a solid fact that this is being put up so that we are essentially allowing Raider Regions like TNI and the Black Riders to walk in and take over.

Actually it's so the GCR militaries can walk in and take over.

You get the point.

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Zeorus
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Founded: Nov 01, 2006
Ex-Nation

Postby Zeorus » Tue Mar 12, 2013 3:41 pm

I have yet to hear anyone (not just in this thread, but ever) give me a good enough reason why it's ok to abuse the Liberation function like this to pick on Nazis simply because they're Nazis.
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Mad Jack
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Founded: Nov 01, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Mad Jack » Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:29 pm

Galiantus II wrote:
Mad Jack wrote:I love you.

As for not posting it here first, this was drafted with input from every GCR delegate. It didn't need to be posted here first.


Oh, so you ADMIT to conspiring against Nazi Europe!
It was public knowledge that the GCR delegates were meeting to discuss the Nazi Problem.
So just because you are among the most powerful players in the game means it is okay to bully someone

Oh please. I've suffered serious bullying in my life, and this isn't bullying.

At all.
Blu Mount wrote:Look, I'm not a member of the "Nazi Europe" region, but, really? Is it necesary to "Liberate" a region with a different opinion? Geez, that's even more intolerant that nazis! (And I'm a national socialist)
Killing millions of people is more tolerant than 'liberating' a region that celebrates that act on an online text-based nation simulator?
In that case, we could start "liberating" another extremist regions such as communist ones
You're welcome to.
Galiantus II wrote:
Blu Mount wrote:Look, I'm not a member of the "Nazi Europe" region, but, really? Is it necesary to "Liberate" a region with a different opinion? Geez, that's even more intolerant that nazis! (And I'm a national socialist)
In that case, we could start "liberating" another extremist regions such as communist ones

And c'mon it's a joke


How about we go coup all the regional delegates who approve this, and make plans to use this tactic on the passworded region with the largest vote on this? And then we could also invade the founderless delegates approving it! Anyone who thinks this proposal is okay had better be okay with armies marching in to take their delegacy and take them out of power.
Good luck with that one.
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North Chicopee
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Founded: Mar 01, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby North Chicopee » Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:29 pm

Zeorus wrote:I have yet to hear anyone (not just in this thread, but ever) give me a good enough reason why it's ok to abuse the Liberation function like this to pick on Nazis simply because they're Nazis.


Exactly, they are abusing the liberation function. Nazi Europe wasn't taken over by raiders, so there is nothing to liberate them from. They're just a small, condemned, region that nobody likes.
"penna petit placidam sub libertate quietem" - “By the pen we seek peace, but peace only under liberty”

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Mad Jack
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Founded: Nov 01, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Mad Jack » Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:30 pm

North Chicopee wrote:
Zeorus wrote:I have yet to hear anyone (not just in this thread, but ever) give me a good enough reason why it's ok to abuse the Liberation function like this to pick on Nazis simply because they're Nazis.


Exactly, they are abusing the liberation function. Nazi Europe wasn't taken over by raiders, so there is nothing to liberate them from. They're just a small, condemned, region that nobody likes.

It's fair game.

NE opened the gates when they tried to do it to Haven. Now it's time for them to burn.
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North Chicopee
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Founded: Mar 01, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby North Chicopee » Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:40 pm

Let's be fair and see if this liberation is appropriate using the guides posted by this very council:

Image

NOPE
"penna petit placidam sub libertate quietem" - “By the pen we seek peace, but peace only under liberty”

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Cerian Quilor
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Founded: Mar 30, 2012
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Postby Cerian Quilor » Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:42 pm

Those guides are not rules. The rules of the WA boil down to mob rule.
Never underestimate the power of cynicism, pessimism and negativity to prevent terrible things from happening. Only idealists try to build the future on a mountain of bodies.

The Thing to Remember About NationStates is that it is an almost entirely social game - fundamentally, you have no power beyond your own ability to convince people to go along with your ideas. In that sense, even the most dictatorial region is fundamentally democratic.

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Baiynistan
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Founded: May 15, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Baiynistan » Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:48 pm

Seems the regional head was appointed over a year ago. I find it strange that the region should suddenly need 'liberating' now.

While I disagree with much of the National Socialist doctrine, I appreciate that their dossier explicitly says that region denizens should not harass Jews or Communists.

