NATION

PASSWORD

Should the U.S Abolish the Department of Education?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)
User avatar
Ulvena
Minister
 
Posts: 2335
Founded: Jun 02, 2012
Libertarian Police State

Should the U.S Abolish the Department of Education?

Postby Ulvena » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:18 pm

So ever since I've been getting into a more Capitalist, Right Wing community over both my life and the internet, a few things have come up that I simply can't agree with. The one that I can't agree with the most is probably the Department of Education thing, specifically abolishing it and giving full power to the States.

So what does the NS General community think about this? After all, the Department of Education did do some stupid [REDACTED] like pass No Child Left Behind or focus on the Self-Esteem movement a decade ago. But on the other hand, the Department of Education does facilitate education on a federal level.
"We Do What We Must, because We Can"
"True Progress for Humanity at All Costs"



Political Compass
For: Monetarism, Agnosticism, Free Thought, Small but strong government, Libertarianism, Gold Standard, Intelligence. Pro-Palestine.
Against: Communism, Racism, Fundamentalism, Ignorance, Optimism, Intrusion of Privacy, Propaganda, Zionism.
Neo-Joseon Wiki
Official Member of the Universal Technology Alliance!

User avatar
DrakoBlaria
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9422
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby DrakoBlaria » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:28 pm

Well I believe that Education should be handed from the state.Wait I thought the U.S had a ministry of Education.What is the difference bewteen ministry and department in the U.S?
Kleomentia wrote:Almighty Hellenic Overlord of Slavya, he who is the son of Zeus and the father of Greekishness.
When Greeks stop being nationalists, they stop being Greeks
ABOUT ME:
Male, Greek Nationalist, Orthodox Christian, State Capitalist
EU, communism, abortion, Greek/Turkish friendship, NATO, illegal immigration, Globalism, FYROM, gay marriage
Enosis, Megali Idea, Putin, Guns, Nationalism, Equallity, Kurdistan, Assyria
Economic Left/Right: -5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.74

User avatar
Mardo
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 15
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Mardo » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:30 pm

no

redneck states can't be trusted with educating children

User avatar
Laerod
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19308
Founded: Jul 17, 2004
Iron Fist Socialists

Postby Laerod » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:31 pm

DrakoBlaria wrote:Well I believe that Education should be handed from the state.Wait I thought the U.S had a ministry of Education.

It shouldn't. There needs to be some kind of academic standard across the board and you do not achieve that with 50 states going their seperate ways.
What is the difference bewteen ministry and department in the U.S?

Ministries are what foreign people call their departments.

User avatar
Sdaeriji
Negotiator
 
Posts: 7451
Founded: Antiquity
Capitalist Paradise

Postby Sdaeriji » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:31 pm

No. Businesses benefit from uniform education standards across the country.
Farnhamia wrote:What part of the four-letter word "Rules" are you having trouble with?
Farnhamia wrote:four-letter word "Rules"

User avatar
DrakoBlaria
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9422
Founded: Jan 31, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby DrakoBlaria » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:32 pm

Laerod wrote:
DrakoBlaria wrote:Well I believe that Education should be handed from the state.Wait I thought the U.S had a ministry of Education.

It shouldn't. There needs to be some kind of academic standard across the board and you do not achieve that with 50 states going their seperate ways.
What is the difference bewteen ministry and department in the U.S?

Ministries are what foreign people call their departments.


