The Miniluv Messenger: TEP Liberated!

[Pierconium]

Seriously?

If TWP ousts their Sec-Gen over this, they're fucking up. Big-time.

Well, when they cry about the New Western Pacific Order, I won't shed a tear.

This seems way out of line.

So the argument regarding AMOM falls apart so you decide to attack the messenger.

Winning friends and influencing people all around it seems...

[Lazmac]

Well, when they cry about the New Western Pacific Order, I won't shed a tear.

This seems way out of line.

So the argument regarding AMOM falls apart so you decide to attack the messenger.

Winning friends and influencing people all around it seems...

Just fyi, neither of the people you've quoted are me. While I do have a tendency to post from various puppets, usually depending on which one I'm logged into at the time, I always identify myself in my signature.

Deal with two very simple facts: Almost everyone in NationStates believes the NPO disreputable, and almost no one in NationStates cares about winning friends among and influencing those who comprise The West Pacific's washed up, irrelevant oligarchy.

[Valrifell]

Well, when they cry about the New Western Pacific Order, I won't shed a tear.

This seems way out of line.

So the argument regarding AMOM falls apart so you decide to attack the messenger.

Winning friends and influencing people all around it seems...

Meh. I can't be bothered to get context on a situation.
It's a part of the reason I mostly lurk in threads like these.

[RiderSyl]

Well, when they cry about the New Western Pacific Order, I won't shed a tear.

This seems way out of line.

So the argument regarding AMOM falls apart so you decide to attack the messenger.

As someone who wasn't involved in the argument regarding AMOM, I'll say this:

If a GCR in the future is occupied by the Pacific, I believe it will be The West Pacific.
But unlike Val, I'll actually be bothered, because I don't want to see TWP, or any other GCR, successfully taken over by the NPO again.

[Bhang Bhang Duc]

If a GCR in the future is occupied by the Pacific, I believe it will be The West Pacific.
But unlike Val, I'll actually be bothered, because I don't want to see TWP, or any other GCR, successfully taken over by the NPO again.

If it was a choice between the NPO and Cormac, I'd settle for the NPO.

And I don't like the NPO!

[Siberian Districts]

If a GCR in the future is occupied by the Pacific, I believe it will be The West Pacific.
But unlike Val, I'll actually be bothered, because I don't want to see TWP, or any other GCR, successfully taken over by the NPO again.

If it was a choice between the NPO and Cormac, I'd settle for the NPO.

And I don't like the NPO!

At least Cormac has a name I know how to spell

[Consular]

Ok, in no particular order...

You're being lynch mobbed on the TWP forums for pointing stuff out. Talk about an overreaction.

Seriously?

If TWP ousts their Sec-Gen over this, they're fucking up. Big-time.

Do you even have any idea at all what you're talking about? No? Yeah, I didn't think so.

The "Secretary General" or whatever nonsense he entitles himself is the leader of a "revolutionary" party who came to TWP with the intention of replacing everything we stand for with Milograd. In a nutshell right there. The party is even comprised almost entirely of people Milograd imported from Lazarus, such as the ever flakey Ikania and co. It even uses the same broad themes as Milograd used in TSP and Lazarus.

He isn't 'our Sec-Gen' or whatever you think you're talking about.

And I'm glad I did, because he's exactly the person your region needs.

Yes, because you clearly know exactly what The West Pacific needs. /sarcasm

You're not really in any position to make such claims, "Ike".

Or perhaps actual experience with this? I was a Lazarene. I saw what the NPO can and will do to a region, every time they get the chance. They slowly turned us into a satellite state, stripped us of our sovereignty, and forced us into the role of the least active Sinker in the game.

I don't do what gets me a political position. I proved that when I refused to back down in my support for Lazarene Democracy. I do what's right for the region, and every time it proves to have been the wrong choice if what I wanted was power. Luckily, that's not what I want.

The NPO is not taking over The West Pacific. I don't think you've even used this rhetoric before, so please don't suddenly jump on this ridiculous bandwagon to prop up your position.

You do what you think is right for the region. Don't confuse that with some supposed omnipotent ability to sense an absolute right course of action that doesn't actually exist.

All this turning yourself into a victim stuff is tiring. Basically, your ideal plans for a bureaucracy choked and weak false democracy failed in Lazarus, so you're trying to just plaster them on a different region instead. Attempting to impose your own vision of what a region should be like, without any consideration for TWP's own history and unique approach, is not noble.

[Ikania]

Ok, in no particular order...

Seriously?

If TWP ousts their Sec-Gen over this, they're fucking up. Big-time.

