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Race and Racism in The United States

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The Cobalt Sky
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Race and Racism in The United States

Postby The Cobalt Sky » Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:51 pm

Hi there. This is my first real discussion thread, so if it comes out lopsided, I’ll work on a new one and come back later. I hope that there isn't another thread out there that covers this one, and I looked but I didn't see one. In case you’re wondering, I’m 14, one half black, and one half white. Apparently, there is some Native American in there somewhere, but I’m not really Native American, and I do not claim to understand their experience in America whatsoever and I do not know what it is like to be one at all. But anyway, I think that lately, people have been saying racism is not a problem. But I think that it is, and a very serious one at that. I point to the criminal justice system, which a lot of people apparently don’t think has any racial problems.

“The survey, which was mostly conducted before the shooting of NYPD Officers Wenjian Liu and Rafael Ramos in New York over the weekend, found similar results on perceptions of the justice system as a whole. While 41% of Americans say the criminal justice system treats blacks fairly, far more whites - 50% - see equity. Among non-whites, that figure drops to just 21%. Two-thirds of non-whites said that the criminal justice system favors whites over blacks.”
http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/22/politics/ ... e-justice/

But it definitely seems to have problems.

“Prison sentences of black men were nearly 20% longer than those of white men for similar crimes in recent years, an analysis by the U.S. Sentencing Commission found.”
http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB100014241 ... 3789858002
http://www.vox.com/2014/7/1/5850830/war ... minorities

“Approximately 12%-13% of the American population is African-American, but they make up 40% of the almost 2.1 million male inmates in jail or prison (U.S. Department of Justice, 2009).[1]”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statistics ... ican_males

There are also many issues with racial profiling.

“For every 10,000 residents, about 3,400 more black people are stopped than whites, and 360 more Latinos are stopped than whites. Stopped blacks are 127% more likely to be frisked -- and stopped Latinos are 43% more likely to be frisked -- than stopped whites. Stopped blacks are 76% more likely to be searched, and stopped Latinos are 16% more likely to be searched than stopped whites.
Stopped blacks are 29% more likely to be arrested, and stopped Latinos are 32% more likely to be arrested than stopped whites.
Now consider this: Although stopped blacks were 127% more likely to be frisked than stopped whites, they were 42.3% less likely to be found with a weapon after they were frisked, 25% less likely to be found with drugs and 33% less likely to be found with other contraband. We found similar patterns for Latinos.
Not only did we find that African Americans and Latinos were subjected to more stops, frisks, searches and arrests than whites, we also found that these additional police actions aren't because of the fact that people of color live in higher-crime areas or because they more often carry drugs or weapons, or any other legitimate reason that we can discern from the rich set of data we examined.”
http://articles.latimes.com/2008/oct/23 ... oe-ayres23

And, with the advent of DNA technology, tons of people were exonerated. The vast majority of the wrongfully convicted were black.
http://www.innocenceproject.org/Content ... onwide.php
A few other links to consider:
https://www.americanprogress.org/issues ... ed-states/
http://www.sentencingproject.org/templa ... cfm?id=122

After looking through this, I’d say race is still a pretty serious problem in the US, and not talking about it won’t solve anything, just make it worse. I think people are touchy and uncomfortable when it comes to talking about race, because there’s a chance they could be called racist, and a racist is something that society at large generally says is bad, although I think tons of people are still racist. But this wouldn’t be much of a thread if I didn’t ask: what do you think? What racist experiences have you gone through?

EDIT:
Let me revise this, so people can post a little bit more.
A problem, but how serious a problem? Who do you think is its source? How ingrained is it? Are you a racist? (I want a little more than the generic statement, 'yes, it's a problem')
Last edited by The Cobalt Sky on Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Mavorpen
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Postby Mavorpen » Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:53 pm

Racism won't truly become a thing of the past until many people first discard the childish notion that you can't hold beliefs that are ground in racism without being an evil KKK white supremacist.
Last edited by Mavorpen on Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Theo Roosevelt
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Postby Theo Roosevelt » Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:54 pm

Racism is still a problem in the United States and it continues because America isn't disciplined enough to not differentiate between different types of Americans on completely superficial grounds and not their will-power.
Last edited by Theo Roosevelt on Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Mike the Progressive
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Postby Mike the Progressive » Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:55 pm

I don't know if you heard, but we've elected Obama. Twice. We're living in a post-racial society now.

