[PASSED] In Regards to Cloning

[Sedgistan]

Category: Human Rights
Strength: Mild

DEFINES cloning as 'the creation of an organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'
DEFINES clone as 'the organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'

RECOGNIZES the risk of cloning mistakes,
URGES nations to take steps to prevent cloning mishaps,
REQUIRES that cloning only be done by trained professionals,
DECLARES that nations cannot classify sentient sapient clones as their own legal class,
REQUIRES sapient clones in member nations be extended all the legal rights, privileges, and opportunities granted to their genetically identical counterparts,
DECLARES that clones cannot be used for the purpose of or as part of a violation of other GA resolutions,
AFFIRMS the right of nations to pursue cloning of sapient beings,
PRESERVES the right of nations to illegalize such cloning in that nation,
REMINDS that nations are allowed to enact further legislation in regards to clones, so long as it does not violate this act.
Co-authored by [nation=short]Cool Egg Sandwich[/nation]

DEFINES cloning as 'the creation of an organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'
DEFINES clone as 'the organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'

RECOGNIZES the risk of cloning mistakes,
URGES nations to take steps to prevent cloning mishaps,
REQUIRES that cloning only be done by trained professionals,
DECLARES that nations cannot classify sentient sapient clones as their own class,
REQUIRES nations to treat clones as they would any other person of their nation,
DECLARES that clones cannot be used for the purpose of or as part of a violation of other GA resolutions,
REMINDS that nations are allowed to enact further legislation in regards to clones, so long as it does not violate this act.

I was looking at this, and it seems like a lot of the 'ethical' objections to cloning are purely based on religious bases, something i'm not going to deal with in a resolution on an international scale, which is, of course, the scale of the WA.

Keep in mind cloning is legal as per GA #126

The World Assembly,

DEFINES cloning as 'the creation of an organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'
DEFINES clone as 'the organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'

URGES nations to take steps to prevent cloning mishaps,
REQUIRES that cloning only be done by trained professionals,
DECLARES that clones cannot be used for the purpose of or as part of a violation of other GA resolutions,
REQUIRES nations to treat clones as they would any other person of their nation,
REMINDS that nations are allowed to enact further legislation in regards to clones, so long as it does not violate this act.

Thoughts about this? A rather short, simple draft in regards to cloning that doesn't do a terribly large amount, but does some nice stuff.

MODEDIT: At Vote debate begins here.

[Cool Egg Sandwich]

Category: Human Rights
Strength: Mild

The World Assembly,

DEFINES cloning as 'the creation of an organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'
DEFINES clone as 'the organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'

URGES nations to take steps to prevent cloning mishaps,
REQUIRES that cloning only be done by trained professionals,
DECLARES that clones cannot be used for the purpose of or as part of a violation of other GA resolutions,
REQUIRES nations to treat clones as they would any other person of their nation,
REMINDS that nations are allowed to enact further legislation in regards to clones, so long as it does not violate this act.

Thoughts about this? A rather short, simple draft in regards to cloning that doesn't do a terribly large amount, but does some nice stuff.

Hmm, I can see a couple things that I might take offense to.

URGES nations to take steps to prevent cloning mishaps

What, exactly do you mean by 'cloning mishaps?' We would need to have clarification on this subject until we can declare support/opposition.

REQUIRES nations to treat clones as they would any other person of their nation

According to this clause, nations would be required to treat all clones as they would any other person, even if the clone in question isn't human/sapient, or the like.

Finally, wouldn't clones of humans/sapient creatures be given the rights guaranteed to those creatures due to their biological/genetic characteristics? What I mean is, since those "clones" are biologically human/sapient wouldn't legislation protecting them be redundant?

Rgds.,

[Mahaj WA Seat]

True...

I'm not entirely sure a legislation on cloning would be appropriate...perhaps something about the actual creation and some cloning ethics stuff?

Also...i'm not sure as to what the legal status of clones would be, because they weren't reared in the same way...in a way similar at all...

[Cool Egg Sandwich]

True...

I'm not entirely sure a legislation on cloning would be appropriate...perhaps something about the actual creation and some cloning ethics stuff?

Also...i'm not sure as to what the legal status of clones would be, because they weren't reared in the same way...in a way similar at all...

I understand your concerns, Ambassador, and I am certainly open to helping you draft a piece of legislation perhaps on 'ethics of cloning.' I just fail to see how 'clones' [human/sapient in this case] would not also be eligible for the same rights humans/sapient creatures are entitled to. They are biologically the same, so there should be no legal reason why they are denied those rights.

Rgds.,

[Mahaj WA Seat]

True...

I'm not entirely sure a legislation on cloning would be appropriate...perhaps something about the actual creation and some cloning ethics stuff?

Also...i'm not sure as to what the legal status of clones would be, because they weren't reared in the same way...in a way similar at all...