I say, as long as the region remains non-Imperialist and non-aggressive, it should be allowed to keep its sovereignty.
Last edited by Baiynistan on Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Feux
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Founded: Mar 20, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Feux » Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:02 pm

North Chicopee wrote:Let's be fair and see if this liberation is appropriate using the guides posted by this very council:

(Image)

NOPE

I guess this makes that obsolete.
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Unibot III
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Postby Unibot III » Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:46 pm

Zeorus wrote:I have yet to hear anyone (not just in this thread, but ever) give me a good enough reason why it's ok to abuse the Liberation function like this to pick on Nazis simply because they're Nazis.


I agree with Zeorus. Couldn't have said it better myself.
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Hesse
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Founded: Oct 19, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Hesse » Tue Mar 12, 2013 6:37 pm

Noting the region to already be condemned by Security Council Resolution #37 for atrocious acts of hostility and intolerance


Why note this when you're all being hostile and intolerant towards a region yourselves just because of their political ideology? Seems hypocritical.
Last edited by Hesse on Tue Mar 12, 2013 6:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Daily Bread
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Founded: Dec 16, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Daily Bread » Tue Mar 12, 2013 6:46 pm

by Zeorus » Tue Mar 12, 2013 3:41 pm
I have yet to hear anyone (not just in this thread, but ever) give me a good enough reason why it's ok to abuse the Liberation function like this to pick on Nazis simply because they're Nazis.
...

Even Zionist controlled Nazi's on puppet strings under GD's friend Christian Reich AKA Rupture Farms co deserve a locked room to play in.

NE is not a threat to anyone as a Parody region....come on guys, another Liberation?

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Captain Woodhouse
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Founded: Dec 30, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Captain Woodhouse » Tue Mar 12, 2013 6:51 pm

Galiantus II wrote:Oh, so you ADMIT to conspiring against Nazi Europe! Glad you could all come to a 'consensus' on this, because it doesn't change the fact that you are doing this purely out of a dislike of a particular group of players who happen to be friendly with the region (GGR) who likes advertising on your RMBs.


You're out of the loop regarding the relationship between NE and The Greater German Reich. We pulled our embassy with them some time ago. It wasn't the first time.

Yes. And not only that, but other players (like myself) will join in; not to further Nazism, not because we don't have an eye for evil views, but because we wish to defend the rights of a soveregn minority to exist independant of the rule of the majority.


We appreciate your support; however, I'm uncertain what 'evil views' you think we espouse, or whether you believe the existence of a region called 'NAZI EUROPE' is sufficient enough to prove that the current vocal members promote Nazism. I'd require evidence of the latter beyond some of our tongue-in-cheek RMB blather. I've played in NE on-off since 2010. At least since that time, the region has been very forgiving of member and visitor race, religion, orientation, etc. As I've said before in the SC, it's gotten us into a lot of trouble with other Nazi themed regions, and is some of what's behind the current hostility between NE and those regions.

I've observed a whole lot more intolerance among some far left and far right regions with prohibited nation categories. We've nothing like that going on in NE. In fact, we allowed a Democratic Socialist to take the seat in our Satellite BLITZKRIEG, until s/he approved this Liberation proposal.

I've tried to reason with the lynch mob before to no avail. They've no excuse to open us up to invasion other than they can.

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Skizzy Grey
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Founded: Jan 26, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Skizzy Grey » Tue Mar 12, 2013 6:55 pm

Galiantus II wrote:Oh, so you ADMIT to conspiring against Nazi Europe! Glad you could all come to a 'consensus' on this, because it doesn't change the fact that you are doing this purely out of a dislike of a particular group of players who happen to be friendly with the region (GGR) who likes advertising on your RMBs. Fine. So just because you are among the most powerful players in the game means it is okay to bully someone, essentially, just because you can. This doesn't just go for you, this goes for 1) the auther, 2) every delegate who approved it, and 3) everyone who votes for it, to the magnitude of however many votes they have.


Gays, Jews, and other targets of Nazi hate shouldn't have to deal with the presence of Nazis when they play NationStates. They are the bullies here.

It would be better if the NationStates mods didn't allow Nazi Europe, GGR, and similar regions to exist. Failing that, the next best thing is to make in-game existence for Nazis as miserable as the rules of the game will allow. This resolution is a positive step in that direction.

