[PASSED] Condemn The Kraven Corporation

[Estruia]

Opposed. War is war. Innocents die because of war. What these wars are started over are not our business. I will not buy into the thought of being so self-absorbed that we think we have the right to pass judgement upon other people.

I am a firm believer in Non-Intervetionalism and Isolationism, therefore I repeat, my vote will be Opposed. May Kraven continue to live how they wish. Freedom is essential to being Human.

That is,live-and die-how their self-appointed and self-perpetuated leaders wish?

Our position is that freedom regards first and foremost individuals.A nation is composed of individuals.If the individuals are not free,the nation is not free.

Had I wanted your position, I would have asked for it, Sir. If the leaders are not free to do as they wish, then the nation itself is not free. The individuals may be as free as they wish, but if the leader's dreams and aspirations are repressed then there is no freedom to be had.

[The nine cities]

Will this deter other people from doing the same or is Kraven Corporation just going to hold the condemnation as a badge?

If KC is going to hold it as a badge then this condemnation is worthless.

Nothing is worthless. If the Kraven Corporation sees this as good thing then so be it. If not then the condemnation is proven valid. Either way it holds merit.

I disagree, its not punishing them and surely that is the main purpose of this?

[Wiztopia]

You got another vote for against from me. I always vote against on this stuff since it's all pointless.

[Warzone Codger]

I assume The Kraven Corp, being as good a roleplayer as he is said to be, will roleplay being condemned appropriately and not troll about being 'proud' of the badge.

In this case I would not be concerned about that.

[Jeux II]

I assume The Kraven Corp, being as good a roleplayer as he is said to be, will roleplay being condemned appropriately and not troll about being 'proud' of the badge.

In this case I would not be concerned about that.

Agreed.

[Motuka]

The Red Room's stance is in favour of this condemnation, for once. The Kraven Corporation's actions make it a threat to the world around it, and its support from powerful allies renders it untouchable by conventional means. Hopefully this shall be a good first step to convince the global community of its genocidal nature, distance it from its allies and pave the way for its eventual forceful dissolution.

- J.K.

OOC: I'll confess, I'm voting for this entirely for OOC reasons: Kraven's put a lot of work into being an evil, oppressive country -- to the point of uniting about half the II community against him in 2005-6, and surviving -- and deserves some recognition for it. Sure, anyone can claim to be a totalitarian dictatorship that represses human rights and conquers and strip-mines small countries for fun, but doing so in such a way that you become an object of widespread fear and reverence -- Milograd probably wasn't even old enough to use the forums when Kraven went into semi-retirement, yet his memory was persistent enough for this condemnation to filter down -- whilst continuing to be a sufficiently good RPer that people still want to play with you takes dedication and skill. Maybe this is my built-in RPer bias speaking.

[Distruzio]

His majesty King Distruzio Antonio Medici of the Most Serene Anarcho-Monarchist Realm of Distruzio wishes to convey with utmost clarity his dismay and shock at the evidence put forth in favor of this act of condemnation. The Kraven Corporation is truly a violent oppressor and source of worldwide political, economic, and social distortions. Although he is loathe to lay judgment on another nation, either favorably or otherwise, Antonio feels compelled to cast his vote to condemn the Kraven Corporation. He will henceforth retire to pray for divine mercy and grace for the victims of the atrocities committed by the Kraven Corporation.

-In liberty

[Albert the Fourth]

Roleplaying = activity most of nationstates doesn't care about = waste of everybody's time imho = against

[Pyshoria]

Roleplaying = activity most of nationstates doesn't care about = waste of everybody's time imho = against

Well put. AGAINST

[A mean old man]

Roleplaying = activity most of nationstates doesn't care about = waste of everybody's time imho = against

What an unfortunate attitude. Just because you don't care about something doesn't mean that the great portion of the rest of NS's players that do aren't worthy of acknowledgement.

[Lowell Leber]

Opposed. War is war. Innocents die because of war. What these wars are started over are not our business. I will not buy into the thought of being so self-absorbed that we think we have the right to pass judgement upon other people.

I am a firm believer in Non-Intervetionalism and Isolationism, therefore I repeat, my vote will be Opposed. May Kraven continue to live how they wish. Freedom is essential to being Human.

Yes, may the Kraven Reich continue to "live how they wish" as long as they choose to live with your nation under their jackboots. The Kraven Reich is more than a mere nuiscance to the international community, they are probably one of the greatest threats to civilized nations in the whole NS universe. While this condemnation will most likely have no effect on the policies of the Kraven High Command, they will at least no that NS Universe, and in paticular the WA, are watching their re-emergence into international affairs.

With Alarm at Some Nations whose Heads are in the Sand,
Ms. Abigail McGuire.
High Commissoner for WA Affairs,
The Armed Republic of Lowell Leber.

[Wiztopia]

Opposed. War is war. Innocents die because of war. What these wars are started over are not our business. I will not buy into the thought of being so self-absorbed that we think we have the right to pass judgement upon other people.

