[PASSED] Condemn Punk Reloaded

[Southern Bellz]

It's really sad you have to keep comparing yourself to me.

I really don't have to defend myself to you, but it isn't really some sick burn you have when you keep bringing up the coup. In fact it shows just how pathetic and desperate you are to attempt to shift the negative attention from yourself to me.

I'm very proud of my time as delegate in The South Pacific, and I made a mistake sure. But the difference between me and you Punk, is the way I handled my mistake. I took accountability for my actions, and corrected them. I'm really over the situation, because I put the past in the past, while you seem to like to re-open wounds and then pour salt in on it.

[Casta Nal]

It's really sad you have to keep comparing yourself to me.

I really don't have to defend myself to you, but it isn't really some sick burn you have when you keep bringing up the coup. In fact it shows just how pathetic and desperate you are to attempt to shift the negative attention from yourself to me.

I'm very proud of my time as delegate in The South Pacific, and I made a mistake sure. But the difference between me and you Punk, is the way I handled my mistake. I took accountability for my actions, and corrected them. I'm really over the situation, because I put the past in the past, while you seem to like to re-open wounds and then pour salt in on it.

Someone was served.

[Punk Reloaded]

It's really sad you have to keep comparing yourself to me.

I really don't have to defend myself to you, but it isn't really some sick burn you have when you keep bringing up the coup. In fact it shows just how pathetic and desperate you are to attempt to shift the negative attention from yourself to me.

I'm very proud of my time as delegate in The South Pacific, and I made a mistake sure. But the difference between me and you Punk, is the way I handled my mistake. I took accountability for my actions, and corrected them. I'm really over the situation, because I put the past in the past, while you seem to like to re-open wounds and then pour salt in on it.

Bellz, you realize that the thrust of this resolution is about the coup of The South Pacific and the West's, specifically the actions I took during that time. It's not the 'past'. If it is, why is AMOM trudging up the past to reopen wounds and pour salt in on it as you say, and more importantly why would you seek to judge someone in a way you wish not to be judged? If you were really over this situation, you'd move on from it instead of continuing on your campaign to spread falsehoods. All I have ever said, is that you were inactive and that inaction allowed the region to be couped. In your quote above you're not disputing this point and hate to break it to you again, that's what the war is all about.

Further, when your condemnation came up if I was looking to pour salt on your wounds I would have voted for your condemnation. I didn't.

Today, TSP and TWP were in a cease fire until I ended it a few days ago. A cease fire is a pause on a war not an end. I've waited to hear back from your government regarding peace and am still waiting. Ending the cease fire was the only way I knew would get results and look where we are.

I have offered for others to negotiate peace and am cautiously optimistic that either candidate in TSP demonstrates a greater ability to be responsive than your regime did and Topid's also demonstrated. I have no desire to paint you in a negative light at all. I am only looking at your actions, the actions of Topid, and hoping that the next delegate chooses a different course. TWP has always and will always be open to peace. But, your government will need to be much more responsive than it has shown since Topid became delegate. If not, the war will continue to be in the present and not truly moved to the past as I would like.

[A mean old man]

Further, when your condemnation came up if I was looking to pour salt on your wounds I would have voted for your condemnation. I didn't.

Good thing, too, considering the overwhelming majority of TWP WA voters voted against it.

I have offered for others to negotiate peace and am cautiously optimistic that either candidate in TSP demonstrates a greater ability to be responsive than your regime did and Topid's also demonstrated. I have no desire to paint you in a negative light at all. I am only looking at your actions, the actions of Topid, and hoping that the next delegate chooses a different course. TWP has always and will always be open to peace. But, your government will need to be much more responsive than it has shown since Topid became delegate. If not, the war will continue to be in the present and not truly moved to the past as I would like.

I heard last time that you had made demands of TSP's government last time negotiations took place (or failed to). What exactly to are the terms of this "peace?"

[Punk Reloaded]

AMOM,

Demands were made. TSP complied with those demands at the time.

I do not plan to negotiate peace terms in this conflict with anyone not a duly appointed representative of TSP's government.

But I appreciate the offer.

[Daynor]

You said you wanted to negotiate on IRC. I was on that IRC at least once every three days, usually one every day, from the time I was elected delegate till now.

You got on once. You talked for maybe ten minutes and then left. You said you would be back. I have heard no one say you came back at all up until the end of your ceasefire, and I certainly never saw you logged in our channel. I was still waiting to hear from you, on IRC, where you said I should be expecting you. At which point I would have gladly agreed to end the war at any point up until you cancellation of the cease fire.

Now, as the elected delegate of the South Pacific the answer you are waiting on is this, be it as delegate or as a citizen, I have no interest what-so-ever in hearing from you or your region in an official or unofficial manner from now until the end of time. I will forever oppose any communication between the West and South. This is a tear I don't see the point in mending.

[Punk Reloaded]

Well, I did come back. You weren't there.

I also sent you a TG...you replied you had better things to do. I had not intention to chase you. I sent an emissary - nothing.