I think you mean the opposite.Then I can not see why it should change.Since the goverment votes the changes then it is all ok
Kleomentia wrote:Almighty Hellenic Overlord of Slavya, he who is the son of Zeus and the father of Greekishness.
When Greeks stop being nationalists, they stop being Greeks
ABOUT ME:
Male, Greek Nationalist, Orthodox Christian, State Capitalist
EU, communism, abortion, Greek/Turkish friendship, NATO, illegal immigration, Globalism, FYROM, gay marriage
Enosis, Megali Idea, Putin, Guns, Nationalism, Equallity, Kurdistan, Assyria
Economic Left/Right: -5.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.74

User avatar
Desperate Measures
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9842
Founded: Antiquity
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Desperate Measures » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:36 pm

That is one of the worst ideas ever.
"My loathings are simple: stupidity, oppression, crime, cruelty, soft music."
- Vladimir Nabokov US (1899 - 1977)
Also, me.
“Man has such a predilection for systems and abstract deductions that he is ready to distort the truth intentionally, he is ready to deny the evidence of his senses only to justify his logic”
- Fyodor Dostoyevsky Russian Novelist and Writer, 1821-1881
"All Clock Faces Are Wrong." - Gene Ray, Prophet(?) http://www.timecube.com
A simplified maxim on the subject states "An atheist would say, 'I don't believe God exists'; an agnostic would say, 'I don't know whether or not God exists'; and an ignostic would say, 'I don't know what you mean when you say, "God exists" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignosticism

User avatar
Trotskylvania
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 14731
Founded: Jul 07, 2006
Anarchy

Postby Trotskylvania » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:36 pm

No.
Modern industrial civilization has developed within a certain system of convenient myths. The driving force of modern industrial civilization has been individual material gain, which is accepted as legitimate, even praiseworthy, on the grounds that private vices yield public benefits, in the classic formulation. Now, it has long been understood, very well, that a society that is based on this principle will destroy itself in time. It can only persist, with whatever suffering and injustice that it entails, as long as it is possible to pretend that the destructive forces that humans create are limited, that the world is an infinite resource, and that the world is an infinite garbage can.
Noam Chomsky

User avatar
The Sovietyeto
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1157
Founded: Feb 20, 2011
New York Times Democracy

Postby The Sovietyeto » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:39 pm

This argument reminds me about what Anericans would say while making the Articles of Confederation. Almost an uncanny similarity.

User avatar
United Bobtopia
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 185
Founded: Jan 19, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby United Bobtopia » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:45 pm

I don't know. I used to work in the education field, teaching kids with severe mental illness. Some of the greatest frustrations with the job came from the federal level (ie. No Child Left Behind which mandated standardized testing for all children across the nation).

The thing is, unlike most European nations, America is a very large country with many distinct cultural views and customs. The one size fits all approach, as exemplified by the department of Education, is flawed in many respects and may even be counter productive.

During the golden age of American literacy (late 1940s to 1950s. Read text books from those days. Our literacy rates would never be as high again) our system worked with education matters being decided by municipal school boards, free even from state interference, let along federal. Obviously, the growth of the federal system isn't the sole reason for the decline (decline of multiple parent homes, more kids remaining in the school system rather than dropping out, mainstreaming of children with cognitive disabilities and a host of other factors played just as important a role) but it should be factored into the debate.

I guess my view would be that it's a far more complex issue than either side would be willing to give credit for.

User avatar
Genivaria
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34002
Founded: Mar 29, 2011
New York Times Democracy

Postby Genivaria » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:45 pm

No. Texas has been doing a pretty shit job of setting its own Education policy.
Education should be set by the Federal government, not the State.
"All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights. They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood."-Article 1 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights

Idealism is not looking at the world only as we'd like it to be, it is seeing the world for what it is, as well as what it could be.
Cynicism is only seeing what it is.

Heading back to Job Corps today, NS access will be infrequent and random for the foreseeable future.

User avatar
Duvniask
Minister
 
Posts: 2873
Founded: Aug 30, 2012
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Duvniask » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:45 pm

Maybe that would be an addition to the long list of horrible ideas.
Ivegottogodosomething!

User avatar
DogDoo 7
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5121
Founded: Jun 12, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby DogDoo 7 » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:51 pm

No. If anything, they should fund schools federally. There's no good reason why rich kids should have more government money spent on their schools than poor kids.
Just ask this scientician--Troy McClure

User avatar
Divair
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 63445
Founded: May 06, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Divair » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:53 pm

No, just no.