Do you even have any idea at all what you're talking about? No? Yeah, I didn't think so.

The "Secretary General" or whatever nonsense he entitles himself is the leader of a "revolutionary" party who came to TWP with the intention of replacing everything we stand for with Milograd. In a nutshell right there. The party is even comprised almost entirely of people Milograd imported from Lazarus, such as the ever flakey Ikania and co. It even uses the same broad themes as Milograd used in TSP and Lazarus.

He isn't 'our Sec-Gen' or whatever you think you're talking about.

And I'm glad I did, because he's exactly the person your region needs.

Yes, because you clearly know exactly what The West Pacific needs. /sarcasm

You're not really in any position to make such claims, "Ike".

Or perhaps actual experience with this? I was a Lazarene. I saw what the NPO can and will do to a region, every time they get the chance. They slowly turned us into a satellite state, stripped us of our sovereignty, and forced us into the role of the least active Sinker in the game.

I don't do what gets me a political position. I proved that when I refused to back down in my support for Lazarene Democracy. I do what's right for the region, and every time it proves to have been the wrong choice if what I wanted was power. Luckily, that's not what I want.

The NPO is not taking over The West Pacific. I don't think you've even used this rhetoric before, so please don't suddenly jump on this ridiculous bandwagon to prop up your position.

You do what you think is right for the region. Don't confuse that with some supposed omnipotent ability to sense an absolute right course of action that doesn't actually exist.

All this turning yourself into a victim stuff is tiring. Basically, your ideal plans for a bureaucracy choked and weak false democracy failed in Lazarus, so you're trying to just plaster them on a different region instead. Attempting to impose your own vision of what a region should be like, without any consideration for TWP's own history and unique approach, is not noble.

It didn't fail in Lazarus because it was never tried. You can thank Lenny and Funk for that. But guess what? Lazarus got coup'd, and the new government that's being set up is almost exactly what I envisioned in Llamas' plan that never took off. So it's going to be tried, you could say. We have yet to see if it fails.

You do what you think is right for the region. Don't confuse that with some supposed omnipotent ability to sense an absolute right course of action that doesn't actually exist.

And that is where you are incredibly... right. But this doesn't just apply to me. TWP can be held as an example of a stable GCR thanks to its unique political system, but then again, TNP and TEP are also forum-based democracies, and they're doing just fine. The problem with the West Pacific crowd is that they're too stubborn and opposed to any change. Is it not acceptable that newcomers can't have new ideas? That only the old guard knows what's right? That's NPO-style talk there.

[RiderSyl]

<snip>

I assumed TWP wouldn't let him parade around with that nation title if he wasn't actually Secretary General. So, yeah, I didn't have any idea what I was talking about there. I can admit it. Thanks for setting me straight on that one.

[Darkesia]

I find this tiresome. So I will say it once and paste it everywhere else. (forgive the weird punctuation. My phone has its own ideas about such things)

Here begins the official statement.

To those of you telegram ming me that if I don't eject Llamas, TWP looks weak, I will not eject him. He has put tons of work into the region. And hhe really does believe all the foam at the mouth fear mongering about the NPO. So I have no doubt that he believes that if anyone else become PM the entire region is going to burn in blue and black flames. He's wrong, but he has no nefarious intent. He made it clear in his post that triggered this that he has no love for TWP. Instead he wants to save us all from ourselves. OK.

I think anyone voting for him in the election is nuts. But given the fearmongering, I cannot expect newer nations to vote for the alternative either. In their minds they must choose between the silly ineptitude of Llamas or the scary NPOness of Elegarth. It's not much of a choice.

Now, to those who say I am just waiting to turn the region over to the NPO: listen up, you idiots! I was an NPO Senator. I still have ties to the region. If I wanted to make the region a colony all I would have to do I change the flag and start hailing o/

I won't bother pointing out that Winni would laugh at me, as would the rest of the region, because you all either think I am a complete idiot or some sooper seekrit plotter. I know you think there is something wrong with TWP, because you can't put it in a box and label it. But our system is the very thing that keeps the NPOs of the game from subverting us.

So, go ahead and vote on stuff. Vote on if you should hold a vote in order to determine if you should vote on voting to vote. It will be fine. You'll see. And if you choose, after I am gone, to try to force control via the forum, it's fine too. I will take bets on how long it will take before you have a rogue delegate declaring for the NPO.

The animosity is stupid. What used to make TWP unique was among other things, we all liked each other. I guess that's gone now.

And to all the kooks who say "you're a tyrant who must be destroyed." Come try it, bub.

