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Patriots or Loyalists?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Who would you declare for?

King George III (I have brought peace, freedom, justice, and prosperity... to my new empire!)
153
49%
George Washington (YOUR NEW EMPIRE?! My allegiance is to the republic TO DEMOCRACY!)
161
51%
 
Total votes : 314

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Infected Mushroom
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Corrupt Dictatorship

Patriots or Loyalists?

Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Jun 12, 2015 12:50 pm

You live in the North. Its the American Revolution. You would like to stay out of the war... but sometimes a man has to choose. Sometimes the world forces its way.

Who will you declare for? Do you answer the Crown's calling and join the English hosts? Or do you fight for the continental rebels? To put it another way: Will you fight for George... or will you fight for Washington (there is no middle ground)?

Do you fight for England or for the fledging republic?

I think if I lived in the 1700s and I had to pick a side, I would have fought for the Empire. I am by nature a very cautious individual and I greatly value loyalty. I would have viewed the American Revolution as an act of treason.

Who would you have fought for (WITHOUT the benefit of hindsight)?
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Fri Jun 12, 2015 12:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Old Tyrannia
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Postby Old Tyrannia » Fri Jun 12, 2015 12:56 pm

The only George I'd follow is my king. Slaveholding, tax-evading, native-massacring traitors don't exactly evoke my sympathy.
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Torisakia
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Postby Torisakia » Fri Jun 12, 2015 12:57 pm

Image


Well since there's no middle ground, I don't have an answer. If the American Revolution was an act of treason, I'd see no reason in fighting because no matter which side wins it won't turn out in my favor.
Last edited by Torisakia on Fri Jun 12, 2015 12:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Infected Mushroom
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Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:00 pm

Torisakia wrote:

Well since there's no middle ground, I don't have an answer. If the American Revolution was an act of treason, I'd see no reason in fighting because no matter which side wins it won't turn out in my favor.


well, it was treason from the English perspective

it might turn out in your favour, for example, you might retire from the war and go on to have a very successful high ranking military career.

I feel like if I lived during the day I would have predicted (incorrectly), that the Empire would prevail and that fighting for England makes more sense.

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Ban Ki Sun
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Postby Ban Ki Sun » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:03 pm

the trolls are already voting for the tyranny. cant believe it in the 21st century there are still people willing to accept someone as head of state based on a random birth.

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Infected Mushroom
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Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:13 pm

Ban Ki Sun wrote:the trolls are already voting for the tyranny. cant believe it in the 21st century there are still people willing to accept someone as head of state based on a random birth.


What?

Remember, this is without the benefit of hindsight. You have to assume you were raised in that culture. And in that culture loyalty to the Crown was a virtue (some people break out of that, others don't). From the standpoint of the time, its more likely that I would view the rebels as anarchists.
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Ban Ki Sun
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Postby Ban Ki Sun » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:16 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:What?

Remember, this is without the benefit of hindsight. You have to assume you were raised in that culture. And in that culture loyalty to the Crown was a virtue (some people break out of that, others don't). From the standpoint of the time, its more likely that I would view the rebels as anarchists.

k then, i would still help washington. because taxes are 2 high, because fuck england, a lot of americans at the time did NOT even have english ancestry. because empires were always bad. because most probably i would have been poor due to the fact that i wasnt born rich etc. washington would have given me a chance to make things better. the rebels would have fed me, maybe i could have even pursued a military career after the war, who knows.

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Grave_n_idle
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Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Grave_n_idle » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:17 pm

Infected Mushroom wrote:
Ban Ki Sun wrote:the trolls are already voting for the tyranny. cant believe it in the 21st century there are still people willing to accept someone as head of state based on a random birth.


What?

Remember, this is without the benefit of hindsight. You have to assume you were raised in that culture. And in that culture loyalty to the Crown was a virtue (some people break out of that, others don't). From the standpoint of the time, its more likely that I would view the rebels as anarchists.