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The Cobalt Sky
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Postby The Cobalt Sky » Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:55 pm

Mike the Progressive wrote:I don't know if you heard, but we've elected Obama. Twice. We're living in a post-racial society now.

I hope you're kidding.
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Mike the Progressive
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Postby Mike the Progressive » Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:56 pm

The Cobalt Sky wrote:
Mike the Progressive wrote:I don't know if you heard, but we've elected Obama. Twice. We're living in a post-racial society now.

I hope you're kidding.


I'm always serious, except when I am not.

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The Conez Imperium
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Postby The Conez Imperium » Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:56 pm

Racism is always a problem with a country. I come from Australia and I can say the flavour of the month is to hate Muslims. From what I can gather about America, you (plural) haven't moved passed hating "blacks".

In the 40's and 50's Australia was racist to Non-English Europeans. Italians and Greeks immigrating to Aus. They were often abused/discriminated and called wogs. Now in 2015 they are considered Australian

In the 60's and 70's Australia was racist to the Vietnamese "boat people". Refugees fleeing from the Viet Cong. About 40-50 years later time Australia considers Vietnamese people Australian.

Now the flavor of the month is to hate Muslims.
Last edited by The Conez Imperium on Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Independent Republic of Not My Problem
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Postby Independent Republic of Not My Problem » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:20 pm

So, what you're statistics are telling me is that blacks and latinos commit crimes at a higher rate than white people. I already knew that.

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Saiwania
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Postby Saiwania » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:22 pm

The solution to your problem of course, isn't to fight against racism but rather- to accept it as what is natural and true. Learn what racial/ethnic group you belong to and do not feel any shame in embracing that. I choose to keep to my own as much as possible and couldn't be happier.
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Scomagia
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Postby Scomagia » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:23 pm

Independent Republic of Not My Problem wrote:So, what you're statistics are telling me is that blacks and latinos commit crimes at a higher rate than white people. I already knew that.

First, no. What the statistics show is that black people are focused on more by the police and receive disproportionate prison terms.

Second, Latinos/Hispanics ARE White, or rather can be. The majority of the Latinos in the U.S. are white, at any rate, which is my point.
Last edited by Scomagia on Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Scomagia
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Postby Scomagia » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:23 pm

Saiwania wrote:The solution to your problem of course, isn't to fight against racism but rather- to accept it as what is natural and true. Learn what racial/ethnic group you belong to and do not feel any shame in embracing that. I choose to keep to my own as much as possible and couldn't be happier.

You're a member of the dominant group. Of course you're happy.
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Mike the Progressive
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Postby Mike the Progressive » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:31 pm

Scomagia wrote:
Independent Republic of Not My Problem wrote:So, what you're statistics are telling me is that blacks and latinos commit crimes at a higher rate than white people. I already knew that.


Second, Latinos/Hispanics ARE White.


Hmm. I know any ethnic group can be Hispanic (origins or heritage in Spanish speaking countries), but I don't know if all Hispanics are white.

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The Conez Imperium
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Postby The Conez Imperium » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:32 pm

Saiwania wrote:Learn what racial/ethnic group you belong to and do not feel any shame in embracing that.


What?

So are you going to tell some poor person of darker-toned skin to embrace the fact he was racially abused in the 50's America?
Last edited by The Conez Imperium on Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Scomagia
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Postby Scomagia » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:33 pm

Mike the Progressive wrote:
Scomagia wrote:
Second, Latinos/Hispanics ARE White.


Hmm. I know any ethnic group can be Hispanic (origins or heritage in Spanish speaking countries), but I don't know if all Hispanics are white.

You quoted me before I finished editing. I addressed this.
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Kelinfort
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Postby Kelinfort » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:34 pm

Racism is still rampant in the US. Those who do not think it exists or embrace it are equal in their betrayal of the truth.

