Canadian Conservatives vs. freedom of speech.

[Novorobo]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/anti-te ... -1.2937964

Parts #2 and #4 are going overboard. Here we are, with the party that used their scaling back of Canada's hate speech laws to paint themselves as the last remaining guardians of free speech, stifling conversation about under which circumstances terrorism would or wouldn't be justified. (And to anyone who thinks such discussion should be stopped, bear in mind that by some standards even the American Revolution could be counted as "terrorism.")

I think it's a questionable precedent to set. Even the stifling of public-sector scientists was arguably more analogous to "stifling your employees" the way some private companies do, while this is outright censorship.

I'm on the fence about the rest of this law, though.

[Aggicificicerous]

Without looking too much into this bill, it's always disturbing when standards for things like arrest, detention, wire-tapping are broadened and made vaguer. Add in the general lack of accountability one associates with the Conservatives, and I am certainly apprehensive.

[Novorobo]

Speaking of concerning incursions on freedom of speech...

http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/other/ham ... ar-AA8OLEA

This guy was only denied a permit, rather than being outright jailed over his views, but still... are the guy's views fair game in the context of something like this?

[Nebalon]

The conservatives have it right, lock up the terrorists and torture them, seems that if their god is real he'd help them out! If a Canadian citizen isn't a terrorist and follows the law, these new rules change nothing about their lives, so I think they should shut up

[Mike the Progressive]

I say this as an American, but besides the removal of "terrorist" material from the internet, I'm OK with this.

My objection to that point is "terrorist" can be hard to define (very broad). Though I'm fairly certain the intended target is Islamic extremism.

[Uawc]

Harper Conservatives are American Republicans who drape themselves with the Maple Leaf. They aren't at all concerned with civil rights or general freedoms, and Harper has repeatedly shown that he is perfectly content with trampling over Canadian rights and freedoms for the sake of combating a terrorism problem which only exists because we won't stop being America's bitch.

I get security. I have years of experience in the field. That's how I know this is going to be used to abuse police powers far more than it will be used to protect anyone. You don't harass people over maybes and possibilities. You investigate, you confirm, and you act on confirmed information only.

You want to protect Canada and its people from terrorism? Stop licking America's boots and stay out of the sandbox. That's literally all we need to do, and the terrorists will leave us alone.

[Kalifati Arab shqiptar]

What is this nonsense?! Nothing gets passed unless the GG gets the call from Buck's Palace.

Long live the Queen!

[Mike the Progressive]

You want to protect Canada and its people from terrorism? Stop licking America's boots and stay out of the sandbox. That's literally all we need to do, and the terrorists will leave us alone.

Exactly. When the going gets tough, cower away.

[Uawc]

You want to protect Canada and its people from terrorism? Stop licking America's boots and stay out of the sandbox. That's literally all we need to do, and the terrorists will leave us alone.

Exactly. When the going gets tough, cower away.

We have no reason to fight ISIS when they aren't operating on Canadian soil. My tax dollars and I aren't concerned with what happens on the other side of the world if it doesn't affect us.

[Mike the Progressive]

Exactly. When the going gets tough, cower away.

We have no reason to fight ISIS when they aren't operating on Canadian soil. My tax dollars and I aren't concerned with what happens on the other side of the world if it doesn't affect us.

The apathy is disgusting. It's that mentality that gave rise to Nazism, genocide all over the world, terrorist groups kidnapping children, etc. When you see a crime and do nothing, you're just as bad as the criminal.

[Alizeria]

The legislation seems a little bit vague but overall I don't see anything in there that I would oppose.

We have no reason to fight ISIS when they aren't operating on Canadian soil. My tax dollars and I aren't concerned with what happens on the other side of the world if it doesn't affect us.

The apathy is disgusting. It's that mentality that gave rise to Nazism, genocide all over the world, terrorist groups kidnapping children, etc. When you see a crime and do nothing, you're just as bad as the criminal.

Amen.

[Uawc]

We have no reason to fight ISIS when they aren't operating on Canadian soil. My tax dollars and I aren't concerned with what happens on the other side of the world if it doesn't affect us.

The apathy is disgusting. It's that mentality that gave rise to Nazism, genocide all over the world, terrorist groups kidnapping children, etc. When you see a crime and do nothing, you're just as bad as the criminal.

It's not our job to police the world. I'm not seeing ISIS kidnapping kids on my street. ISIS is an Iraqi and Syrian problem primarily.
I hate ISIS as much as the next guy. Hell, if they threaten my country, I'll enlist...but as long as they aren't, I'd rather my tax dollars be used to improve our underfunded health care system. It's the responsibility of the people and governments in countries where ISIS is prominent to combat them, and let's be real: in a some places, ISIS is welcomed by the common people. It's a complex issue, and it's both presumptuous and foolhardy to intervene.

[Costa Fierro]

Exactly. When the going gets tough, cower away.

We have no reason to fight ISIS when they aren't operating on Canadian soil. My tax dollars and I aren't concerned with what happens on the other side of the world if it doesn't affect us.

So thousands of people should just curl up and die because if it doesn't affect you, it's not a problem? Lack of fresh drinking water affects millions of people around the world but should those people die from polluted or unclean water because Canadians have access to fresh water? Should no one go out and dig a well in an African village because you already have fresh water in Canada?

[Uawc]

We have no reason to fight ISIS when they aren't operating on Canadian soil. My tax dollars and I aren't concerned with what happens on the other side of the world if it doesn't affect us.