As did most of the population. The 'revolution' was by no means representative of the population.
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Carriebean7
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Ex-Nation

Postby Carriebean7 » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:17 pm

I would like for the British to rule the world, and those american English speaking wrong football paying, freedom loving crazy folks ruined it, ruined, us...

btw Im american and I support British tyranny.
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Infected Mushroom
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:20 pm

Ban Ki Sun wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:What?

Remember, this is without the benefit of hindsight. You have to assume you were raised in that culture. And in that culture loyalty to the Crown was a virtue (some people break out of that, others don't). From the standpoint of the time, its more likely that I would view the rebels as anarchists.

k then, i would still help washington. because taxes are 2 high, because fuck england, a lot of americans at the time did NOT even have english ancestry. because empires were always bad. because most probably i would have been poor due to the fact that i wasnt born rich etc. washington would have given me a chance to make things better. the rebels would have fed me, maybe i could have even pursued a military career after the war, who knows.


I see...

Correct me if I'm wrong but I was under the impression the taxes only affected a minority (or at least a limited section) of merchants

No?
Last edited by Infected Mushroom on Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Pope Joan
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Postby Pope Joan » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:23 pm

Mad King George was doing very little to promote the welfare of the colonists. All he had going in his favor was the eternal fact that rebellion is risky.

I admire those who abandoned their properties and fled to Ontario and the Maritimes. Royalist feeling still runs strong there in some quarters. They, too, took a risk.

I would have stayed in place and joined the rebellion, simply because I abhor authority. Then I would have opposed that interloper, Hamilton.
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Infected Mushroom
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Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:25 pm

Pope Joan wrote:Mad King George was doing very little to promote the welfare of the colonists. All he had going in his favor was the eternal fact that rebellion is risky.

I admire those who abandoned their properties and fled to Ontario and the Maritimes. Royalist feeling still runs strong there in some quarters. They, too, took a risk.

I would have stayed in place and joined the rebellion, simply because I abhor authority. Then I would have opposed that interloper, Hamilton.


In my view, I think the colonists over-reacted.

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Telandra
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Ex-Nation

Postby Telandra » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:29 pm

Loyalty to the Crown is something unconditional.

Loyalists.
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Eastern Equestria
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Ex-Nation

Postby Eastern Equestria » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:30 pm

Ban Ki Sun wrote:the trolls are already voting for the tyranny. cant believe it in the 21st century there are still people willing to accept someone as head of state based on a random birth.


Pope Joan wrote:Mad King George was doing very little to promote the welfare of the colonists. All he had going in his favor was the eternal fact that rebellion is risky.

I admire those who abandoned their properties and fled to Ontario and the Maritimes. Royalist feeling still runs strong there in some quarters. They, too, took a risk.

I would have stayed in place and joined the rebellion, simply because I abhor authority. Then I would have opposed that interloper, Hamilton.


Indubitably. I'd have thrown my support behind the patriots as well.
Last edited by Eastern Equestria on Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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The Bluelandian Republic
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Ex-Nation

Postby The Bluelandian Republic » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:31 pm

Let's see. On one side you have an evil, racist, christian supremacist empire ruled by a tyrannical monarch whose solution to protests and boycotts is to use military force and on the other side you have a group of 13 oppressed colonies (racial and religious policy varied depending on the colony) fighting for independence from said evil empire.

I don't think I need to say anymore than that.

Granted, I may be biased as you can see by my flag ;)
Last edited by The Bluelandian Republic on Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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MERIZoC
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby MERIZoC » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:35 pm

Torisakia wrote:

This actually made me laugh out loud. A lot. So kudos. Now my family is giving me strange looks. :p

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MERIZoC
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Postby MERIZoC » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:36 pm

I'd fight against the Crown, for sure.