(apologies again to all for any crazy phone punctuation or spelling)

[Consular]

<snip>

I assumed TWP wouldn't let him parade around with that nation title if he wasn't actually Secretary General. So, yeah, I didn't have any idea what I was talking about there. I can admit it. Thanks for setting me straight on that one.

Well, he is Secretary General I suppose. Just not Secretary General of anything that matters.

And that is where you are incredibly... right. But this doesn't just apply to me. TWP can be held as an example of a stable GCR thanks to its unique political system, but then again, TNP and TEP are also forum-based democracies, and they're doing just fine. The problem with the West Pacific crowd is that they're too stubborn and opposed to any change. Is it not acceptable that newcomers can't have new ideas? That only the old guard knows what's right? That's NPO-style talk there.

But we are not TNP. Or TEP. Or whatever. We are TWP, we are a bit different, and there's nothing wrong with that. We're not about to mimic other regions just because some people like those places. I'm not saying anything is wrong with the way they do things, but it's not for us. There is no problem in TWP -- other than the 'problem' you have with our unwillingness to conform to your ideal of what a region should be, which is what you're characterizing as 'stubbornness'. You're bumbling around trying to impose constitutional norms that don't fit our view of what a region is, and its relationship to offsite.

How incredibly stubborn of us it is to refuse to bend over backwards for flakey opportunists and their plans to impose what they think is 'right' for our region, like they're some kind of omnipotent saviors swooping from the sky to protect us from our own apparently lacking ability to govern ourselves. (/sarcasm)

Your little attempt at NPO scaremongering also means nothing, so you can save that nonsense.

[Dread Lady Nathicana]

I find this tiresome. So I will say it once and paste it everywhere else. (forgive the weird punctuation. My phone has its own ideas about such things)

Here begins the official statement.

To those of you telegram ming me that if I don't eject Llamas, TWP looks weak, I will not eject him. He has put tons of work into the region. And hhe really does believe all the foam at the mouth fear mongering about the NPO. So I have no doubt that he believes that if anyone else become PM the entire region is going to burn in blue and black flames. He's wrong, but he has no nefarious intent. He made it clear in his post that triggered this that he has no love for TWP. Instead he wants to save us all from ourselves. OK.

I think anyone voting for him in the election is nuts. But given the fearmongering, I cannot expect newer nations to vote for the alternative either. In their minds they must choose between the silly ineptitude of Llamas or the scary NPOness of Elegarth. It's not much of a choice.

Now, to those who say I am just waiting to turn the region over to the NPO: listen up, you idiots! I was an NPO Senator. I still have ties to the region. If I wanted to make the region a colony all I would have to do I change the flag and start hailing o/

I won't bother pointing out that Winni would laugh at me, as would the rest of the region, because you all either think I am a complete idiot or some sooper seekrit plotter. I know you think there is something wrong with TWP, because you can't put it in a box and label it. But our system is the very thing that keeps the NPOs of the game from subverting us.

So, go ahead and vote on stuff. Vote on if you should hold a vote in order to determine if you should vote on voting to vote. It will be fine. You'll see. And if you choose, after I am gone, to try to force control via the forum, it's fine too. I will take bets on how long it will take before you have a rogue delegate declaring for the NPO.

The animosity is stupid. What used to make TWP unique was among other things, we all liked each other. I guess that's gone now.

And to all the kooks who say "you're a tyrant who must be destroyed." Come try it, bub.

(apologies again to all for any crazy phone punctuation or spelling)

Le sigh.

*** Warned for the flaming/baiting ***

[Punk Daddy]

^That is so not flamebaiting. I really don't believe - from a game standpoint - you know what's going on.

Dark - I am one of those folks who voted for Llamas. I've been clear on my mistrust of Elegarth. Llamas as you say has put a lot of effort into the region and I hope he will continue.

It is an interesting day when there is forum turmoil on TWP, that doesn't typically happen and I can't recall it happening for at least 5-6 years, eternity for some of the newer players.

Still, TWP will rise from the present situation to form a more perfect union - err...offsite government. The NPO is a treatied ally with TWP and it would appear that many in the world are trying to further isolate the NPO. I have never disliked the NPO and respect many of its current and past members. Many I wouldn't say I trust completely, but respect nonetheless. What happened in Lazarus was unfortunate and yes they've unleashed their best bet at damage control (Pierconium) the player behind Vlagh, Gracius Maximus, and other people across the NSverse.

At the end of the day, TWP is going to be fine and while I don't have the same level of trust in Elegarth you do, the bond of TWP is far stronger than many other GCRs. To me that's why we've lasted so long and hopefully will continue.

