[DEFEATED] Condemn Antifa

[Southern Republic of Dixie]

Hopefully we see this proposal again.
It does need some clarification on how it would condemn them but if it does come back I would support it as I still am.

[Southern Republic of Dixie]

i am frankly SHOCKED at all of the people with confederate and gadsen flags coming out of the woodwork to support this garbage proposal

Ouch that hurts

[Christian Confederation]

i am frankly SHOCKED at all of the people with confederate and gadsen flags coming out of the woodwork to support this garbage proposal

Ouch that hurts

Nice flag.

[Ransium]

Please don’t triple post in the future, it’s a form of spam. In the future, if you want to add more content you can edit the last post you’ve made. You can also quote several different people in a single post. Thanks.

[Maowi]

Please don’t triple post in the future, it’s a form of spam. In the future, if you want to add more content you can edit the last post you’ve made. You can also quote several different people in a single post. Thanks.

It was a double post not a triple post - it's just that their flags are practically identical lol

[Ransium]

Right sorry, same thing applies but don’t double post. Thanks!

[Christian Confederation]

Please don’t triple post in the future, it’s a form of spam. In the future, if you want to add more content you can edit the last post you’ve made. You can also quote several different people in a single post. Thanks.

Why would I complement myself?

[Lord Dominator]

Please don’t triple post in the future, it’s a form of spam. In the future, if you want to add more content you can edit the last post you’ve made. You can also quote several different people in a single post. Thanks.

Why would I complement myself?

Ransium said content, not compliment

[Ransium]

Please don’t triple post in the future, it’s a form of spam. In the future, if you want to add more content you can edit the last post you’ve made. You can also quote several different people in a single post. Thanks.

Why would I complement myself?

I’ve long stopped trying to subscribe motivations to user’s posts . I wasn’t reading super closely, obviously, I just saw a newcomer multi-post and wanted to make sure it didn’t become a habit.

[The Reddington States]

You know, if you were looking for evidence to support your proposal, then I don't understand why you didn't come to me since Northern Redlands is the epitome of a non-fascist region invaded over allegations of fascism. I mean, seriously, they used a politically incorrect joke (that was made as a result of Nazi accusations) as a means to raid. Given that this proposal is going to fail miserably, you may want to search for evidence in the community backing up your proposal since everyone who voted no can't see a single downside of NS Antifa. Asking me would be a good place to start.

[North Saitama]

1. Yes, it is that simple; doing something, anything, is disproportionate, as mere advocacy is, on its own, physically harmless and abstract, while actions are concrete and have a physical effect. Kicking-over a fascist's sand castle is, therefore, unjust, as you retaliated against their abhorrent-but-abstract ideas with concrete physical action.

2. It doesn't mean, however, that physical action is acceptable or just. Refusing to hire a neo-Nazi is different from punching a neo-Nazi; in the former case, it is refusing to interact with him (non-action), while, in the latter case, it is physically harming him (action).

In case the message isn't clear, the point is that the words don't matter; saying "exterminate <insert group>", on its own, physically harms exactly zero members of said group. Until the threshold of action is passed, there is no justification for doing harm.

Anyone who can't understand that there are both physical and nonphysical forms of violence must not have had creative enough bullies in middle school.

My bullies in middle school were actually 100% verbal in their harassment, and never got in trouble. Which further extends my point; their words did no harm to me whatsoever, and, today, I don't even think about them, nor even really care that they tormented me.


While I am at it, I should also mention embassies. While some regions are tight with their embassy policies, others are much more liberal. In Japan, we are more liberal with whom we have embassies with; we even have embassies with communist regions, when most of our region is more pro-capitalist. By Antifa's standard, though, we would be communist, and, if they were McCarthyist instead of anti-fascist, we would be subject to their harassment.

Which also leads to my dismay with Antifa playing judge, jury, and executioner. Antifa has taken it upon themselves to enforce their own international laws, and trample on with jackboots whatever regions they deem "fascist", with many regions' crimes being simply being right-wing, as shown. Then, not only are they not condemned, but they are actually applauded, for being interventionist jackboots, because "duh notzeez".