I understand your concerns, Ambassador, and I am certainly open to helping you draft a piece of legislation perhaps on 'ethics of cloning.' I just fail to see how 'clones' [human/sapient in this case] would not also be eligible for the same rights humans/sapient creatures are entitled to. They are biologically the same, so there should be no legal reason why they are denied those rights.

Rgds.,

I'm wondering as to whether some nations would perhaps issue a national law classifying clones simply into a class as 'clones' and then being able to deny rights.

In any regards, i'll give this some thought tonight and then work something up for posting Tuesdayish.

[Cool Egg Sandwich]

I understand your concerns, Ambassador, and I am certainly open to helping you draft a piece of legislation perhaps on 'ethics of cloning.' I just fail to see how 'clones' [human/sapient in this case] would not also be eligible for the same rights humans/sapient creatures are entitled to. They are biologically the same, so there should be no legal reason why they are denied those rights.

Rgds.,

I'm wondering as to whether some nations would perhaps issue a national law classifying clones simply into a class as 'clones' and then being able to deny rights.

In any regards, i'll give this some thought tonight and then work something up for posting Tuesdayish.

Hmmm, I think you may be onto something, Ambassador. Perhaps drafting a piece of 'barring' legislation preventing nations from classifying 'clones' as a separate class, thereby denying [sapient/human] clones their 'basic human rights.'

I would be vehemently in favor of such a piece of legislation, indeed I would aid in drafting if the opportunity presented itself.

Rgds.,

[Baptovia]

Ambassador, please also consider that a human/sapient being could perform a major crime and the clone of said human/sapient being could take the fall for it...or the opposite

[Mahaj WA Seat]

I'm wondering as to whether some nations would perhaps issue a national law classifying clones simply into a class as 'clones' and then being able to deny rights.

In any regards, i'll give this some thought tonight and then work something up for posting Tuesdayish.

Hmmm, I think you may be onto something, Ambassador. Perhaps drafting a piece of 'barring' legislation preventing nations from classifying 'clones' as a separate class, thereby denying [sapient/human] clones their 'basic human rights.'

I would be vehemently in favor of such a piece of legislation, indeed I would aid in drafting if the opportunity presented itself.

Rgds.,

Yes indeed. I'll think something and post it for you and others to bat around and see what you think.

[Mahaj WA Seat]

Ambassador, please also consider that a human/sapient being could perform a major crime and the clone of said human/sapient being could take the fall for it...or the opposite

The police/government/whatever would be able to identify between the clone and the being, me thinks.

Though hey, thats just a risk inherent with clones.

[Cool Egg Sandwich]

Hmmm, I think you may be onto something, Ambassador. Perhaps drafting a piece of 'barring' legislation preventing nations from classifying 'clones' as a separate class, thereby denying [sapient/human] clones their 'basic human rights.'

I would be vehemently in favor of such a piece of legislation, indeed I would aid in drafting if the opportunity presented itself.

Rgds.,

Yes indeed. I'll think something and post it for you and others to bat around and see what you think.

We look forward to offering the 'Eggian' Opinion [to parody a famous NatSov'er] on your ideas on sapient clones.

Perhaps that could be the name, "On Sapient Clones," what do you think?

Rgds.,

[Kylarosa]

The same risk applies to monozygotic twins.
Also cloning their exact genetic structure wouldn't necessarily produce a clone. You also have to take into account epigenetic expression and telomeric shortening among other things. Which isn't to do with genes exactly put rather the heterochromatic structure surrounding the DNA molecule which allows expression of certain genes and the silencing of others. You could always develop a method of genetically tagging a clone to differentiate its DNA from the host ot more conveniently the mitochondrial DNA of the clone would always be different from thayt of the host because mitochondria always come from the mother.

Thats how you can tell a clone and its host apart so there will never be any confusion in a legal investigation.

[West Guiana]

Category: Human Rights
Strength: Mild

The World Assembly,

DEFINES cloning as 'the creation of an organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'
DEFINES clone as 'the organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'

URGES nations to take steps to prevent cloning mishaps,
REQUIRES that cloning only be done by trained professionals,
DECLARES that clones cannot be used for the purpose of or as part of a violation of other GA resolutions,
REQUIRES nations to treat clones as they would any other person of their nation,
REMINDS that nations are allowed to enact further legislation in regards to clones, so long as it does not violate this act.

Thoughts about this? A rather short, simple draft in regards to cloning that doesn't do a terribly large amount, but does some nice stuff.

These two lines are the same thing just re-worded

DEFINES cloning as 'the creation of an organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'
DEFINES clone as 'the organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'

like as Cool egg said, mishaps?

URGES nations to take steps to prevent cloning mishaps

Ok with this, they couldn't be used as slaves.

