[DROPPED] Repeal "Liberate Region of reunited muslim states"

[Skyrim Diplomacy]

Basically, the Liberation is no longer affecting the region, as it has been refounded. Ergo, it is no longer needed. Pretty simple stuff here.
Scratch the previous, but I still believe this Liberation is now obsolete.

Repeal "Liberate Region of reunited muslim states"

Category: Repeal | Nominee: SC#88 | Proposed By: Skyrim Diplomacy

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Description: The Security Council,

NOTES that Region of reunited muslim states (RORMS) was invaded in April of 2012, spurring this council to Liberate RORMS with SC#88,

REALIZES that since SC#88 passed, RORMS has been refounded and that the natives of the region have departed for other regions,

UNDERSTANDS that SC#88 is now a threat to the region, disallowing any potential Delegate nation to place a password on the region to seal the region off from possible invaders,

CONCLUDES that SC#88 is obsolete and no longer of use to the world, this council, or RORMS,

REPEALS SC#88.

Co-Authored by Mousebumples

[Sedgistan]

Actually, the resolution is still in effect. We just hadn't got around to re-applying the badge yet.

[Skyrim Diplomacy]

Actually, the resolution is still in effect. We just hadn't got around to re-applying the badge yet.

And I see that is has been now. Welp, that may change the argument here a bit.

[Paper Flowers]

Last time I checked Liberations only stop delegate imposed passwords, so how is it stopping the founder putting one in place?

[Skyrim Diplomacy]

Last time I checked Liberations only stop delegate imposed passwords, so how is it stopping the founder putting one in place?

You saw nothing.

[Delegate Vinage]

Simple really. Does the region require the Liberation anymore? Nope.. so do we need the Liberation in place? Nope.

Nice and easy.

[Cormac Stark]

Simple really. Does the region require the Liberation anymore? Nope.. so do we need the Liberation in place? Nope.

Nice and easy.

I haven't made up my mind on this and I do see the validity of the argument that the liberation resolution is no longer necessary, but I'm going to play devil's advocate for a minute.

Let's assume that Region of reunited muslim states is going to go founderless again eventually, a somewhat safe assumption given that the region was founderless before being refounded and the region meant to be its successor -- RORMS -- also went founderless. If the liberation resolution remains in place, it will prevent the region from being password protected and griefed later in the event that it goes founderless. That's the benefit of leaving the liberation resolution in place.

The cost of leaving the liberation resolution in place is... what, exactly? In other words, what harm is the liberation resolution doing to the region that makes repeal necessary, in light of the harm that repealing it could do later if the region goes founderless?

[Little Orphan Annie]

This proposal benefits anyone but the author how? Are we being asked to take out The Security Council's trash? The Liberation appears to have been a complete waste of the Security Council's time. Repealing it would be another.

Against.

There's hardly a hint of any future delegacy much less a threat to one. No natives have returned to the refounded RORMS and no new nations have shown any interest in the region.

I'd consider voting for a Repeal only if RORMS had any sort of native presence. A surplus Liberation badge causes me not a whit of discomfort. Removing it for the purpose of padding Skyrim Diplomacy's resume would.

[Kanaia]

Why shouldn't the Security Council clean up after itself?

[Skyrim Diplomacy]

This proposal benefits anyone but the author how? Are we being asked to take out The Security Council's trash? The Liberation appears to have been a complete waste of the Security Council's time. Repealing it would be another.

That...is awful logic. The original served a purpose, failed on some accounts, and is no longer necessary, so we should leave it in place to sit? I see where you're going with that...

The SC should "take out it's own trash" in this instance, yes. The original proposal has served its purpose, now the SC needs to repeal it.

There's hardly a hint of any future delegacy much less a threat to one. No natives have returned to the refounded RORMS and no new nations have shown any interest in the region.

