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Police kill more whites than blacks analysis finds

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Kravanica
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Police kill more whites than blacks analysis finds

Postby Kravanica » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:23 am

No, seriously.

Nobel Prize-winning novelist Toni Morrison says she wants to see an officer shoot an unarmed white teenager in the back before agreeing that the “conversation about race” is over, but she almost certainly already has received her wish.

An analysis released last week shows that more white people died at the hands of law enforcement than those of any other race in the last two years, even as the Justice Department, social-justice groups and media coverage focus on black victims of police force.

“People keep saying, ‘We need to have a conversation about race,’” Ms. Morrison told the (U.K.) Telegraph in an April 19 interview.

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“This is the conversation. I want to see a cop shoot a white unarmed teenager in the back,” said Ms. Morrison, who also has won the Pulitzer Prize for her work, which includes the bestsellers “Beloved” and “Song of Solomon.” “And I want to see a white man convicted for raping a black woman. Then when you ask me, ‘Is it over?’, I will say yes.”

Her comments reflect a widespread view that blacks are routinely targeted by law enforcement while whites shot by police are a rarity. Outrage has surged in recent weeks over the high-profile deaths of black men at the hands of police, notably 50-year-old Walter Scott of South Carolina, who was shot in the back and killed April 4 as he tried to run away from an officer after a traffic stop.

The officer who shot him, Michael Slager, has been charged with murder, and the Justice Department is investigating the case for civil rights violations. Department officials announced Tuesday that they have opened a federal probe into the death of Freddie Gray, 25, who died Sunday from injuries sustained while in Baltimore police custody.

Meanwhile, the deaths of whites at the hands of law enforcement typically receive less attention, even when the case is shrouded in controversy. For example, Gilbert Collar, an 18-year-old white student at the University of South Alabama, was shot and killed while naked, unarmed and under the influence of drugs by a black police officer.

The officer, Trevis Austin, was cleared of wrongdoing in 2013 by a Mobile County grand jury in a case that received little media coverage outside Alabama. Mr. Collar’s parents filed a federal lawsuit last year against the officer.

As researchers are quick to point out, FBI data on police shootings by race is notoriously incomplete, which may explain why Peter Moskos, assistant professor at the John Jay College of Criminal Justice at the City University of New York, decided to use figures from the website Killed by Police.

Based on that data, Mr. Moskos reported that roughly 49 percent of those killed by officers from May 2013 to April 2015 were white, while 30 percent were black. He also found that 19 percent were Hispanic and 2 percent were Asian and other races.

His results, posted last week on his blog Cop in the Hood, arrived with several caveats, notably that 25 percent of the website’s data, which is drawn largely from news reports, failed to show the race of the person killed.

Killed by Police lists every death, justified or not, including those in which the officer had been wounded or acted in self-defense.

“The data doesn’t indicate which shootings are justified (the vast majority) and which are cold-blooded murder (not many, but some). And maybe that would vary by race. I don’t know, but I doubt it,” Mr. Moskos said on his blog.

Adjusted to take into account the racial breakdown of the U.S. population, he said black men are 3.5 times more likely to be killed by police than white men. But also adjusted to take into account the racial breakdown in violent crime, the data actually show that police are less likely to kill black suspects than white ones.

“If one adjusts for the racial disparity in the homicide rate or the rate at which police are feloniously killed, whites are actually more likely to be killed by police than blacks,” said Mr. Moskos, a former Baltimore cop and author of the book “Cop in the Hood.”

“Adjusted for the homicide rate, whites are 1.7 times more likely than blacks die at the hands of police,” he said. “Adjusted for the racial disparity at which police are feloniously killed, whites are 1.3 times more likely than blacks to die at the hands of police.”

Mr. Moskos listed two possible reasons for the racial disparity. The first is that police assigned to largely black neighborhoods face “more political fallout when they shoot, and thus receive better training and are less inclined to shoot.”

The second is that police assigned to black communities with high crime rates are more accustomed to dangerous situations and thus are more likely to be able to resolve them without resort to lethal force.

Figures on police shootings by race are thin on the ground, but Mr. Moskos’s results have some support: The investigative journalism website ProPublica came up with a similar percentage in an Oct. 10 article, reporting that 44 percent of all those killed by police were white, using FBI data from 1980 to 2012.