DECLARES that clones cannot be used for the purpose of or as part of a violation of other GA resolutions,

I'll be 50/50 on that.

REQUIRES nations to treat clones as they would any other person of their nation,

little confusing

REMINDS that nations are allowed to enact further legislation in regards to clones, so long as it does not violate this act.

it's different, but I really see nothing wrong with it, just that cloning itself how you see it maybe wrong.

[Darenjo]

For now, I'll abstain. Darenjo has banned cloning of sapient beings, since our clones tend not to have the same sapience - a quality that apparently be copied using Darenjon technology. That, plus the temptations of abuse, led to the banning of cloning within Darenjo.

Since nothing here seems to disallow banning cloning, I guess we could potentially support.

I'll keep an eye on this.

[Cool Egg Sandwich]

For now, I'll abstain. Darenjo has banned cloning of sapient beings, since our clones tend not to have the same sapience - a quality that apparently be copied using Darenjon technology. That, plus the temptations of abuse, led to the banning of cloning within Darenjo.

Since nothing here seems to disallow banning cloning, I guess we could potentially support.

I'll keep an eye on this.

Might I ask your thoughts on a resolution protecting the rights of sapient clones, Dr. Park Si-Jung? Would you be of the opinion that sapient clones should not be denied rights guaranteed to other sapient beings? i.e. humans, anthropomorphic bears etc.

Edit: I should clarify that the denial of rights in question would be the restult of classifying 'clones' as an entirely separate class, aside from their sapient identical counterpart.

Rgds.,

[Mahaj WA Seat]

Perhaps that could be the name, "On Sapient Clones," what do you think?

I sort of like it. Believe it or not...I named 'On Abortion' (well...I suggested it and it was chosen...its not actually a big deal). but yeah.

[Darenjo]

For now, I'll abstain. Darenjo has banned cloning of sapient beings, since our clones tend not to have the same sapience - a quality that apparently be copied using Darenjon technology. That, plus the temptations of abuse, led to the banning of cloning within Darenjo.

Since nothing here seems to disallow banning cloning, I guess we could potentially support.

I'll keep an eye on this.

Might I ask your thoughts on a resolution protecting the rights of sapient clones, Dr. Park Si-Jung? Would you be of the opinion that sapient clones should not be denied rights guaranteed to other sapient beings? i.e. humans, anthropomorphic bears etc.

Edit: I should clarify that the denial of rights in question would be the restult of classifying 'clones' as an entirely separate class, aside from their sapient identical counterpart.

Rgds.,

The rights of sapient clones, yes, we would certainly support without question. We just don't want mindless things walking around our streets with the right to vote.

[Mahaj WA Seat]

Might I ask your thoughts on a resolution protecting the rights of sapient clones, Dr. Park Si-Jung? Would you be of the opinion that sapient clones should not be denied rights guaranteed to other sapient beings? i.e. humans, anthropomorphic bears etc.

Edit: I should clarify that the denial of rights in question would be the restult of classifying 'clones' as an entirely separate class, aside from their sapient identical counterpart.

Rgds.,

The rights of sapient clones, yes, we would certainly support without question. We just don't want mindless things walking around our streets with the right to vote.

Since clones are awfully similar to the objects...why would you be cloning mindless things in the first place?

And I won't be giving these clones extra rights, just ensuring they get those of the thing they were cloned from.

And then some stuff on the ethics of cloning...

[Cool Egg Sandwich]

Title: "On Sapient Clones"
Category: Human Rights
Strength: Mild / Significant

The World Assembly,


DEFINES cloning as the process of creating a genetically identical copy of another organism.

DEFINES sapient clone as a genetically identical copy of a human being, or other sapient being.



AFFIRMS the right of member nations to pursue cloning of sapient beings.

REQUIRES that cloning of sapient beings only be performed by trained professionals.

REQUIRES sapient clones in member nations be extended all the legal rights, privileges, and opportunities granted to their genetically identical counterparts.

DECLARES that member nations shall not enact legislation that classifies sapient clones as a separate legal class from their genetically identical counterparts.

Perhaps something like this, or is this completely different from what you were getting at, Ambassador?

If this doesn't gel with your interests, I could possibly pursue something similar on my own.

Rgds.,

[SlavicRepublics]

The USSSR strongly suggest that cloning should be outlawed based on moral and religious grounds

[Mahaj WA Seat]

The USSSR strongly suggest that cloning should be outlawed based on moral and religious grounds

I'm not going to introduce WA legislation banning cloning.

[Hirota]

Since clones are awfully similar to the objects...why would you be cloning mindless things in the first place?

And I won't be giving these clones extra rights, just ensuring they get those of the thing they were cloned from.

And then some stuff on the ethics of cloning...

My understanding of Darenjo's point is that it would be possible to clone a person, and eliminate any sense of mind or sentience.