[Christian Confederation]

You know, if you were looking for evidence to support your proposal, then I don't understand why you didn't come to me since Northern Redlands is the epitome of a non-fascist region invaded over allegations of fascism. I mean, seriously, they used a politically incorrect joke (that was made as a result of Nazi accusations) as a means to raid. Given that this proposal is going to fail miserably, you may want to search for evidence in the community backing up your proposal since everyone who voted no can't see a single downside of NS Antifa. Asking me would be a good place to start.

O hi Red plus this may help.
https://www.nationstates.net/page=displ ... start=1475

[Oceanian Empire]

GRUG BASH FASH

#LongLiveKekistan

[Rat Piss]

Which also leads to my dismay with Antifa playing judge, jury, and executioner. Antifa has taken it upon themselves to enforce their own international laws, and trample on with jackboots whatever regions they deem "fascist", with many regions' crimes being simply being right-wing, as shown. Then, not only are they not condemned, but they are actually applauded, for being interventionist jackboots, because "duh notzeez".

Its a job somebody should be doing, and unless you are recommending we come together and form some sort of committee to discuss which nations are endorsing nazism, then I'm glad Antifa is taking care of it for us. What alternatives are you suggesting? If it's that we let bygones be bygones, then, well, sorry, but no matter what you're opinion on the matter is, that's not going to happen. Fascisms own repugnant nature will always be instigating this kind of blow back.

You may not like Antifa acting as judge jury and executioner, but but in this context? Those are necessary roles.

[North Saitama]

Which also leads to my dismay with Antifa playing judge, jury, and executioner. Antifa has taken it upon themselves to enforce their own international laws, and trample on with jackboots whatever regions they deem "fascist", with many regions' crimes being simply being right-wing, as shown. Then, not only are they not condemned, but they are actually applauded, for being interventionist jackboots, because "duh notzeez".

Its a job somebody should be doing, and unless you are recommending we come together and form some sort of committee to discuss which nations are endorsing nazism, then I'm glad Antifa is taking care of it for us. What alternatives are you suggesting? If it's that we let bygones be bygones, then, well, sorry, but no matter what you're opinion on the matter is, that's not going to happen. Fascisms own repugnant nature will always be instigating this kind of blow back.

You may not like Antifa acting as judge jury and executioner, but but in this context? Those are necessary roles.

Have you even been paying attention to my whole case? This is not a job someone needs to do; this is a crime, that needs to stop entirely. Fascism may be a horrible and abhorrent ideology, but punishing them for having an opinion, without acting upon it, is also bad. Then you have non-fascists, who end-up being persecuted by Antifa, anyway, being harassed, having their regions stolen from them, all for the crime of being dubiously claimed as fascist by Antifa.

Antifa acting as judge, jury, and executioner in any context is bad, as they are enforcing their own laws, and forcing their own views upon all of NationStates. That is not justice; that is a mockery of justice, and authoritarian.

[Wrapper]

I agree with this. Antifa spreads propaganda and invades regions under the guise of “we’re removing fascism and making the world better” when all they’re doing is destabilizing peaceful right wing regions and doing more damage then the alt-right they try to fight and leaving them an empty husk. It’s time to end them once and far all.

Perhaps the answer, instead of taking it to the Security Council — many members of whom view condemnations as a desirable badge of honor (ahem) — maybe you should get like-minded GPers together and create an army to counteract Antifa.

[North Saitama]

I agree with this. Antifa spreads propaganda and invades regions under the guise of “we’re removing fascism and making the world better” when all they’re doing is destabilizing peaceful right wing regions and doing more damage then the alt-right they try to fight and leaving them an empty husk. It’s time to end them once and far all.

Perhaps the answer, instead of taking it to the Security Council — many members of whom view condemnations as a desirable badge of honor (ahem) — maybe you should get like-minded GPers together and create an army to counteract Antifa.

Then that will just be condemned or portrayed as fascist.

