On the Subject of an Abstain option.

[Zarzbeckistan]

Am I the only person who wants the ability to abstain from voting on a topic that we don't care about? Or Abstaining when we would prefer not to have to make a decision either way just to get the little indicator on the sidebar to go away?

[Separatist Peoples]

Am I the only person who wants the ability to abstain from voting on a topic that we don't care about? Or Abstaining when we would prefer not to have to make a decision either way just to get the little indicator on the sidebar to go away?

This belongs in Technical, but if you look, you'll find an active topic on the subject already.

I, for one, would love that option.

[Imperium Anglorum]

Am I the only person who wants the ability to abstain from voting on a topic that we don't care about? Or Abstaining when we would prefer not to have to make a decision either way just to get the little indicator on the sidebar to go away?

This belongs in Technical, but if you look, you'll find an active topic on the subject already.

I, for one, would love that option.

I don't see the need. I already abstain on all SC votes and that isn't an issue, so I don't think there is a need for a button just to get the indicator on the sidebar away. Plus, having such a button would mean less votes as people just abstain from all legislation.

[Separatist Peoples]

This belongs in Technical, but if you look, you'll find an active topic on the subject already.

I, for one, would love that option.

I don't see the need. I already abstain on all SC votes and that isn't an issue, so I don't think there is a need for a button just to get the indicator on the sidebar away. Plus, having such a button would mean less votes as people just abstain from all legislation.

Exactly! People would abstain instead of voting against maliciously. You'd have a more accurate representation, and big delegates could exclude themselves without skewing the vote. Do you have any idea how many R&D regions vote against GA proposals for the sole reason that they're GA proposals and not SC proposals? Abstentions would make life so much easier.

And you can't make the claim that players who don't care won't vote. They'll check out the voting page, and choose and option because they're basically prompted to.

[Vancouvia]

I'm for it. I think a lot of people vote just to get rid of the big red notification

[Caracasus]

Yes, an abstain function, for all the reasons above, would be a great idea.

[Wallenburg]

Meh, I would consider it a low-priority addition, especially if it would be time consuming to implement. Nevertheless, it would be a nice option.

[Atomic Utopia]

I shall abstain from commenting on this matter.

great idea

[Shazbotdom]

Isn't it basically Abstaining if you do not vote at all on it? Wouldn't adding that option make it redundant?

[Vancouvia]

Isn't it basically Abstaining if you do not vote at all on it? Wouldn't adding that option make it redundant?

It's not the same because currently abstaining leaves you with a huge red notification which results in people voting just to clear it away

[Separatist Peoples]

Isn't it basically Abstaining if you do not vote at all on it? Wouldn't adding that option make it redundant?

It's not the same because currently abstaining leaves you with a huge red notification which results in people voting just to clear it away

Exactly! Not only that, but not voting due to inactivity and conscious abstentions are tracked the same way. You can't tell is a vote doesn't come in because the issue is irrelevant or because the delegate or player isn't active that week. That makes a difference in planning.

And as I said, it cuts down hugely in apathetic stacking. If you don't care, you abstain, you don't pile into one side because you just don't care at all. The entire point of this part of the game is to vote, and most players want to participate. No abstention vote means they have to pick a yes or no option contrary to their desire, which means you get even less accurate votes.

[Araraukar]

It's not the same because currently abstaining leaves you with a huge red notification which results in people voting just to clear it away

Um, what? Is that for delegates only? I don't get any notification about "things are up for vote" on PPU.

EDIT: And I'd also like to have that voting option.

[Wallenburg]

It's not the same because currently abstaining leaves you with a huge red notification which results in people voting just to clear it away

Um, what? Is that for delegates only? I don't get any notification about "things are up for vote" on PPU.

EDIT: And I'd also like to have that voting option.

We're talking about the annoying red stamp with a "1" on it that shows up when there's a resolution to vote on.

[Araraukar]

We're talking about the annoying red stamp with a "1" on it that shows up when there's a resolution to vote on.

...not for me (on PPU). Do you use one of the new-fangled web page theme settings? Mine's on "Antiquity".