User avatar
United Bobtopia
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 185
Founded: Jan 19, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby United Bobtopia » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:55 pm

Genivaria wrote:No. Texas has been doing a pretty shit job of setting its own Education policy.
Education should be set by the Federal government, not the State.


Not actually true. Now I should admit, I have a bit of a linking when it comes to Texas, having enjoyed my time living there immensely, but Texas scores higher than even states like California across the board. They rank 10th in math, and just below the national average in math scores. Texas has some of the best employees I've ever had the pleasure of hiring. If anything, I have to give their schools a thumbs up.

User avatar
Point Breeze
Diplomat
 
Posts: 653
Founded: Dec 26, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Point Breeze » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:56 pm

You could definitely make an argument that the Department of Education should undergo a massive overhaul, but outright abolition? You damn crazy.

As I said, education in our great nation is failing, and changes should be made. Documentaries like Waiting for Superman come to mind. Educate yourselves.


(no pun intended)
The Right Honorable Jon Osborn, President of the Regency of Point Breeze and Thane of WA Affairs for Wintreath
Please remember to read the World Assembly Rules and Previously Passed Resolutions before submitting a draft...
Defwa wrote:You're working on a lot of resolutions at once and I hate to be mean, but they're all pretty shit.

User avatar
Alowwvia
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1570
Founded: May 21, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Alowwvia » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:57 pm

Nice in principle, but it would result in Creationism being taught in some places, and other silly things. So, it's a no-no.
Reality Check about Gun Violence in America

Alowwvia under Quarantine!? [OPEN/MT]
http://tracker.conquestofabsolution.com/stats=alowwvia

^These are canon stats, though 'Land' forces compose three branches.

Economic Left/Right: 3.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -3.49

"Democracy and socialism have nothing in common but one word, equality. But notice the difference: while democracy seeks equality in liberty, socialism seeks equality in restraint and servitude. "
-Alexis de Tocqueville

"Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of liberty."
-Thomas Jefferson


Pro: ur mom
Anti: ur face

User avatar
Laerod
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19308
Founded: Jul 17, 2004
Iron Fist Socialists

Postby Laerod » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:58 pm

United Bobtopia wrote:
Genivaria wrote:No. Texas has been doing a pretty shit job of setting its own Education policy.
Education should be set by the Federal government, not the State.


Not actually true. Now I should admit, I have a bit of a linking when it comes to Texas, having enjoyed my time living there immensely, but Texas scores higher than even states like California across the board. They rank 10th in math, and just below the national average in math scores. Texas has some of the best employees I've ever had the pleasure of hiring. If anything, I have to give their schools a thumbs up.

In what ranking is this?

User avatar
Alyekra
Minister
 
Posts: 2793
Founded: May 03, 2012
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Alyekra » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:59 pm

Yes, Tenth amendment.
---V O L U N T A R I S T---C O N S E R V A T I V E---
Pro:
Mark 12:31
Philosophy
Idealism*
Property Rights
Moral Objectivism
G.K. Chesterton
Anti:
Authoritarianism
Unexamined lives
Materialism*
Relativism
Postmodernism
Apathy
Everything is awesome
Everything is cool when you're part of a team
Everything is awesome, when we're living our dream
Feel free to send me a telegram for any reason.
- -

User avatar
Zottistan
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11873
Founded: Nov 26, 2011
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Zottistan » Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:00 pm

I'd be more in favour in taking it completely out of the hands of the government and privatizing it. Granted that would be an expensive, difficult and sprawlingly inefficient process.
Liberal social capitalist with neoconservative leanings.

I support regulated free market capitalism and a strong social welfare system. I am a social libertarian and a secularist.

I oppose Palestine, excessive collectivism and all forms of dogma.
"A true man hates no one." - Napoleon Bonaparte
Sixteen-year-old Irish male.