[Impaled Nazarene]

I agree with this. Antifa spreads propaganda and invades regions under the guise of “we’re removing fascism and making the world better” when all they’re doing is destabilizing peaceful right wing regions and doing more damage then the alt-right they try to fight and leaving them an empty husk. It’s time to end them once and far all.

Perhaps the answer, instead of taking it to the Security Council — many members of whom view condemnations as a desirable badge of honor (ahem) — maybe you should get like-minded GPers together and create an army to counteract Antifa.

Because being Anti Anti-Fascist is literally pro-fascism.

[Ceolophysia]

Perhaps the answer, instead of taking it to the Security Council — many members of whom view condemnations as a desirable badge of honor (ahem) — maybe you should get like-minded GPers together and create an army to counteract Antifa.

Because being Anti Anti-Fascist is literally pro-fascism.

It's being against a movement that just happens to be called "Antifa." Despite their name, they do not own the concept of opposition to fascism, and a person is not automatically part of this movement because of their opposition to fascism. A person who opposes this specific movement is also not necessarily a member of the group they are intended to fight, simply due to the fact that they are against it.
Please stop making arguments based on the literal definition of the name "Antifa." You don't prove a point. It's just like calling National Socialism left-wing because it has the word "socialism" in it. National socialism isn't left-wing, and Anti-Antifa isn't Anti-Anti-Fascism.

(And yes, I am voting against this condemnation.)

[Impaled Nazarene]

Because being Anti Anti-Fascist is literally pro-fascism.

It's being against a movement that just happens to be called "Antifa." Despite their name, they do not own the concept of opposition to fascism, and a person is not automatically part of this movement because of their opposition to fascism. A person who opposes this specific movement is also not necessarily a member of the group they are intended to fight, simply due to the fact that they are against it.
Please stop making arguments based on the literal definition of the name "Antifa." You don't prove a point. It's just like calling National Socialism left-wing because it has the word "socialism" in it. National socialism isn't left-wing, and Anti-Antifa isn't Anti-Anti-Fascism.

(And yes, I am voting against this condemnation.)

Screams in poor english

[Ceolophysia]

It's being against a movement that just happens to be called "Antifa." Despite their name, they do not own the concept of opposition to fascism, and a person is not automatically part of this movement because of their opposition to fascism. A person who opposes this specific movement is also not necessarily a member of the group they are intended to fight, simply due to the fact that they are against it.
Please stop making arguments based on the literal definition of the name "Antifa." You don't prove a point. It's just like calling National Socialism left-wing because it has the word "socialism" in it. National socialism isn't left-wing, and Anti-Antifa isn't Anti-Anti-Fascism.

(And yes, I am voting against this condemnation.)

Screams in poor english

Anti-"Anti-Fascist Action" is not the same as Anti-Anti-Fascist.

[North Saitama]

Perhaps the answer, instead of taking it to the Security Council — many members of whom view condemnations as a desirable badge of honor (ahem) — maybe you should get like-minded GPers together and create an army to counteract Antifa.

Because being Anti Anti-Fascist is literally pro-fascism.

Then that will just be condemned or portrayed as fascist.

Point proven; if you dare oppose either the NS Antifa or the IRL Antifa, you will be labelled a fascist.

[Impaled Nazarene]

Because being Anti Anti-Fascist is literally pro-fascism.

Then that will just be condemned or portrayed as fascist.

Point proven; if you dare oppose either the NS Antifa or the IRL Antifa, you will be labelled a fascist.

Do you support fascism?

[North Saitama]

Point proven; if you dare oppose either the NS Antifa or the IRL Antifa, you will be labelled a fascist.

Do you support fascism?

No, but I am a libertarian, who believes in individual liberty so long as you don't physically interfere with someone else's liberty. And I am much more distrustful of the jackboots that march, no matter how far, than the jackboots that rest on a la-z-boy.

[Lord Dominator]

Huh, well you're/anti-antifa people are going through a lot of trouble of a group not accomplishing anything

Well we're bord and what to do something.

Oh, that's really going to help your case I'm sure