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New haven america
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Postby New haven america » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:35 pm

Saiwania wrote:The solution to your problem of course, isn't to fight against racism but rather- to accept it as what is natural and true. Learn what racial/ethnic group you belong to and do not feel any shame in embracing that. I choose to keep to my own as much as possible and couldn't be happier.

You're in the majority of the US, of course you're happy.
Last edited by New haven america on Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Saiwania
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Postby Saiwania » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:36 pm

Scomagia wrote:Second, Latinos/Hispanics ARE White, or rather can be.


If people can distinguish between Hispanic Whites and non-Hispanic Whites, then arguably- White Hispanics aren't as White as those with a primarily European ancestry. It is a fact that most Latinos are Mestizo and thus are half White at best.

Why would the US census consider the two groups to be separate categories if they aren't actually separate from the other?
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Divitaen
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Postby Divitaen » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:37 pm

The OP has pointed out what every sane and reasonable person knows: that racism is alive and well in the US and there is a significant disparity in the treatment of whites and people of colour. You'd have to ignore or stretch every available statistic to deny this fact.
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Postby New haven america » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:37 pm

Independent Republic of Not My Problem wrote:So, what you're statistics are telling me is that blacks and latinos commit crimes at a higher rate than white people. I already knew that.

A lot of latinos are white though...
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Postby Scomagia » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:39 pm

Saiwania wrote:
Scomagia wrote:Second, Latinos/Hispanics ARE White, or rather can be.


If people can distinguish between Hispanic Whites and non-Hispanic Whites, then arguably- White Hispanics aren't as White as those with a primarily European ancestry. It is a fact that most Latinos are Mestizo and thus are half White at best.

Why would the US census consider the two groups to be separate categories if they aren't actually separate from the other?

People can't reliably distinguish between Hispanic Whites and non-Hispanic Whites.

Because the U.S. census, for whatever reason, presumes that race exists. It doesn't.
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New haven america
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Postby New haven america » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:39 pm

Saiwania wrote:
Scomagia wrote:Second, Latinos/Hispanics ARE White, or rather can be.


If people can distinguish between Hispanic Whites and non-Hispanic Whites, then arguably- White Hispanics aren't as White as those with a primarily European ancestry. It is a fact that most Latinos are Mestizo and thus are half White at best.

Why would the US census consider the two groups to be separate categories if they aren't actually separate from the other?

Latinos=Latin American spanish speakers
Hispanics=Caribbean spanish speakers
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The Cobalt Sky
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Postby The Cobalt Sky » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:41 pm

Independent Republic of Not My Problem wrote:So, what you're statistics are telling me is that blacks and latinos commit crimes at a higher rate than white people. I already knew that.

...Or just get searched, convicted, and sentenced more often. And when they do get sentenced, it's for longer.
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Last edited by The Cobalt Sky on Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Edgy Opinions » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:43 pm

A country founded in white nationalist beliefs that had a 90% white population at the peak of its racist sentiment not many decades ago has major problems of white supremacist portions of populace oppressing the disadvantaged minorities? Color me shocked!
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The Cobalt Sky
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Postby The Cobalt Sky » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:45 pm

Divitaen wrote:The OP has pointed out what every sane and reasonable person knows: that racism is alive and well in the US and there is a significant disparity in the treatment of whites and people of colour. You'd have to ignore or stretch every available statistic to deny this fact.

Well, with some of the personalities on NS I'd say there will be someone soon who will come along and deny everything we've just said, regardless of what reasoning we have used. I think a lot of life is just dealing with people who are in denial about reality, and then trying to make sure you're not also in denial about reality. But I have no idea since I'm still in high school.
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Postby Saiwania » Sat Jan 31, 2015 4:47 pm

New haven america wrote:You're in the majority of the US, of course your happy.


I'm not going to be happy for long, being apart of White America in my view is like being an official of South Vietnam, you know that your home is in terminal decline and that one of these days your group is going to collapse. I fear that I won't have an escape plan when the time comes.
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