[Wallenburg]

We're talking about the annoying red stamp with a "1" on it that shows up when there's a resolution to vote on.

...not for me (on PPU). Do you use one of the new-fangled web page theme settings? Mine's on "Antiquity".

I use Pinko.

[Separatist Peoples]

We're talking about the annoying red stamp with a "1" on it that shows up when there's a resolution to vote on.

...not for me (on PPU). Do you use one of the new-fangled web page theme settings? Mine's on "Antiquity".

Try Rift.

[Sunni Islamic Iran]

There is an abstain option, its called not voting. Cheers!

[Omigodtheykilledkenny]

It could really depress turnout if people could just click to make the make notification disappear. The object of putting them there in the first place was to encourage more people to vote. Moreover if the abstentions were added to the vote totals, they could wind up being embarrassingly high, rivaling the for/against columns.

That said, you currently have three options already: 1) revert to the Century theme in your Settings, so the notifications are a more neutral color, 2) switch your WA vote to a puppet, so you don't see them all the time, or 3) stop being so OCD and just train your eyes to ignore the top the screen, as I have done. I have so many unanswered notifications it's ridiculous.

[Povinksi]

Well, the way I look at it, NationStates is a political test. Ignoring an issue would be like ignoring a question, so you couldn't be judged fairly.

[Araraukar]

Try Rift.

No thanks, the Antiquity setting keeps the site very basic and simple and easy to navigate... and I've played NS the way it is for more than 10 years now. I'd rather not have big red marker poking me in the eye.

Well, the way I look at it, NationStates is a political test.

In that case it's like a test where you can't win and lying is an advantage.

[Separatist Peoples]

Well, the way I look at it, NationStates is a political test. Ignoring an issue would be like ignoring a question, so you couldn't be judged fairly.

Except it decidedly isn't.

There is an abstain option, its called not voting. Cheers!

Way to miss the point.

It could really depress turnout if people could just click to make the make notification disappear. The object of putting them there in the first place was to encourage more people to vote. Moreover if the abstentions were added to the vote totals, they could wind up being embarrassingly high, rivaling the for/against columns.

That said, you currently have three options already: 1) revert to the Century theme in your Settings, so the notifications are a more neutral color, 2) switch your WA vote to a puppet, so you don't see them all the time, or 3) stop being so OCD and just train your eyes to ignore the top the screen, as I have done. I have so many unanswered notifications it's ridiculous.

I think that would be a pretty effective indicator were it the case. Abstentions would limit apathetic throwaway votes. There's nothing more frustrating than having a delegate vote against because they don't care.

[Sunni Islamic Iran]

Well, the way I look at it, NationStates is a political test. Ignoring an issue would be like ignoring a question, so you couldn't be judged fairly.

Except it decidedly isn't.

There is an abstain option, its called not voting. Cheers!

Way to miss the point.

It could really depress turnout if people could just click to make the make notification disappear. The object of putting them there in the first place was to encourage more people to vote. Moreover if the abstentions were added to the vote totals, they could wind up being embarrassingly high, rivaling the for/against columns.

That said, you currently have three options already: 1) revert to the Century theme in your Settings, so the notifications are a more neutral color, 2) switch your WA vote to a puppet, so you don't see them all the time, or 3) stop being so OCD and just train your eyes to ignore the top the screen, as I have done. I have so many unanswered notifications it's ridiculous.

I think that would be a pretty effective indicator were it the case. Abstentions would limit apathetic throwaway votes. There's nothing more frustrating than having a delegate vote against because they don't care.

I beg your pardon?

[Separatist Peoples]

I beg your pardon?

You missed the point of the discussion: adding a button to avoid ignoring it. Pointing out the status quo is infinitely unhelpful when we already bloody know about it. Improving on it is the entire point of the discussion.

[Sunni Islamic Iran]

Theres no need to, your just adding an extra button that does the same thing as just not voting.

[Separatist Peoples]

Theres no need to, your just adding an extra button that does the same thing as just not voting.

It's already been established that an abstention function would provide alternative utilities. Or did you miss that in the single page of discussion? Arguing the merit of these utilities is all well and good, but let's not start ignoring points already made.