The fact-checking website PolitiFact concluded in August 2014 that police kill more whites than blacks after the claim was made by conservative commentator Michael Medved. PolitiFact cited data from the Centers for Disease Control on fatal injuries by “legal intervention” from 1999 to 2011.

“Over the span of more than a decade, 2,151 whites died by being shot by police compared to 1,130 blacks. In that respect, Medved is correct,” said PolitiFact.

But PolitiFact gave his assertion a “half true” rating because whites make up 63 percent of the population, while blacks make up just 12 percent.

“Yes, more whites than blacks die as a result of an encounter with police, but whites also represent a much bigger chunk of the total population,” PolitiFact said in its Aug. 21 post.

But PolitiFact did not take into account the percentage of those by race involved in violent crime or shootings of police, as Mr. Moskos did.

Despite the recent flood of media coverage involving police shootings, Mr. Moskos advised his readers to “keep all this morbidity in perspective,” reminding them that very few people, white or black, will ever be shot or killed by police.

“The odds that any given black man will shoot and kill a police officer in any given year is slim to none, about one in a million. The odds for any given white man? One in four million,” he said. “The odds that a black man will be shot and killed by a police officer is about 1 in 60,000. For a white man those odds are 1 in 200,000.”


Surprising, huh?

This analysis contradicts the widely perceived view that it's now open season on young black men. Despite the media frenzy that ensues every time a black man is shot, apparently more whites are killed by police than blacks. So, NSG, why are the shootings of black men so sensationalized? Why is this false notion that police are civil rights busters constantly pushed?

In my humble opinion, sensationalized headlines sell. It isn't as interesting to report about the deaths of white people anymore. "Hands Up Don't Shoot" is a rallying call that continues to be pedaled despite the fact that Michael Brown never had his hands up. Like, at all. In fact, blood splatter confirmed he was advancing on Wilson. But I digress.

Thoughts, NSG?
Last edited by Kravanica on Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Morr
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Postby Morr » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:24 am

No surprising at all, if you ratio kills compared to percentage of population.
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Postby New Skaaneland » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:26 am

I don't speak for NSG, whoever that is, but I think those comments are quite funny. Since when do they not shoot white people in the back?
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Postby Ainin » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:27 am

Kravanica wrote:Based on that data, Mr. Moskos reported that roughly 49 percent of those killed by officers from May 2013 to April 2015 were white, while 30 percent were black. He also found that 19 percent were Hispanic and 2 percent were Asian and other races.

Gee I wonder why.

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Postby Spoder » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:28 am

Well considering whites (including Hispanics) make up around 77% of the US population, not surprising.

I suppose what matters is the context.

What do you want me to do? Clamor about how if it were blacks, half of NSG would be screaming about the injustice?
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Postby Wisconsin9 » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:29 am

Morr wrote:No surprising at all, if you ratio kills compared to percentage of population.

Yup. Focusing on absolute numbers rather than percentages and ratios is usually the wrong way to go.
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Postby Hladgos » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:33 am

Too bad we're worried about the skin colour of whomever gets shot rather than the situation that led to it and a successful prevention of those events.
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Postby Len Hyet » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:34 am

Ainin wrote:
Kravanica wrote:Based on that data, Mr. Moskos reported that roughly 49 percent of those killed by officers from May 2013 to April 2015 were white, while 30 percent were black. He also found that 19 percent were Hispanic and 2 percent were Asian and other races.

Gee I wonder why.

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That graph combined with OP's data certainly doesn't point to a serious disconnect between population size and police killings.
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Postby Romalae » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:35 am

Wow. 49% killed were white, 30% killed were black. 63% of the population is white, 13% is black.

This is only proving the opposite of the argument you're making.
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Postby Ostroeuropa » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:35 am

Wisconsin9 wrote:
Morr wrote:No surprising at all, if you ratio kills compared to percentage of population.

Yup. Focusing on absolute numbers rather than percentages and ratios is usually the wrong way to go.


Even that isn't really sufficient.
Focusing on percentages and ratios of responses would be.
If the police get 1,000 calls about criminal behavior, and 500 deal with black people, and 50 of those black people get shot, compared to 1000/500/50 white, even though that in terms of percentage of the population black people would get shot more, it wouldn't actually suggest a racist police force.
(Though could suggest a racist public distorting reporting, or racist economic conditions meaning black people are disproportionately criminal.)

