[DEFEATED] Condemn Lazarus

[Paper Flowers]

If everyone hates recruitment spam, then why don't they move to a founding region? It is that simple. Yes even this problem you described is an easy remedy to fix! No more complaining from the complainers. Gosh I just solved NationStates biggest complaint with one fell swoop.

If you want to be in a region that gets new members, why don't you stay in a sinker/feeder region? Then you could get new members to your region every day with no work what-so-ever. Gosh I just solved Nationstates biggest complaint with one fell swoop.

Opposed

[Moronist Decisions]

Feeders and sinkers need to be able to develop their own communities, too. Hence, the restriction of RMB spam. We do not believe that this is a good idea.
Pip
Intern and Charges d'Affaires ad Interim to the Security Council

[Nuevo Blluedevil]

To be honest, I don't like RMB spam/overly long recruitment posts. If the Delegate/region wants to forbid types of messages, let them but don't condemn them. What did they do, suppress the offending message?

But that is the whole purpose of the public regions. They were built to be the launch pad of new, rejected or refounding nations to go to individually created regions. The only people who should be against this resolution are the public regions
and not private regions such as mine.

[Frisbeeteria]

But that is the whole purpose of the public regions. They were built to be the launch pad of new, rejected or refounding nations to go to individually created regions. The only people who should be against this resolution are the public regions
and not private regions such as mine.

You're making an assumption based on you own opinion, not anything in-game. Given your short forum post history, you've most likely missed the multi-hundred-post threads on RMB recruiting in Moderation, Technical, and probably Gameplay. Those of us who have been through a debate (or in many cases, multiple debates) have a much better view of what forum and game participants are willing to put up with.

I suggest that you spend some time searching and reading those threads before coming back to this one, as it will give you some perspectives you're currently missing, and perhaps make this a better proposal. Somebody here might even be able to link you to a few of them. It's a pity you can't see the dozens of now-deleted threads on our original forums and the Jolt forums - that's where most of the recruiting rules definitions were originally decided.

[Nuevo Blluedevil]

To be honest, I don't like RMB spam/overly long recruitment posts. If the Delegate/region wants to forbid types of messages, let them but don't condemn them. What did they do, suppress the offending message?

Just because someone from a Nazi region post to come to their style of region doesn't mean it is offending. However, someone acting like a fool and being just plan rude and mean does call for a supression. Anyone who is just trying to improve their region by making it appealling for nations to join should not be penalize for it.

[Nuevo Blluedevil]

If everyone hates recruitment spam, then why don't they move to a founding region? It is that simple. Yes even this problem you described is an easy remedy to fix! No more complaining from the complainers. Gosh I just solved NationStates biggest complaint with one fell swoop.

If you want to be in a region that gets new members, why don't you stay in a sinker/feeder region? Then you could get new members to your region every day with no work what-so-ever. Gosh I just solved Nationstates biggest complaint with one fell swoop.

Opposed

That is idiotic. The moderators would have to set my region status as a sinker/feeder region to even get new members without work. Your solving of this complaint quickly falls back to the ground.

Good try though.

[Nuevo Blluedevil]

But that is the whole purpose of the public regions. They were built to be the launch pad of new, rejected or refounding nations to go to individually created regions. The only people who should be against this resolution are the public regions
and not private regions such as mine.

You're making an assumption based on you own opinion, not anything in-game. Given your short forum post history, you've most likely missed the multi-hundred-post threads on RMB recruiting in Moderation, Technical, and probably Gameplay. Those of us who have been through a debate (or in many cases, multiple debates) have a much better view of what forum and game participants are willing to put up with.

I suggest that you spend some time searching and reading those threads before coming back to this one, as it will give you some perspectives you're currently missing, and perhaps make this a better proposal. Somebody here might even be able to link you to a few of them. It's a pity you can't see the dozens of now-deleted threads on our original forums and the Jolt forums - that's where most of the recruiting rules definitions were originally decided.

It is not an opinion! Why were the public regions even created in the first place if it is not to be used as a launch pad for nations? The power that Big Public Regions have on this issue is intoxicating. This is a resolution that supports giving power back to the little guy, to those private user created regions. There is a death grip on this issue brought on by Big Regions to snuff out the little regions, thus enabling to keep their high numbers.

[Paper Flowers]

That is idiotic. The moderators would have to set my region status as a sinker/feeder region to even get new members without work. Your solving of this complaint quickly falls back to the ground.

Good try though.

You're missing the point. Why move out of the feeders to begin with? If you want new members you can stay in one of the regions that gets new members for free.

It's as idiotic as your suggestion that those who don't like RMB spam should simply move because of it, rather than the sensible option of suppressing it.

[Drop Your Pants]

I'd like to point out, a few regions have taken the spanish theme quite well It also gives spanish regions a chance to shine.

[Nuevo Blluedevil]

That is idiotic. The moderators would have to set my region status as a sinker/feeder region to even get new members without work. Your solving of this complaint quickly falls back to the ground.

Good try though.

You're missing the point. Why move out of the feeders to begin with? If you want new members you can stay in one of the regions that gets new members for free.

It's as idiotic as your suggestion that those who don't like RMB spam should simply move because of it, rather than the sensible option of suppressing it.

Ok I am tired of repeating myself. I am just going to bring it up to the first vote. Hope it passes and then allow the entire WA to vote on what it thinks.

[Crushing Our Enemies]

I suggest that you spend some time searching and reading those threads before coming back to this one, as it will give you some perspectives you're currently missing, and perhaps make this a better proposal. Somebody here might even be able to link you to a few of them.

