NSG Senate General Discussion Thread (Former Lobby)

[Intermountain States]

You did appointed me for ANG which I did reluctantly and then you gave it to someone else

I gave it to one of the American players, the Korean guy right?

I'm Korean-American and you gave it to me when I was in my old nation Corenea

[New Zepuha]

I gave it to one of the American players, the Korean guy right?

I'm Korean-American and you gave it to me when I was in my old nation Corenea

There we go.

[Dragomerian Islands]

The reason I like my proposed idea is also the only thing I could find a senate.

A senate belongs to a presidential style system with an actual senate; whereas the NSG Senate has only done a parliamentary style system. What would we call ourselves a senate where we are a parliament? My idea would make us a senate/presidential style system.

[Britanno]

The reason I like my proposed idea is also the only thing I could find a senate.

A senate belongs to a presidential style system with an actual senate; whereas the NSG Senate has only done a parliamentary style system. What would we call ourselves a senate where we are a parliament? My idea would make us a senate/presidential style system.

It's just a name. It can mean what we want it to mean.

I think people are getting too carried away with this. Does it really matter if it's unrealistic that we can't lose our seat? It's a key part of the RP. Realism is good, but at the end of the day we're still a roleplay.

[Of the Quendi]

The reason I like my proposed idea is also the only thing I could find a senate.

A senate belongs to a presidential style system with an actual senate; whereas the NSG Senate has only done a parliamentary style system. What would we call ourselves a senate where we are a parliament? My idea would make us a senate/presidential style system.

Senate's aren't in any way exclusive to presidential systems and the fact that you think so surprises me a great deal. Senate is just a name for a legislative body and it is used to describe legislative bodies in a multitude of non-presidential systems, traditionally in bicameral systems as the upper house.

[The Liberated Territories]

Like I said, NSGS -NationStates Government Simulator.

[Dragomerian Islands]

The reason I like my proposed idea is also the only thing I could find a senate.

A senate belongs to a presidential style system with an actual senate; whereas the NSG Senate has only done a parliamentary style system. What would we call ourselves a senate where we are a parliament? My idea would make us a senate/presidential style system.

Senate's aren't in any way exclusive to presidential systems and the fact that you think so surprises me a great deal. Senate is just a name for a legislative body and it is used to describe legislative bodies in a multitude of non-presidential systems, traditionally in bicameral systems as the upper house.

Senate is a word mostly attributed to a legislative body that is actually called a senate. Also, the Presidential Style system is the system most recognized to be associated with 'Senate'.

In addition, I could go on to say that since most NS Nations are made by people living in the US, by adopting a more US-like system, we would attract more members.

[Britanno]

Senate is a word mostly attributed to a legislative body that is actually called a senate.

Congratulations.

Also, the Presidential Style system is the system most recognized to be associated with 'Senate'.

Agreed, but it's not the only one.

In addition, I could go on to say that since most NS Nations are made by people living in the US, by adopting a more US-like system, we would attract more members.

Considering most Americans on this site fucking hate their political system, I'd argue it would have the opposite impact.

[Dragomerian Islands]

Senate is a word mostly attributed to a legislative body that is actually called a senate.

Congratulations.

Also, the Presidential Style system is the system most recognized to be associated with 'Senate'.

Agreed, but it's not the only one.

In addition, I could go on to say that since most NS Nations are made by people living in the US, by adopting a more US-like system, we would attract more members.

Considering most Americans on this site fucking hate their political system, I'd argue it would have the opposite impact.

We could always make up a new system because for the past 2 times, the NSG Senate has had a parliamentary democracy.

Also, I think the issue with the US system is how it is being run in all 3 branches, not the system itself.

[Maklohi Vai]

It is, but Kour's proposing an admin whose sole job is to review the "external" type RPs, like crime syndicates, location threads, etc.

Additionally, crime doesn't really work adversarially.

For example: Every crime leaves behind evidence. If I jump your garden fence, cross your lawn, use a screwdriver and stand on the bin lid to open the top-window, then reach inside and pull myself through before going around your house and finally opening the backdoor with the keys and leaving that way, I've left at least two footwear marks (of differing types) in the back garden, two or three tool marks, likely two full fingerprint marks (for each hand), and that's just entering.

NSGS had people RPing the most outlandish bullshit, like a mafia composed entirely of armoured cars, incredibly tightly export-controlled weapons, anti-tank munitions, trained special forces drivers and international trillionaire businessmen. Not only that, but magically all of these people would leave absolutely no forensic evidence at all behind. Not only that, but OOCly any attempt to infiltrate them would be god-modding (such as when I used an alt to fool the entire mafia into thinking that it wasn't the head of the police apping them), or as when someone in the mafia gave me access to their off-site forums, the evidence gained from that (arguably 'counts-as-surveillance-or-wiretapping-etc.') was null-and-void. Especially when it turned out that the Mafia itself had been making random stuff up without the permission of the person in question.