For the record, I consider it pretty blatant that much of the US policeforce is pretty racist.
The stats are just icing on the cake compared to actual statements of bigoted intent and such.
Last edited by Ostroeuropa on Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Republic of Trollandia » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:38 am

Kravanica wrote:No, seriously.

Nobel Prize-winning novelist Toni Morrison says she wants to see an officer shoot an unarmed white teenager in the back before agreeing that the “conversation about race” is over, but she almost certainly already has received her wish.

An analysis released last week shows that more white people died at the hands of law enforcement than those of any other race in the last two years, even as the Justice Department, social-justice groups and media coverage focus on black victims of police force.

“People keep saying, ‘We need to have a conversation about race,’” Ms. Morrison told the (U.K.) Telegraph in an April 19 interview.

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“This is the conversation. I want to see a cop shoot a white unarmed teenager in the back,” said Ms. Morrison, who also has won the Pulitzer Prize for her work, which includes the bestsellers “Beloved” and “Song of Solomon.” “And I want to see a white man convicted for raping a black woman. Then when you ask me, ‘Is it over?’, I will say yes.”

Her comments reflect a widespread view that blacks are routinely targeted by law enforcement while whites shot by police are a rarity. Outrage has surged in recent weeks over the high-profile deaths of black men at the hands of police, notably 50-year-old Walter Scott of South Carolina, who was shot in the back and killed April 4 as he tried to run away from an officer after a traffic stop.

The officer who shot him, Michael Slager, has been charged with murder, and the Justice Department is investigating the case for civil rights violations. Department officials announced Tuesday that they have opened a federal probe into the death of Freddie Gray, 25, who died Sunday from injuries sustained while in Baltimore police custody.

Meanwhile, the deaths of whites at the hands of law enforcement typically receive less attention, even when the case is shrouded in controversy. For example, Gilbert Collar, an 18-year-old white student at the University of South Alabama, was shot and killed while naked, unarmed and under the influence of drugs by a black police officer.

The officer, Trevis Austin, was cleared of wrongdoing in 2013 by a Mobile County grand jury in a case that received little media coverage outside Alabama. Mr. Collar’s parents filed a federal lawsuit last year against the officer.

As researchers are quick to point out, FBI data on police shootings by race is notoriously incomplete, which may explain why Peter Moskos, assistant professor at the John Jay College of Criminal Justice at the City University of New York, decided to use figures from the website Killed by Police.

Based on that data, Mr. Moskos reported that roughly 49 percent of those killed by officers from May 2013 to April 2015 were white, while 30 percent were black. He also found that 19 percent were Hispanic and 2 percent were Asian and other races.

His results, posted last week on his blog Cop in the Hood, arrived with several caveats, notably that 25 percent of the website’s data, which is drawn largely from news reports, failed to show the race of the person killed.

Killed by Police lists every death, justified or not, including those in which the officer had been wounded or acted in self-defense.

“The data doesn’t indicate which shootings are justified (the vast majority) and which are cold-blooded murder (not many, but some). And maybe that would vary by race. I don’t know, but I doubt it,” Mr. Moskos said on his blog.

Adjusted to take into account the racial breakdown of the U.S. population, he said black men are 3.5 times more likely to be killed by police than white men. But also adjusted to take into account the racial breakdown in violent crime, the data actually show that police are less likely to kill black suspects than white ones.

“If one adjusts for the racial disparity in the homicide rate or the rate at which police are feloniously killed, whites are actually more likely to be killed by police than blacks,” said Mr. Moskos, a former Baltimore cop and author of the book “Cop in the Hood.”

“Adjusted for the homicide rate, whites are 1.7 times more likely than blacks die at the hands of police,” he said. “Adjusted for the racial disparity at which police are feloniously killed, whites are 1.3 times more likely than blacks to die at the hands of police.”

Mr. Moskos listed two possible reasons for the racial disparity. The first is that police assigned to largely black neighborhoods face “more political fallout when they shoot, and thus receive better training and are less inclined to shoot.”

The second is that police assigned to black communities with high crime rates are more accustomed to dangerous situations and thus are more likely to be able to resolve them without resort to lethal force.

Figures on police shootings by race are thin on the ground, but Mr. Moskos’s results have some support: The investigative journalism website ProPublica came up with a similar percentage in an Oct. 10 article, reporting that 44 percent of all those killed by police were white, using FBI data from 1980 to 2012.