So thousands of people should just curl up and die because if it doesn't affect you, it's not a problem? Lack of fresh drinking water affects millions of people around the world but should those people die from polluted or unclean water because Canadians have access to fresh water? Should no one go out and dig a well in an African village because you already have fresh water in Canada?

People die every day. Any sort of great change happens in a country, lots of people die. I'm not saying it's a good thing, but it happens, and the world is slowly overpopulating.

However, and this is much more serious, you're confusing international charity with military intervention. There's a huge difference between the two and a huge difference in expense. I'm fine with helping people in those countries improve their own infrastructure, health and the like. I'm not fine with putting them on financial life support, because it creates an expensive dependency which is bad for both us and them, and I'm also not fine with billions of our tax dollars being pumped into new jets being used for bombing runs on the other side of the planet to kill a bunch of backwards goat fuckers I wouldn't even know existed if it wasn't for the news.

[Mike the Progressive]

The apathy is disgusting. It's that mentality that gave rise to Nazism, genocide all over the world, terrorist groups kidnapping children, etc. When you see a crime and do nothing, you're just as bad as the criminal.

It's not our job to police the world. I'm not seeing ISIS kidnapping kids on my street. ISIS is an Iraqi and Syrian problem primarily.
I hate ISIS as much as the next guy. Hell, if they threaten my country, I'll enlist...but as long as they aren't, I'd rather my tax dollars be used to improve our underfunded health care system. It's the responsibility of the people and governments in countries where ISIS is prominent to combat them, and let's be real: in a some places, ISIS is welcomed by the common people. It's a complex issue, and it's both presumptuous and foolhardy to intervene.

You're right. It's not your job to police the world. But if a nation has the ability to project its power than it should use that power and ability to do good. So it's our job. Not just America's or Canada's or UK or France or SK. But all of us. Today it's ISIS, in the past it was genocide in Rwanda, who knows what it will be tomorrow?

I'm not naive. I recognize we cannot right every wrong, sometimes we have to hold our tongues. But if we, nations with the capabilities, can help and stop evil. Even if just a little. Even if just for a day, a week, a month, a year. We should. A little less evil in the world doesn't make the world a perfect place. But it does make it a little less evil.

[Uawc]

It's not our job to police the world. I'm not seeing ISIS kidnapping kids on my street. ISIS is an Iraqi and Syrian problem primarily.
I hate ISIS as much as the next guy. Hell, if they threaten my country, I'll enlist...but as long as they aren't, I'd rather my tax dollars be used to improve our underfunded health care system. It's the responsibility of the people and governments in countries where ISIS is prominent to combat them, and let's be real: in a some places, ISIS is welcomed by the common people. It's a complex issue, and it's both presumptuous and foolhardy to intervene.

You're right. It's not your job to police the world. But if a nation has the ability to project its power than it should use that power and ability to do good. So it's our job. Not just America's or Canada's or UK or France or SK. But all of us. Today it's ISIS, in the past it was genocide in Rwanda, who knows what it will be tomorrow?

I'm not naive. I recognize we cannot right every wrong, sometimes we have to hold our tongues. But if we, nations with the capabilities, can help and stop evil. Even if just a little. Even if just for a day, a week, a month, a year. We should. A little less evil in the world doesn't make the world a perfect place. But it does make it a little less evil.

I think we'll just have to agree to disagree in regards to intervention. I simply believe that doing so is arrogant, presumptuous, and an expensive waste of time that will only continue to make us a target for terrorism. Remember, when we do make ourselves a target, we risk Canadian lives for it. Are you okay with that?

And who are you to decide what is and is not evil? That's quite subjective, don't you think? As I've mentioned, ISIS is very welcome in some places by the common people.

[Big Jim P]

So thousands of people should just curl up and die because if it doesn't affect you, it's not a problem? Lack of fresh drinking water affects millions of people around the world but should those people die from polluted or unclean water because Canadians have access to fresh water? Should no one go out and dig a well in an African village because you already have fresh water in Canada?

People die every day. Any sort of great change happens in a country, lots of people die. I'm not saying it's a good thing, but it happens, and the world is slowly overpopulating.

However, and this is much more serious, you're confusing international charity with military intervention. There's a huge difference between the two and a huge difference in expense. I'm fine with helping people in those countries improve their own infrastructure, health and the like. I'm not fine with putting them on financial life support, because it creates an expensive dependency which is bad for both us and them, and I'm also not fine with billions of our tax dollars being pumped into new jets being used for bombing runs on the other side of the planet to kill a bunch of backwards goat fuckers I wouldn't even know existed if it wasn't for the news.

Well said.

[Marcurix]

I think we'll just have to agree to disagree in regards to intervention. I simply believe that doing so is arrogant, presumptuous, and an expensive waste of time that will only continue to make us a target for terrorism.

I would say the greater example of arrogance would be this "not my problem" attitude you have going. In this increasingly globalized world you cannot expect to sit back and not be affected.

Remember, when we do make ourselves a target, we risk Canadian lives for it. Are you okay with that?

Yes.

And who are you to decide what is and is not evil? That's quite subjective, don't you think? As I've mentioned, ISIS is very welcome in some places by the common people.

They tend to kill and pillage the places that don't welcome them.

[Costa Fierro]

And who are you to decide what is and is not evil? That's quite subjective, don't you think? As I've mentioned, ISIS is very welcome in some places by the common people.

And who would these people be? Syrians? The Kurds? Iraq's religious minorities and the tens of thousands of ordinary Iraqis joining the armed forces and various militias to fight ISIS?

[New Matawan]

Won't Point #4 just fall victim to the Streisand Effect? You can't really delete something from the internet without people noticing and posting the content elsewhere.