I am presently saying I am open to peace.

You are presently saying:

I will forever oppose any communication between the West and South.

I guess this was the case all along.

...and I'm the one being condemned.

[Daynor]

I never said I had better things to do, that is a bold faced lie.

As you know, you sent me a telegram asking when I could get on IRC. I said I was about to leave for Arkansas for the weekend, not that I had "better things to do" in fact, I didn't get on NS at all that weekend, and had no opportunity to get on IRC without my computer. You then said it would have to wait one to two weeks, but then never got back with me when you got back from whatever you were doing for two weeks.

Habitually from the stories I've heard of TWP, you talk big of peace talks or whatever effort you are going to attempt next, but then put remarkably little effort into whatever you do and when it fails you attempt to distract everyone with a new effort. Inactive delegate? Err... LOOK! New Constitution? The thing is flawed and an utter failure? Err... LOOK! War in TSP. Nothing came from the war? Err... LOOK! Peace talks... Never actually made it to the table? Err... LOOK! NS Republic (again)... Idea still taken with great mocking? Err... LOOK! I'm ending the cease fire! Now, when this doesn't turn out to be half of what you want it to be because you never actually do anything about it we will get to see what you think you can distract people with next. Which is somewhat humourous, because it isn't like anyone has actually magically forgotten your track record. Trying to go back and make it look like you put more effort into them than you did won't work any better. We all remember.

[Casta Nal]

Man you guys are all very bitter to each other.

[Daynor]

Man you guys are all very bitter to each other.

War will do that. As would frequent lies or at least misstatements of intentions or devotion toward peace.

In a few days I will have no reason to ever utter the phrase The West Pacific as any more than a place where I recruit nations from. I anxiously await that time, however, until then I'm calling it like I see it. Which I'm pretty reliable at doing.

[Casta Nal]

NS War causes so much hate, real war most be crazy.

[Punk Reloaded]

Daynor,

So you sent someone to our embassy after the cease fire to get a hold of us to forge a peace accord?

I must have missed them. I made attempts and they were ignored. i tried to reach out to your government in multiple ways. Nothing. I'm not going to chase your government and by your own admission you're not going to work towards it.

Why not call my 'bluff'? I'm calling for peace...let's talk. If I really don't want peace I'll just block it, right? But if we do so in front of the world to see, I believe they'll be surprised at who's actually really interested in peace and who's interested in cheap talk.

If being inactive means having the most endorsements of all the feeders (most days anyway), welcoming about a dozen regions into our Republic, and consistently maintaining a lively RMB, then call us The Inactives.

[A mean old man]

AMOM,

Demands were made. TSP complied with those demands at the time.

I do not plan to negotiate peace terms in this conflict with anyone not a duly appointed representative of TSP's government.

But I appreciate the offer.

You didn't answer the question.
...and I'm not interested in negotiating peace with you, I just want an answer to the question.

[Topid]

So, a few days after the big ending of the cease fire because you wanted war with The South Pacific you would like me, the outgoing delegate to sit down with you, the delegate who only supports peace when it might distract your constituents from whatever you've failed to do this week, then walk out and leave my predecessor with a new fanged friend?

No.

Not just because you need to negotiate how TSP and TWP will act toward one another under a new administration with that new administration itself, not the outgoing one, but also because IMO any peace treaty would be overturned within a month when you need a convenient distraction again.

EDIT: Pretend Daynor said this.

[Punk Reloaded]

AMOM,

Demands were made. TSP complied with those demands at the time.

I do not plan to negotiate peace terms in this conflict with anyone not a duly appointed representative of TSP's government.

But I appreciate the offer.

You didn't answer the question.
...and I'm not interested in negotiating peace with you, I just want an answer to the question.

i did answer it....but let me re-answer

you asked what the peace terms are? Because i have not been able to negotiate with the present TSP del, there are no terms. Once i am able to negotiate with somebody in TSP who is authorized, we collectively shall establish the terms much like HEM and I did with the cease fire (sorry, that wasn't a failure).

Any good negotiator will be flexible in negotiations and it would be quite foolish to disclose potential terms with anyone not involved in the negotiations as disclosure could harm the actual negotiations. So I won't. But if you read the war declaration you'll be able to see where our interests lie and negotiations will certainly include those talking points.


Daynor,

If the people of TSP were fine with their outgoing delegate negotiating peace, then I have no problems beginning discussions. Indeed, that's all I wanted.

[A mean old man]

Ugh. There are reasons I wanted to know the terms, mainly because if they involve you demanding something of TSP then that's just ridiculous. I had heard through TSPers that your "negotiations" involved TSP making changes according to TWP's terms, which was one reason that they would not work. But whatever; it's impossible to get a straight answer out of you.

I guess this was the case all along.

...and I'm the one being condemned.

You did make the tear, Punk.

[Punk Reloaded]

I also extended the branch, AMOM. You've got to tell the whole story.