The fact-checking website PolitiFact concluded in August 2014 that police kill more whites than blacks after the claim was made by conservative commentator Michael Medved. PolitiFact cited data from the Centers for Disease Control on fatal injuries by “legal intervention” from 1999 to 2011.

“Over the span of more than a decade, 2,151 whites died by being shot by police compared to 1,130 blacks. In that respect, Medved is correct,” said PolitiFact.

But PolitiFact gave his assertion a “half true” rating because whites make up 63 percent of the population, while blacks make up just 12 percent.

“Yes, more whites than blacks die as a result of an encounter with police, but whites also represent a much bigger chunk of the total population,” PolitiFact said in its Aug. 21 post.

But PolitiFact did not take into account the percentage of those by race involved in violent crime or shootings of police, as Mr. Moskos did.

Despite the recent flood of media coverage involving police shootings, Mr. Moskos advised his readers to “keep all this morbidity in perspective,” reminding them that very few people, white or black, will ever be shot or killed by police.

“The odds that any given black man will shoot and kill a police officer in any given year is slim to none, about one in a million. The odds for any given white man? One in four million,” he said. “The odds that a black man will be shot and killed by a police officer is about 1 in 60,000. For a white man those odds are 1 in 200,000.”


Surprising, huh?

This analysis contradicts the widely perceived view that it's now open season on young black men. Despite the media frenzy that ensues every time a black man is shot, apparently more whites are killed by police than blacks. So, NSG, why are the shootings of black men so sensationalized? Why is this false notion that police are civil rights busters constantly pushed?

In my humble opinion, sensationalized headlines sell. It isn't as interesting to report about the deaths of white people anymore. "Hands Up Don't Shoot" is a rallying call that continues to be pedaled despite the fact that Michael Brown never had his hands up. Like, at all. In fact, blood splatter confirmed he was advancing on Wilson. But I digress.

Thoughts, NSG?

Young black males in recent years were at a far greater risk of being shot dead by police than their white counterparts – 21 times greater, according to a ProPublica analysis of federally collected data on fatal police shootings.

The 1,217 deadly police shootings from 2010 to 2012 captured in the federal data show that blacks, age 15 to 19, were killed at a rate of 31.17 per million, while just 1.47 per million white males in that age range died at the hands of police.



Link

Once you put the perspectives in ratio, African-American teens are much more likelier to get shot by police than Caucasian teens.
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Postby Natapoc » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:39 am

Ainin wrote:
Kravanica wrote:Based on that data, Mr. Moskos reported that roughly 49 percent of those killed by officers from May 2013 to April 2015 were white, while 30 percent were black. He also found that 19 percent were Hispanic and 2 percent were Asian and other races.

Gee I wonder why.

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Exactly. A correct reading of the OP would indicate that black people are shot by police at a disproportionately higher rate. If black people are 30% of those shot by police but represent just 13% of the population than...

Math tells me that a black person is 2.3 times more likely than "average" to be shot by a cop than non black person.

The number is even higher if you group all people of color.
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Postby New Skaaneland » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:40 am

How about instead focusing at each case seperately?

I'm white myself and although I haven't been shot I've been unprovokedly attacked by police from behind. Civilian clothed officers in a NATO country told me to turn and walk in a certein direction. They kept themselves until I followed their command and turned around, walking the other way. That's when they launched a surprise attack with their batons and I've also seen security guards pull the same trick against a guy they wanted to beat up in Sweden. He was also white.
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Postby Spoder » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:41 am

30% of those shot by cops are black, 49% are white.

Moar data pls.
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Postby Republic of Trollandia » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:43 am

New Skaaneland wrote:How about instead focusing at each case seperately?

I'm white myself and although I haven't been shot I've been unprovokedly attacked by police from behind. Civilian clothed officers in a NATO country told me to turn and walk in a certein direction. They kept themselves until I followed their command and turned around, walking the other way. That's when they launched a surprise attack with their batons and I've also seen security guards pull the same trick against a guy they wanted to beat up in Sweden. He was also white.


The problem with looking at one simple case is that might be an outlier. I think we should look at the overall picture.
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Postby LoveIra » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:46 am

Romalae wrote:Wow. 49% killed were white, 30% killed were black. 63% of the population is white, 13% is black.

This is only proving the opposite of the argument you're making.

And blacks are overpresented in comiting crime.