[All Good People]

Yup, that's not flamebaiting in the slightest. If it is, there's a whole lot of other warnings that need to be passed out here. That's the most absurd mod warning I've seen in 11+ years here.

[The Miniluv Messenger]

Big Brother is watching Gameplay

---

Boom Goes the Dynamite: The Black Riders Occupied by Native Coalition

Following a Moderation ruling, the founder of The Black Riders has been deleted, recruitment bans have been announced, and more.

By Cormac Skollvaldr

---

OCCUPIED TBR - NationStates Gameplay went into a frenzy today when game moderator Sedgistan announced confirmation that Marshal Bob Moran of The Black Riders has been using an illegal recruitment script provided by a delete-on-sight player to recruit for TBR. Sedgistan's announcement, made on behalf of the NationStates Moderation team, followed recent news reports of collaboration between an infamous delete-on-sight player and senior TBR officials Overlord General Halcones and Moran. Both individuals have seen their nations as well as the founder nation of TBR, Black Riders Commander, deleted for severe rules violations.

The Moderation announcement also indicated that the same illegal recruitment script has been used to recruit for The Land of Kings and Emperors, prompting a ban on telegram recruitment for both TBR and The LKE for the next three months. Moran previously served as both Interior Minister of The LKE and Chief of the Imperial General Staff for the Imperial Army. Despite Moran's involvement in the government of The LKE, in a statement released to its embassies abroad and posted to the Gameplay forum, The LKE denies that Moran ever had access to the region's telegram API key and asserts that he had no involvement with the legal recruitment script that was being used by Emperor Onder Kelkia. Foreign observers, friendly to The LKE and otherwise, have noted their skepticism that The LKE would knowingly permit such disreputable behavior. The LKE has announced that it will be appealing the recruitment ban.

Following the deletion of Black Riders Commander, UnitedGermanRegions and a coalition of 64 supporters seized the Delegacy of TBR at this afternoon's minor update. It soon became clear that UnitedGermanRegions was an invading Delegate representing what has been a growing tide of native opposition to TBR over the past several months. At the time of this writing, UnitedGermanRegions has 135 endorsements, most from nations that are not flying the flags of known gameplay regions or organizations, though the Taijitu Citizens' Militia and Right to Life Army are openly supporting the occupation of TBR. In the interest of transparency, The Miniluv Messenger discloses that the author of this article is the Citizen-Initiator of Taijitu and a member of its Militia, but is not currently deployed in TBR.

Despite invasion and occupation of their home region, TBR forces have not yet ended their nearly three month long occupation of Atheist Empire, which has led another news service less thorough in its research to mistakenly conclude that TBR is now using Atheist Empire as its base of operations. Marshal Gest and the most active members of TBR have instead relocated to DEN, at least for the time being, and there is no indication that TBR forces are planning for the daunting task of liberating their home region. Some observers have noted that relocation and abandonment of the TBR home region is consistent with contemporary raider philosophy, which maintains that communities should abandon or re-found founderless regions rather than continuing to inhabit them. There is no current indication that occupation of TBR will have any significant impact on TBR operations, most of which were coordinated via off-site media such as the TBR forum or Skype.

The Miniluv Messenger will have more on this story as it continues to develop.

[The Miniluv Messenger]

Big Brother is watching Gameplay

---

Time of the Season: Alleged Coup Plot in Osiris

An intelligence operative acting on behalf of several independent and imperialist regions has accused the Vizier of Osiris of plotting a coup.

By Cormac Skollvaldr

---

MEMPHIS - An intelligence operative acting on behalf of several independent and imperialist regions has revealed to The Miniluv Messenger, on the condition of anonymity, that the Vizier of Osiris may be plotting a coup d'etat against the Osiris Fraternal Order. Ainocra, the Vizier of Osiris -- the region's vice delegate -- has previously served as Scribe of World Assembly Affairs and as a Guardian of the Atef, the Osiran security council. He is currently a candidate in the ongoing election for Pharaoh. Ainocra also has ties to national sovereigntist regions Antarctic Oasis and Monkey Island, the former also the home region of The Dourian Embassy, who perpetrated a coup d'etat against the Kemetic Republic of Osiris in league with Gatesville Inc in July 2013. Ainocra was recruited to Osiris by The Dourian Embassy, who had by that time been granted amnesty for his prior coup, in July 2014.