The terms set forth in the cease fire were mutually agreed. My big 'demand' was for Bellz to visit our embassy, which she eventually did. I don't recall anything we 'demanded' not getting addressed.

I'm sure the TSP'ers were upset that TWP had the audacity to declare war on them in the first place.

[Daynor]

Well when you actually did gen on IRC, you did say you could not support relations with a region that put Sedge on trial for actions that were dead and buried. In fact that was the end of our conversation pretty much.

BTW Punk, TNP's speaker of the assembly filed a complaint with the Attorney General on August fourth against JAL aka Durk for his ejections when he was delegate. Where is the outrage about that? It is the same. Unless that outrage was just a convenient excuse, that is.

[Sheepatropolis]

I think it's more an issue that TSP has been continually asked to appease your demands Punk, or expected to chase you to find out what these 'terms' are. You say you want peace, yet you lack the humility to come to TSP with an offer of it. Instead we continually get invited to make peace by you. It's as if the only peace you're interested in is one where TSP is on its knees.

Not so much a peace but a surrender.

I don't blame Topid for giving up. It's a never-ending stalemate because you expect us to appease you, come to you, and that just isn't going to happen.

You talk peace but you really mean 'your peace'.

[Kanaia]

I don't recall anything we 'demanded' not getting addressed.

So then why end the cease-fire?

[Punk Reloaded]

I think it's more an issue that TSP has been continually asked to appease your demands Punk, or expected to chase you to find out what these 'terms' are. You say you want peace, yet you lack the humility to come to TSP with an offer of it. Instead we continually get invited to make peace by you. It's as if the only peace you're interested in is one where TSP is on its knees.

Not so much a peace but a surrender.

I don't blame Topid for giving up. It's a never-ending stalemate because you expect us to appease you, come to you, and that just isn't going to happen.

You talk peace but you really mean 'your peace'.

What the heck is 'my peace'?

I sent Darkesia because I'm banned on your forums. I'd have gone there myself easily. I telegrammed Topid. I put forth effort that I don't believe was returned. Still, Topid, you can't answer when you or someone else came to our embassy to reach out to us. Heck, when did you telegram me first for peace? It didn't happen.

I took proactive steps towards peace, Topid/Daynor did not.

And Topid - I actually just found out about JAL and was equally nonplussed about it. Actually, I SUPPORT Sedge's actions in TSP, but didn't support JAL's but there has to be a statute of limitations. From all accounts he seems to be remorseful of his actions and if a trial should have happened it should have occurred then.

That's armchair opinion. The laws of TNP can rule, there's been no coup because of inactivity as the case in your region.

I may not agree with the proceedings but they are not putting their citizens at risk via inactivity so there's no need to get involved.

I came on IRC a few times after and didn't see you. Even before, it was not easy to get a hold of you. I gave up and believed if you wanted a peace you'd respond to the overture I had already made. It never happened. I thought you might do what I did by coming to our embassy. Nope. How about a telegram? Nope.

I waited...and waited...and waited.

I was done waiting and at long last we speak. We even wouldn't be speaking now had I not made the first move. The citizens of TSP deserve better.

Kanania - Good question. A cease fire is only a stay on a war. I'd like something more permanent. Normal methods of communication weren't achieving that end...You see how ending the cease fire has at least allowed me to speak with TSP's delegate. There needs to be something permanent, and as i said, we don't have to like each other but I want closure to this.

[Metania]

Punk has failed to disappoint me. Contrary to his statement, he clearly is becoming more and more frayed at the ends as the condemnation nears approval.

Good work, Punk. I knew you could do it.

[Daynor]

Except, you know, in reality TNP was couped because Shoeless Joe claimed TNP was inactive just a couple months before JAL's coup.

Also HEM is the foreign minister. I know he was on TWP's board to some extent. I did not log into TWP's boards much at all, and am not going to. Shouldn't need to. I have no PMs from anyone in TWP in my inbox, but I do know I answered every telegram you or Dark sent me sent me during my term as delegate.

So the fact that I was hard to get a hold of is another bold-faced lie. As I suspect is the fact that you logged into our IRC more than twice, but that one, alas, I cannot contest to. Once again, I was on IRC quite a bit during my term. I don't have the technical ability to set mine so I never log off, so I am only online when I am actually sitting at my computer. But that was quite a bit over summer.

[Southern Bellz]

Punk has failed to disappoint me. Contrary to his statement, he clearly is becoming more and more frayed at the ends as the condemnation nears approval.

Good work, Punk. I knew you could do it.

This next song goes out to Punk D:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iG5d7V_J ... re=related

[Punk Reloaded]

Punk has failed to disappoint me. Contrary to his statement, he clearly is becoming more and more frayed at the ends as the condemnation nears approval.

Good work, Punk. I knew you could do it.

Frayed?

You haven't seen frayed. Where shall I send your invitation?

I guess saying that this condemnation is welcomed is not sufficient for you guys. Oh well.

TSP Peace door is still open. Your leadership is choosing not to walk to through it.