Some Future-Tech nations have the ability to transfer conciousness into a mindless thing, be that machine or clone, effectively eliminating death. (OOC: A Good example is "The Culture" who have a blase view of copying or backing up conciousness and restoring them into new or copied physical forms.)

Other scenarios that spring to mind could include the cloning of the physical form for replacement organs.

OOC: Also, under this proposal,Dolly the Sheep would have had the full range of rights. Maybe that's something you are seeking to accomplish?

[Cinistra]

Ambassador, please also consider that a human/sapient being could perform a major crime and the clone of said human/sapient being could take the fall for it...or the opposite

By bar coding your citizens you will know their whereabouts at any time. Problem solved.

[Embolalia]

I'm not going to introduce WA legislation banning cloning.

Personally, I wouldn't ask you to. I think given the broad spectrum of beliefs on this, and the fact that both sides are completely justified in holding their respective opinions, the WA has no role in banning cloning. However, I also don't think the WA should be requiring that cloning be legal.
It seems to me that this act is silent on (il)legalization. It worries me that it might implicitly be construed as a legalization, despite the final clause. Could it be reworded in a way that would make note of the fact that a nation can, in fact, illegalize the entire practice of sapient cloning? Perhaps "enact further legislation in regards to clones, including a ban, so long as etc."?

[Mahaj WA Seat]

I'm not going to introduce WA legislation banning cloning.

Personally, I wouldn't ask you to. I think given the broad spectrum of beliefs on this, and the fact that both sides are completely justified in holding their respective opinions, the WA has no role in banning cloning. However, I also don't think the WA should be requiring that cloning be legal.
It seems to me that this act is silent on (il)legalization. It worries me that it might implicitly be construed as a legalization, despite the final clause. Could it be reworded in a way that would make note of the fact that a nation can, in fact, illegalize the entire practice of sapient cloning? Perhaps "enact further legislation in regards to clones, including a ban, so long as etc."?

Problem is one of the GA resolutions mentions cloning (the number is in the OP, I think its 126) so illegalizing it could be a problem.

And draft updated.

[Cool Egg Sandwich]

Category: Human Rights
Strength: Mild

DEFINES cloning as 'the creation of an organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'
DEFINES clone as 'the organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'

RECOGNIZES the risk of cloning mistakes,
URGES nations to take steps to prevent cloning mishaps,
REQUIRES that cloning only be done by trained professionals,
DECLARES that nations cannot classify sentient sapient clones as their own class,
REQUIRES nations to treat clones as they would any other person of their nation,
DECLARES that clones cannot be used for the purpose of or as part of a violation of other GA resolutions,
REMINDS that nations are allowed to enact further legislation in regards to clones, so long as it does not violate this act.

I was looking at this, and it seems like a lot of the 'ethical' objections to cloning are purely based on religious bases, something i'm not going to deal with in a resolution on an international scale, which is, of course, the scale of the WA.

Keep in mind cloning is legal as per GA #126

The World Assembly,

DEFINES cloning as 'the creation of an organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'
DEFINES clone as 'the organism that is an exact genetic copy of another'

URGES nations to take steps to prevent cloning mishaps,
REQUIRES that cloning only be done by trained professionals,
DECLARES that clones cannot be used for the purpose of or as part of a violation of other GA resolutions,
REQUIRES nations to treat clones as they would any other person of their nation,
REMINDS that nations are allowed to enact further legislation in regards to clones, so long as it does not violate this act.

Thoughts about this? A rather short, simple draft in regards to cloning that doesn't do a terribly large amount, but does some nice stuff.

I notice that you liked a couple of the suggestions I proposed in the pseudo-draft I put forth. I would like to call your attention, Ambassador, to a clause in my draft that I think should be included in your prospective draft 'In Regards to Cloning.'

AFFIRMS the right of member nations to pursue cloning of sapient beings.

As this clause would guarantee legalization of cloning in WA member nations, I think it would be beneficial to include something along these lines. Since GAR 126 does not explicitly legalize 'sentient sapient' cloning, I would prefer if the WA took a direct stance on cloning. Furthermore, this clause would not 'require' cloning in WA member nations, but merely allow for sapient cloning to occur seamlessly between all WA member nations.

REQUIRES nations to treat clones as they would any other person of their nation

I still have my reservations about this clause, as this would allow for non-sentient, non-sapient clones to be extended all legal privileges granted to 'persons' of WA member nations. As most WA member nations are populated by human beings, all clones would be extended 'human rights' by the wording of this clause. I think something like this [from my draft ] would be better suited to achieve the goal I think you're trying to achieve:

REQUIRES sapient clones in member nations be extended all the legal rights, privileges, and opportunities granted to their genetically identical counterparts.

I will continue to watch this debate closely; I will stop back to offer my opinions throughout the day.

Rgds.,