This left me as the Police having to shut down the entire capital city in a Gendarmerie drill in order to sufficiently limit movement and get enough forces (literally thousands of Gendarmes) in place to safely arrest senior mafia members without 'lel, fifty mafiosos appear out of nowhere in armoured cars with GPMGs and cut down the police, kthxbai'. Then that turned out that one person wasn't in the senate and I'd godmodded by assuming he was in the senate (but it wasn't godmodding to, on a previous occasion, assume that no policemen who were there to arrest a senator would recognise that it wasn't in fact the senator), and that the other one wasn't involved in the mafia and that my evidence was rendered null and void, because he'd IGNORE any attempts to arrest him. My RPing was criticised OOCly frequently because, in effect, 'you're not godmodding or wanking hard enough'. When I did godmod, or do anything out of the ordinary (like provide free pizzas to a riotous crowd, calming them down in a single post) it was lambasted and suddenly out of nowhere 'lel machineguns again'.

Basically doesn't work.

This makes a lot of sense, thanks for writing it out. I'm very sure that we'll need more review of RP actions this next time around. We'll have to see how people vote on admin structure before I can commit to having one admin designated for RP review.

Congratulations.


Agreed, but it's not the only one.


Considering most Americans on this site fucking hate their political system, I'd argue it would have the opposite impact.

We could always make up a new system because for the past 2 times, the NSG Senate has had a parliamentary democracy.

Also, I think the issue with the US system is how it is being run in all 3 branches, not the system itself.

No, the only thing keeping the American political system somewhat sane is having 3 branches. Brit's right that most of us hate the system.

[Planita]

How can I join NS Senate?

[Britanno]

How can I join NS Senate?

You just did.

[Unicario]

I enjoyed the amount of power I had, though the SDLP thing pissed me off to no end

[The New World Oceania]

How can I join NS Senate?

There will be a sign-ups thread in December or January once we get started. For now, I believe you've posted in the other thread, so just keep your opinion heard. I'm not sure if MV (our head admin) is letting newcomers vote in our decision later on in the thread.

I enjoyed the amount of power I had, though the SDLP thing pissed me off to no end

I may very well join the next incarnation as the ghost of Li.

[Finium]

I've been perusing the RP critiques; all very apt.

The solution, however, is not the system or the existence of organized crime. We should either require a more stringent application process, or better yet, allow the admins to crack down on ridiculousness more often.

I would argue that, since there is an obvious bias for a given character to not die, lose face etc., admins should approve anything outside of political threads rather than the characters requiring agreement on it between themselves.

[The Liberated Territories]

What did I tell you, Mak?

"IF you build it, they will come."

[Britanno]

What did I tell you, Mak?

"IF you build it, they will come."

We haven't built anything?

Plus it's more like:

"If you send a TG to 55 people, they will come."

[Maklohi Vai]

How can I join NS Senate?

There will be a sign-ups thread in December or January once we get started. For now, I believe you've posted in the other thread, so just keep your opinion heard. I'm not sure if MV (our head admin) is letting newcomers vote in our decision later on in the thread.

Once we get to decisions on IC factors in our country, new people will be able to vote. When we're still deciding basic structure, only old members.

What did I tell you, Mak?

"IF you build it, they will come."

Very true.

[Beta Test]

Someone get on IRC I'm bored.

[Maklohi Vai]

Someone get on IRC I'm bored.

Coming.

[Britanno]

Once we get to decisions on IC factors in our country, new people will be able to vote. When we're still deciding basic structure, only old members.

Out of interest, why? Shouldn't new people get a choice in the RP we make?

[Maklohi Vai]

Once we get to decisions on IC factors in our country, new people will be able to vote. When we're still deciding basic structure, only old members.

Out of interest, why? Shouldn't new people get a choice in the RP we make?

We have no way of enforcing that everyone who votes will join the RP, so we may end up with a decision that is not the will of the majority. Once we are into decisions on IC factors, they're generally less important and we're more likely to have people carry over into being active in the RP.

[The Orson Empire]

Someone get on IRC I'm bored.

Where is the link to the IRC?

[Maklohi Vai]

Someone get on IRC I'm bored.

Where is the link to the IRC?

http://webchat.esper.net/?nick=&channels=NSG_Senate

[Ainin]

Voting had started on Thursday, 20 November at 16:05 (UTC +8), and it is currently 16:32 on the 22nd. As such, the vote is hereby closed and no further votes shall be counted.

The final tally is as follows.
______________
Nation: 20 (83.3%)
__________
UN: 4 (16.6%)

Abstain: 2 (0%)
_____________________
Because more than 66.6% ("two thirds") + 1 of voters have expressed support for a single nation, the issue is hereby closed and no longer up for debate.

The current proposition at debate is as follows.

Resolved: The RP should start with a more minimal plan of IC details (blank slate) AGAINST Resolved: The RP should start with a more comprehensive plan of IC details

Thank you.
[blocktext]- Ainin