I am a firm believer in Non-Intervetionalism and Isolationism, therefore I repeat, my vote will be Opposed. May Kraven continue to live how they wish. Freedom is essential to being Human.

Yes, may the Kraven Reich continue to "live how they wish" as long as they choose to live with your nation under their jackboots. The Kraven Reich is more than a mere nuiscance to the international community, they are probably one of the greatest threats to civilized nations in the whole NS universe. While this condemnation will most likely have no effect on the policies of the Kraven High Command, they will at least no that NS Universe, and in paticular the WA, are watching their re-emergence into international affairs.

With Alarm at Some Nations whose Heads are in the Sand,
Ms. Abigail McGuire.
High Commissoner for WA Affairs,
The Armed Republic of Lowell Leber.

OOC: Tell me how they are a threat to the Nationstates universe. Are they going to nuke a bunch of text? As I said in the last thread this entire thing is pointless and useless since nothing in the real world similar to it exists.

[Lowell Leber]

OOC- Uhh in RL the UN would condemn a nation that acted in any way close to Kraven. And if your implying that Roleplay is not something the Security Council should handle I would have to disagree with you. NS and the SC is not just a "gameplayers" only club.

[Wiztopia]

OOC- Uhh in RL the UN would condemn a nation that acted in any way close to Kraven. And if your implying that Roleplay is not something the Security Council should handle I would have to disagree with you. NS and the SC is not just a "gameplayers" only club.

OOC: Really now? Show me a nation that has been condemned. They also don't commend nations.

[Eternal Yerushalayim]

OOC: When the WA starts acting like the UN, we'll be too busy with crop statistics and all to care about condemnations...

[Lowell Leber]

OOC- The UN Security Council, while not explicitly using the word Condemn, does pass resolutions concerning threats to international securityhttp://www.un.org/Docs/sc/unsc_resolutions11.htm. EDIT: See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Security_Council_Resolution_84The fact that the RL UNSC is inho weak due to the veto power of the 5 pemanent members does not mean that the WASC has to suffer from the same weakness. Furthurmore even as a NATSOV oriented nation, I dont belive that the WASC should turn a blind eye to such wanton agression and genocide as practiced by the Kraven Corporation.

[Crazy girl]

Okay, that's enough off topicness. Back to discussing the proposal, you can continue this discussion elsewhere.

[Andorianus]

FOR.

I'm one of the few people who knows a bit of Kraven's history. He surely is worthy of a condemnation, looking at all the violence in Kraven's history.

[Palentine WA Office]

Absolutely against! Great googly moogly! everybody need some kind of hobby. Mine's hobnailing my liver, and playing ride the kinky pony with catgirsl of loose and negotiable virtue. so this ones a bit mote bloodthirsty....to each his own.
Excelsior,
Sen. Horatio Sulla

[The Bruce]

Roleplaying = activity most of nationstates doesn't care about = waste of everybody's time imho = against

What an unfortunate attitude. Just because you don't care about something doesn't mean that the great portion of the rest of NS's players that do aren't worthy of acknowledgement.

Got that right. I much prefer this type of resolution in the Security Council than the ones it's been locked into for the last month, in reaction to recent gameplay events. A lot of people don't seem to realize that NationStates is a multi-faceted experience for its players, including social networking, so called gameplay (invader-defender contests), role-playing, issues and world census jockeying, the World Assembly, and a wide variety of delegate drinking games.

This condemnation is exactly the sort of thing that the Security Council should be spending its time looking at. It's a well written condemnation of a nation, based on well documented role-playing; so exactly what we should be spending our time on.

[Going Postal]

What an unfortunate attitude. Just because you don't care about something doesn't mean that the great portion of the rest of NS's players that do aren't worthy of acknowledgement.

Got that right. I much prefer this type of resolution in the Security Council than the ones it's been locked into for the last month, in reaction to recent gameplay events. A lot of people don't seem to realize that NationStates is a multi-faceted experience for its players, including social networking, so called gameplay (invader-defender contests), role-playing, issues and world census jockeying, the World Assembly, and a wide variety of delegate drinking games.

This condemnation is exactly the sort of thing that the Security Council should be spending its time looking at. It's a well written condemnation of a nation, based on well documented role-playing; so exactly what we should be spending our time on.

Aye! I agree with what the Bruce almighty says but I am still voting against a fellow Corporation being condemned.

[Venesklen]

Good evening everyone, I am Brazilian, and some things are being portrayed here I could not understand, such as one of the reasons that the nation accused is convicted, ask for those with patience, who can explain to me please.

Thanks:

Royal Majesty Olsen Barg

[Milograd]

Good evening everyone, I am Brazilian, and some things are being portrayed here I could not understand, such as one of the reasons that the nation accused is convicted, ask for those with patience, who can explain to me please.

Thanks:

Royal Majesty Olsen Barg

OoC: Eu suponho que você é brasileiro na vida real? (choppy)

[Venesklen]

Yes,I am Brasilian,actually I am a German Brazilian ,but ,can someone explain to me?

[Venesklen]

I'm confused