I am an atheist, apatheist and a militant anti-theist. I am a nihilist and something of a Stirnerite egoist.

I enjoy maths, science, debate, anime and music. I aspire to work in mathematics or physics.

User avatar
Laerod
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19308
Founded: Jul 17, 2004
Iron Fist Socialists

Postby Laerod » Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:01 pm

Zottistan wrote:I'd be more in favour in taking it completely out of the hands of the government and privatizing it. Granted that would be an expensive, difficult and sprawlingly inefficient process.

Why'd you be in favor then?

User avatar
Natapoc
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 17598
Founded: Antiquity
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Natapoc » Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:01 pm

Yes, assuming the average NSG poster represents the output of the department of education There is little reason to believe the DOE is accomplishing anything at all with the funds given to them.
Last edited by Natapoc on Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
“I don’t understand why when we destroy something created by man we call it vandalism, but when we destroy something by nature we call it progress.”

― Ed Begley Jr.

User avatar
Laerod
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19308
Founded: Jul 17, 2004
Iron Fist Socialists

Postby Laerod » Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:02 pm

Natapoc wrote:Yes, assuming the average NSG poster represents the output of the department of education There is little reason to believe the DOE is accomplishing anything at all with the funds given to then.

Bad idea.

User avatar
Alowwvia
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1570
Founded: May 21, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Alowwvia » Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:03 pm

Zottistan wrote:I'd be more in favour in taking it completely out of the hands of the government and privatizing it. Granted that would be an expensive, difficult and sprawlingly inefficient process.


There's another term for that that's actually shorter.


It's called terrible fucking idea.
Reality Check about Gun Violence in America

Alowwvia under Quarantine!? [OPEN/MT]
http://tracker.conquestofabsolution.com/stats=alowwvia

^These are canon stats, though 'Land' forces compose three branches.

Economic Left/Right: 3.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -3.49

"Democracy and socialism have nothing in common but one word, equality. But notice the difference: while democracy seeks equality in liberty, socialism seeks equality in restraint and servitude. "
-Alexis de Tocqueville

"Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of liberty."
-Thomas Jefferson


Pro: ur mom
Anti: ur face

User avatar
Malkora
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 105
Founded: Apr 05, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Malkora » Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:03 pm

No. What happens to children who move from state to state and are taught different things? Also, I don't think that children from certain states should be taught "creation science" because their representatives trust the bible over science.
Just an average NSG'er. If you can call NSG average.

Next

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Albicia, Alcase, Alruniea, Aravea, Arglorand, Arkolon, Caninope, Chestaan, Christian Democrats, Christian Isles, Conserative Morality, Corenea, Crumlark, DesAnges, Diakhopol, Donut section, Draica, Dumb Ideologies, Duvniask, Eastern Equestria, Ethirus, Euroslavia, Evil Lord Sauron, Exabot [Bot], Fayt, Free Soviets, Freethinking Anarchists, Google [Bot], Grand Britannia, Guadalupador, Hurdegaryp, Kranstentistan, Krasivovia, KwaDai, Lancaster of Wessex, Lavan Tiri, Liberaxia, Liventia, Lordieth, Margno, Mexican Liberation, Monfrox, Monkeykind, Murkwood, Napkiraly, Nazi Flower Power, Neema, Nervium, Nickel Empire, Omorov-Nier, Pey, Ragnarum, Rationalist Science, San Mazer, Shaluach, Soviet Canuckistan, Spirit of Hope, Sun Wukong, Tea party separation of america, The Greater Luthorian Empire, The Liberated Territories, The United Empire of Exucular, Theranis III, Thyrgga, Toaldibea, Transgendria, Trollgaard, Twilight Imperium, United States of Woodward, Vectrova, Vicious Debaters, Victoria Secret, Victorious Decepticons, Zelan, Zunkwentania

Remove ads