The intelligence operative suggested to The Miniluv Messenger that these parallels are not a coincidence, but are instead part of a well timed plot to provide "a second act" to the July 2013 coup against Osiris. The operative suggested that national sovereigntists, including Gatesville Inc, have been waiting for the right opportunity to again overthrow the government of Osiris since the conclusion of the 2013 coup and Osiris' nullification of its peace agreement with Gatesville Inc. According to the operative, they found that opportunity in Ainocra, whose meteoric rise to power and popularity in Osiris mirrors the rise of The Dourian Embassy in 2013. His election to the office of Pharaoh is alleged to be the final step in the plan to overthrow the Osiris Fraternal Order and restore the Osiris Imperium, the illegitimate government established by Gatesville Inc in 2013.

The operative alleges that high profile members of Gatesville Inc, Antarctic Oasis, and Monkey Island have been involved in the conspiracy, allegedly including Delegate Mousebumples of Europeia, Queen Nevadar of Gatesville Inc, Durkadurkiranistan II, and The Dourian Embassy himself. The operative suggested to The Miniluv Messenger that The Dourian Embassy, despite appearing to be inactive in NationStates for many months, has been actively involved with the plot from the beginning and has even occasionally been active on the Osiris Fraternal Order forum via Ainocra's account, using a proxy IP address. The Miniluv Messenger has not been able to independently verify whether Ainocra has used a proxy IP address during his time in Osiris.

When asked to provide evidence of this plot, the operative provided a partial screen shot of a Skype conversation as well as alleged IRC logs. The operative has asked that this evidence not be published as it is part of an ongoing intelligence operation that could jeopardize vital intelligence assets. When asked why this information has not been provided to the Osiris Fraternal Order, the operative frankly stated: "We don't know exactly who else is in on it." Indeed, the allegation that the Delegate of Europeia is part of the conspiracy will come as a shock to many, as Europeia is an early and close ally of the Osiris Fraternal Order. The operative stressed that there is no evidence of the Europeian government's knowledge or involvement in the conspiracy. The operative also suggested that one of the primary aims of the plan is to boost national sovereigntist voting power in the World Assembly, also one of the stated aims of the July 2013 coup by Gatesville Inc.

Several members of the regions alleged to be involved in the plot have cast votes for Ainocra in the ongoing Pharaoh election, most prominently including Omigodtheykilledkenny, the Founder of Antarctic Oasis, who has been only sporadically active in Osiris until recently. Kenny was also supportive of the July 2013 coup by The Dourian Embassy, prompting Osiris to sever diplomatic relations with Antarctic Oasis at the time. Ainocra currently leads his challenger, former Pharaoh Ambroscus Koth, by one vote.

In the interest of transparency, The Miniluv Messenger discloses that the author of this article has twice served as Pharaoh of Osiris, including as Pharaoh-in-Exile during the July 2013 coup d'etat, and is currently convicted of and serving a sentence for treason against the Osiris Fraternal Order.

[Ikania]

"By Cormac"

[Solorni]

I'd like to see some proof first, especially because this comes during the Pharaoh election in Osiris. So this could in fact help determine the vote even if it isn't true.

[Todd McCloud]

It's an interesting claim. But one that doesn't really hold water. Until this "anonymous source" submits any semblance of proof to the justice department, it remains speculative and a conspiracy, especially given the timing of the publication and the current voting trends in the election.

Still, if there is a coup, he'd better make sure he has the right people on board like the last regime that transformed Osiris's government, or he will probably be SOL.

[Topid]

Is there another viable candidate or are we all doing this later in the summer?

[Lord Ravenclaw]

I echo Rach on this.

Beyond that, I will sit and see. Justice will be done, should it be necessary.

[RiderSyl]

I remember during the last Osiris election, one of the candidates had an often-maligned player accusing them of something that would take them out of the race for Pharaoh. The candidate had such a good reputation, though, and the accuser had such a bad one, that nobody believed them. That was, until the candidate admitted to the accusation being true, apologized, resigned from all positions in Osiris, and temporarily retired from the game.

I was the candidate. The accusation was that I forum-crashed. Frak was the accuser. He was 100% truthful.

Just food for thought, before anyone dismisses this based on "Lol Cormac".

[Glen-Rhodes]

Ugh, *finally*. This summer has been so boring.

Who do we think this "intelligence operative" is?

[94 block]

Glen, this is still a boring summer as there is no coup and no proof. As the publication states these are all allegations and conspiracy theories that are all very obviously propaganda. It'd be interesting see however, that these allegations to indeed prove to be false.

[Revall]

Ugh, *finally*. This summer has been so boring.

Who do we think this "intelligence operative" is?

Must be NES doesn't he run intelligence for everyone and last I heard he and Cormac get along gloriously