Seriously. Lemme help you with that:

viewtopic.php?f=12&t=153333
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=157054
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=155010
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=154590
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=42650

You're jumping in late to a VERY long movie and asking who the guy on the screen is. Believe me, we've all been through this before. I'll spoil the ending for you:

1. Delegates can use delegate controls for whatever they want, be it suppressing RMB posts, banning nations, etc.
2. The above powers can be used to effectively ban and suppress recruiters and recruitment ads.

Now, that doesn't preclude a condemnation based on abuses of power, etc. If the WA wanted to express shock and dismay at DYP for banning recruitment from his region, it CAN do that. But you won't get there by making arguments about the purpose of feeder regions.

Plus, almost all the high-vote delegates are from GCRs, so good luck getting it passed if it even got to the floor. Combined, the GCR delegates are quite a voting block.

[Nuevo Blluedevil]

I suggest that you spend some time searching and reading those threads before coming back to this one, as it will give you some perspectives you're currently missing, and perhaps make this a better proposal. Somebody here might even be able to link you to a few of them.

Seriously. Lemme help you with that:

viewtopic.php?f=12&t=153333
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=157054
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=155010
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=154590
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=42650

You're jumping in late to a VERY long movie and asking who the guy on the screen is. Believe me, we've all been through this before. I'll spoil the ending for you:

1. Delegates can use delegate controls for whatever they want, be it suppressing RMB posts, banning nations, etc.
2. The above powers can be used to effectively ban and suppress recruiters and recruitment ads.

Now, that doesn't preclude a condemnation based on abuses of power, etc. If the WA wanted to express shock and dismay at DYP for banning recruitment from his region, it CAN do that. But you won't get there by making arguments about the purpose of feeder regions.

Plus, almost all the high-vote delegates are from GCRs, so good luck getting it passed if it even got to the floor. Combined, the GCR delegates are quite a voting block.

Look, I thank you for posting those links. But, well isn't that the beauty of government? Being able to continuously bring up an issue and highlighting the problems within it. Obviously this problem won't go away until we are allowed to have it come to a vote. I repeatedly mentioned how the GCR has a death grip of power on the World Assembly and little regions should have their voice heard. This highlights the injustice in that Big Regions are dictating against small regions.

For real world terms, think of Wal-Mart on how huge it is. Wal-Mart has everything that a person needs...from gas to a bank. But what about the small business? They are not the same massive conglomerate, holding monopolistic or at least near-monopolistic control over thousands of nations. How do does the small business handle this? Why they must be resourceful, for if they are not, the market place will be dominated by just a few super huge businesses.

[Ryouese Black Islands]

Maybe we should condemn you?

[Frisbeeteria]

For real world terms, think of Wal-Mart on how huge it is. Wal-Mart has everything that a person needs...from gas to a bank. But what about the small business? They are not the same massive conglomerate, holding monopolistic or at least near-monopolistic control over thousands of nations. How do does the small business handle this? Why they must be resourceful, for if they are not, the market place will be dominated by just a few super huge businesses.

As a small businessman who is now a former small businessman, the realistic view of this is that Walmart wins because it offers the buyer what they want - the same products at a lower cost. My little store had its elections too. The ballot box was the cash register, and we lost to Walmart because that's what the buyers wanted. End of RL lesson.

You can have your shouting protest and submit this proposal for a vote, but I'm predicting that it will lose, and lose badly. The 20 "small business" recruiter regions will vote for it, the GCRs will vote against it (except for Lazarus, and that's just for the humor value), and everyone else will vote only if they happen to be visiting the SC page anyway. Nobody cares.

[Drop Your Pants]

I think i can get Balder and TRR to vote for it too if i beg

[Nuevo Blluedevil]

Regardless of your intentions Pants, I thank you for supporting my side. We can show this Red named player and all the other debbie downers that people really do care one way or the other. He may be full of apathy, but I am fighting for his small region and the thousands out there that have been divided and scattered due to the death grip of power that Big Region excerts.

[Drop Your Pants]

Frisbeeteria is a game mod

[Crazy girl]

Well, this should be amusing. You might be the first game region with a badge. Though if this passes, the rest will follow soon.

[Heistrein]

huh... so this is submitted?... why?

[Moronist Decisions]

huh... so this is submitted?... why?

You really think he was listening?

Plus, to be honest, are you sure submitting just before a downtime is a good idea?

Edited to add: Well, since DYP wants Lazarus to be condemned, we'll give in. We'll vote for it.

[Heistrein]

huh... so this is submitted?... why?

You really think he was listening?

Plus, to be honest, are you sure submitting just before a downtime is a good idea?

Edited to add: Well, since DYP wants Lazarus to be condemned, we'll give in. We'll vote for it.

*sigh* true. well, we'll see what happens. I'm honestly stunned at how some people behave in the forums...
just to be sure, we want to give DYP a pretty-prettty badge for this, right

[Tim-Opolis]

Your condemn would pass for any feeder or sinker.

They're allowed to supress ad-spam and most people are glad that they do.

I'm for getting ad-spam banned completely.

So- AGAINST

I have looked under both the rules and guides. You are right to say that this condemnation is appropriate. However, if people are living in feeder/sinker regions and do not like the ad-spam, wouldn't it be a no brainer that they should leave to a founding region. Of course in founding regions ad-spam is zero tolerance.

What I mean by that is that you could use it on any feeder. Not that it's appropriate. As for living there. Have you ever considered the fact that the feeders and sinkers have communities too.

It seems to me that you believe feeders should just be giant ad-boards as they were in the pre-supression era

But: I'll vote FOR if it goes to vote. Just so Lazarus can have that sexy badge

[Crazy girl]

Someone could write a better resolution for Laz if they're interested in the badge though.

[Drop Your Pants]

Anyone willing to write a better one?

[Lemmingtopias]

We would rather Lazarus were commended for their efforts against RMB spam. RMB spam, even if in a feeder/sinker, is rude. It is also a completely useless method of recruiting.