Yet again, another reason why the original proposal should be removed. It's not doing anything for the natives of RORMS like was stated in the original proposal, specifically

AWARE that these natives have expressed their desire to return to their region and have subsequently gathered in the region of RORMS

I'd consider voting for a Repeal only if RORMS had any sort of native presence.

But not if the original proposal is now pointless? Yes, this repeal ultimately amounts to not much more than some SC house cleaning, but if the original proposal is no longer necessary, than it doesn't need to stand.

A surplus Liberation badge causes me not a whit of discomfort. Removing it for the purpose of padding Skyrim Diplomacy's resume would.

I don't see any argument there, only your personal "discomforts," so I don't believe there's anything there to address.

[Mahaj]

Why shouldn't the Security Council clean up after itself?

The resolution isn't trash though.

It could very well serve an important future purpose.

I oppose this.

[Skyrim Diplomacy]

Why shouldn't the Security Council clean up after itself?

The resolution isn't trash though.

It could very well serve an important future purpose.

I oppose this.

That could be said about any law (Liberation or otherwise) ever. Potential future purpose is not a good enough reason to let the current legislation stand.

[Kanaia]

Why shouldn't the Security Council clean up after itself?

The resolution isn't trash though.

It could very well serve an important future purpose.

I oppose this.

It was not my intention to imply it was. I was simply responding to Little Orphan Annie's assertion that repealing past Security Council resolutions, especially poor ones, was a waste of time.

[Cormac Stark]

That could be said about any law (Liberation or otherwise) ever. Potential future purpose is not a good enough reason to let the current legislation stand.

I still haven't seen a compelling reason to repeal it either. The usual reason for repealing a liberation resolution is that a native community needs to protect itself or wants to refound. In this case, Region of reunited muslim states has already been refounded. The liberation resolution can't do any harm to a native community if one should form there and, if the region goes founderless, it could actually do some good.

[Mahaj]

The resolution isn't trash though.

It could very well serve an important future purpose.

I oppose this.

That could be said about any law (Liberation or otherwise) ever. Potential future purpose is not a good enough reason to let the current legislation stand.

Why should it be removed other than "I want it to be"?

You've provided zero reasons.

[Skyrim Diplomacy]

That could be said about any law (Liberation or otherwise) ever. Potential future purpose is not a good enough reason to let the current legislation stand.

Why should it be removed other than "I want it to be"?

You've provided zero reasons.

REALIZES that since SC#88 passed, RORMS has been refounded and that the natives of the region have departed for other regions,

UNDERSTANDS that SC#88 is now a threat to the region, disallowing any potential Delegate nation to place a password on the region to seal the region off from possible invaders,

CONCLUDES that SC#88 is obsolete and no longer of use to the world, this council, or RORMS,

[Cormac Stark]

UNDERSTANDS that SC#88 is now a threat to the region, disallowing any potential Delegate nation to place a password on the region to seal the region off from possible invaders,

This part isn't actually the case. Given that the region has been refounded, SC#88 isn't a threat to the region now in that the Founder can place a password on the region. It's virtually invasion-proof with a Founder.

An argument could be made that if the region goes founderless SC#88 could pose a threat to the region, but a counterargument could just as easily be made that allowing the region to be password-protected could eventually land it right back in a griefing situation like the one that occurred previously.

I'm just not seeing a compelling reason to repeal this given that it's not doing any harm to the region.

[Mahaj]

Why should it be removed other than "I want it to be"?

You've provided zero reasons.

REALIZES that since SC#88 passed, RORMS has been refounded and that the natives of the region have departed for other regions,

UNDERSTANDS that SC#88 is now a threat to the region, disallowing any potential Delegate nation to place a password on the region to seal the region off from possible invaders,

CONCLUDES that SC#88 is obsolete and no longer of use to the world, this council, or RORMS,

Those reasons have been torn apart by Cormac.

[Skyrim Diplomacy]

Aye aye. With the reapplication of the Liberation, that sort of shot this whole thing down. I'll drop this effort. Thanks to Mahaj and Cormac for the constant input, as usual.