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Postby New Skaaneland » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:48 am

The problem about overall pictures is that they often don't prove half of what they're made out to prove. Exceptions tend to be almost as common as the rules and by changing slight details you can get completely different answers.
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Postby Morr » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:49 am

LoveIra wrote:
Romalae wrote:Wow. 49% killed were white, 30% killed were black. 63% of the population is white, 13% is black.

This is only proving the opposite of the argument you're making.

And blacks are overpresented in comiting crime.

Well, yes, but a lot of that has to do with cops picking on black people. Do you remember when records of Ferguson came out? It was ridiculous.
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Postby Ifreann » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:59 am

Kravanica wrote:Surprising, huh?

No.

This analysis contradicts the widely perceived view that it's now open season on young black men.

Not really. As has been pointed out, more white people may be getting killed by the police in absolute terms, but that's to be expected. White people are the majority in the US. On the contrary, that non-white people are being killed by the police so disproportionately supports more than contradicts the allegedly popular view that it is open season on young black men.
Despite the media frenzy that ensues every time a black man is shot, apparently more whites are killed by police than blacks. So, NSG, why are the shootings of black men so sensationalized?

Because there are vastly more of them than one would expect given the number of black people in the US. As your source shows.
Why is this false notion that police are civil rights busters constantly pushed?

Because it's not necessarily universally false.

In my humble opinion, sensationalized headlines sell. It isn't as interesting to report about the deaths of white people anymore.

White people being killed less than one would expect is certainly not as newsworthy as non-white people being killed more than one would expect, obviously.
"Hands Up Don't Shoot" is a rallying call that continues to be pedaled despite the fact that Michael Brown never had his hands up. Like, at all. In fact, blood splatter confirmed he was advancing on Wilson. But I digress.

Thoughts, NSG?

I think this is a poor attempt to deny the problems caused by racism in America.
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Postby MERIZoC » Mon Apr 27, 2015 7:01 am

What a surprise.

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Postby Greater North American Confederacy » Mon Apr 27, 2015 7:03 am

forget about race. Cop shoots and kills unarmed suspect.
White, black, indigo, violet, I don not care what color you are, that is just
a terrible thing. :ugeek:

Despite the media frenzy that ensues every time a black man is shot, apparently more whites are killed by police than blacks. So, NSG, why are the shootings of black men so sensationalized?


I will tell you why. It is Guilt over slavery and the majority of the 20th century.
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Postby Ifreann » Mon Apr 27, 2015 7:10 am

Greater North American Confederacy wrote:forget about race. Cop shoots and kills unarmed suspect.
White, black, indigo, violet, I don not care what color you are, that is just
a terrible thing. :ugeek:

Despite the media frenzy that ensues every time a black man is shot, apparently more whites are killed by police than blacks. So, NSG, why are the shootings of black men so sensationalized?


I will tell you why. It is Guilt over slavery and the majority of the 20th century.

You don't think it could be because the number of black people killed is disproportionate to the number of black people in America?
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Postby Ashmoria » Mon Apr 27, 2015 7:28 am

its funny to have a conservative newspaper respond to a case of police killing a black man with "they kill white people too!" as if that makes a difference.

the real problem with these statistics is that there ARE no real statistics since most police departments don't send this data to the FBI. without a full accounting of who got killed and why it is rather useless to analyze the data we do have.
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Postby AiliailiA » Mon Apr 27, 2015 7:44 am

Ashmoria wrote:its funny to have a conservative newspaper respond to a case of police killing a black man with "they kill white people too!" as if that makes a difference.

the real problem with these statistics is that there ARE no real statistics since most police departments don't send this data to the FBI. without a full accounting of who got killed and why it is rather useless to analyze the data we do have.


This is so true. Any local or state police who discriminate write "unknown" or just leave the race question blank in their reports to the FBI.

And I wouldn't wipe my ass with the Washington Times. That would make my ass dirty.
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What are the colons meant to convey here?
In my experience Colons usually convey shit

NSG junkie. Getting good shit for free, why would I give it up?

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United Russian Soviet States
Minister
 
Posts: 3327
Founded: Jan 07, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby United Russian Soviet States » Mon Apr 27, 2015 7:51 am

The PC people will probably not listen to this.
This nation does not represent my views.
I stand with Rand.
_[' ]_
(-_Q) If you support Capitalism put this in your Sig.
:Member of the United National Group:

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