It's disappointing that so many players -- including quite a few whom I respect -- have elevated in-game R/D ideology over RL decency.

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Captain Woodhouse
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Founded: Dec 30, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Captain Woodhouse » Tue Mar 12, 2013 7:06 pm

Daily Bread wrote:Even Zionist controlled Nazi's on puppet strings under GD's friend Christian Reich AKA Rupture Farms co deserve a locked room to play in.


NE is not a threat to anyone as a Parody region....come on guys, another Liberation?


How about taking your personal vendettas to the john where they belong: international gestapo courts

NAZI EUROPE is not a parody region.

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Hesse
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Founded: Oct 19, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Hesse » Tue Mar 12, 2013 7:06 pm

Skizzy Grey wrote:Gays, Jews, and other targets of Nazi hate shouldn't have to deal with the presence of Nazis when they play NationStates. They are the bullies here.


You complain about people being targeted by hate, yet you are not hesitant to employ the same idea to National Socialists. We are being targeted just because of the way we think, and that's the very behavior you're fighting against. You have become your own enemy.

This also applies to those who believe this proposal is justified for similar reasons. "Equality and tolerance... for some."

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Cerian Quilor
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Founded: Mar 30, 2012
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Postby Cerian Quilor » Tue Mar 12, 2013 7:08 pm

Skizzy Grey wrote:
Galiantus II wrote:Oh, so you ADMIT to conspiring against Nazi Europe! Glad you could all come to a 'consensus' on this, because it doesn't change the fact that you are doing this purely out of a dislike of a particular group of players who happen to be friendly with the region (GGR) who likes advertising on your RMBs. Fine. So just because you are among the most powerful players in the game means it is okay to bully someone, essentially, just because you can. This doesn't just go for you, this goes for 1) the auther, 2) every delegate who approved it, and 3) everyone who votes for it, to the magnitude of however many votes they have.


Gays, Jews, and other targets of Nazi hate shouldn't have to deal with the presence of Nazis when they play NationStates. They are the bullies here.

It would be better if the NationStates mods didn't allow Nazi Europe, GGR, and similar regions to exist. Failing that, the next best thing is to make in-game existence for Nazis as miserable as the rules of the game will allow. This resolution is a positive step in that direction.

It's disappointing that so many players -- including quite a few whom I respect -- have elevated in-game R/D ideology over RL decency.

Is Nazi Europe actually doing Anything, these days?

It isn't nessesarily RL decency to give so much of a crap about Nazism in a game, especially when at least 50% of the nazi players aren't actually, you know, real Nazis.
Never underestimate the power of cynicism, pessimism and negativity to prevent terrible things from happening. Only idealists try to build the future on a mountain of bodies.

The Thing to Remember About NationStates is that it is an almost entirely social game - fundamentally, you have no power beyond your own ability to convince people to go along with your ideas. In that sense, even the most dictatorial region is fundamentally democratic.

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Aryan Shield Command
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Posts: 16
Founded: Jan 26, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Aryan Shield Command » Tue Mar 12, 2013 7:10 pm

But.. but that would go against all you stand for right? "Hate and Intolerance" is not allowed here in NationStates except when it comes from the opposition. Right?

How can you and others argue against Nazi regions, real or Parody, and not be hypocritical. You can not have it both ways.

If the rules are slanted in favor of one group over another...does not not Discriminate? Are we not under the same protection as any other region type? Yes we are.

Nazi Europe used to be a raider region and earned the condemnation. Now they are reduced to a dozen members and are no threat.
This Liberation is against the principles of the Security Council.

I urge all to change vote to AGAINST. Thank you
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The Duat (Ancient)
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Founded: Feb 16, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby The Duat (Ancient) » Tue Mar 12, 2013 7:11 pm

If this garbage passes, I'll resign my membership in the World Assembly. This is simply shameful.

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Nulvelith
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Founded: Jan 14, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Nulvelith » Tue Mar 12, 2013 7:17 pm

The Duat wrote:If this garbage passes, I'll resign my membership in the World Assembly. This is simply shameful.

This.

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Imperium of Tanith
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Founded: Sep 29, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Imperium of Tanith » Tue Mar 12, 2013 7:40 pm

The Duat wrote:If this garbage passes, I'll resign my membership in the World Assembly. This is simply shameful.

This

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