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Gun Manufacturers
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Postby Gun Manufacturers » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:37 pm

I would have sided with the colonists against the crown.
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Old Tyrannia
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Father Knows Best State

Postby Old Tyrannia » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:38 pm

Ban Ki Sun wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:What?

Remember, this is without the benefit of hindsight. You have to assume you were raised in that culture. And in that culture loyalty to the Crown was a virtue (some people break out of that, others don't). From the standpoint of the time, its more likely that I would view the rebels as anarchists.

k then, i would still help washington. because taxes are 2 high, because fuck england, a lot of americans at the time did NOT even have english ancestry. because empires were always bad. because most probably i would have been poor due to the fact that i wasnt born rich etc. washington would have given me a chance to make things better. the rebels would have fed me, maybe i could have even pursued a military career after the war, who knows.

The Bluelandian Republic wrote:Let's see. On one side you have an evil, racist, christian supremacist empire ruled by a tyrannical monarch whose solution to protests and boycotts is to use military force and on the other side you have a group of 13 oppressed colonies (racial and religious policy varied depending on the colony) fighting for independence from said evil empire.

I don't think I need to say anymore than that.

Granted, I may be biased as you can see by my flag ;)

Breaking news: Americans know fuck all about their own revolution, substitute the plot of Star Wars for reality. Also, it snowed in Siberia.

Additionally, I response to "The Bluelandian Republic" I should point out that the traitors were rebelling against Scotland as well. In fact, many of the most stridently royalist communities in the Colonies were made up of ex-Jacobite settlers.
"Classicist in literature, royalist in politics, and Anglo-Catholic in religion" (T.S. Eliot). Still, unaccountably, a NationStates Moderator.
"Have I done something for the general interest? Well then, I have had my reward. Let this always be present to thy mind, and never stop doing such good." - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations (Book XI, IV)
⚜ GOD SAVE THE KING

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Nirvash Type TheEND
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Ex-Nation

Postby Nirvash Type TheEND » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:41 pm

USA USA USA
Unreachable.

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Prussia-Steinbach
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Ex-Nation

Postby Prussia-Steinbach » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:51 pm

No middle ground? Really? Can't I run off and join the Indians?

Yeah, there ya go. The Americans were honestly way more fucked morally, for various reasons. I'll fight for Britain with the native Americans.
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Postby European Socialist Republic » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:54 pm

I'd start my own socialist revolution! Who's with me?
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The Bluelandian Republic
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Postby The Bluelandian Republic » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:55 pm

Old Tyrannia wrote:
Ban Ki Sun wrote:k then, i would still help washington. because taxes are 2 high, because fuck england, a lot of americans at the time did NOT even have english ancestry. because empires were always bad. because most probably i would have been poor due to the fact that i wasnt born rich etc. washington would have given me a chance to make things better. the rebels would have fed me, maybe i could have even pursued a military career after the war, who knows.

The Bluelandian Republic wrote:Let's see. On one side you have an evil, racist, christian supremacist empire ruled by a tyrannical monarch whose solution to protests and boycotts is to use military force and on the other side you have a group of 13 oppressed colonies (racial and religious policy varied depending on the colony) fighting for independence from said evil empire.

I don't think I need to say anymore than that.

Granted, I may be biased as you can see by my flag ;)

Breaking news: Americans know fuck all about their own revolution, substitute the plot of Star Wars for reality. Also, it snowed in Siberia.

Additionally, I response to "The Bluelandian Republic" I should point out that the traitors were rebelling against Scotland as well. In fact, many of the most stridently royalist communities in the Colonies were made up of ex-Jacobite settlers.



Only because they were forced to by the tyrannical English government.

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The Tricolour
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Ex-Nation

Postby The Tricolour » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:57 pm

USA! I'm from the US, so yeah.
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The Bluelandian Republic
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Postby The Bluelandian Republic » Fri Jun 12, 2015 1:59 pm

The Tricolour wrote:USA! I'm from the US, so yeah.


Congratulations.

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