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[NUKED] Liberate Heroes Rise

A chamber dedicated to the dissemination of inter-regional peace and goodwill, via force if necessary.
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Kaboomlandia
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[NUKED] Liberate Heroes Rise

Postby Kaboomlandia » Wed Sep 21, 2016 9:32 pm

Noting that there is an intent to destroy and re-found the region, Heroes Rise, and displace the native community for numerous years to come by the current invading force; however, the liberation can prevent this from happening, allowing the proper authorities to free the region from the deviant hands of occupying forces.

Recognizing that it is the Security Council’s responsibility to safeguard regions, and promote peace and good will between regions, via force if necessary, and that the circumstances occurring in the region are well worthy of international action.

Understanding that the elected representative of the native community has fled the region, surrendering the territory to the invading forces; nevertheless, this action should not justify leaving the region, and its community, to the iron will of the occupying forces, and a doomed fate.

Urging defender forces to support this resolution in an effort to free the region from the reckless hardships forced upon the community by the invading entities and work to take whatever actions necessary to free the region [within international laws and norms], and ensure the territory’s security in the long run.

Remarking that a liberation by force may not occur as soon as this resolution is confirmed; however, with the liberation in place by this council, invading forces will find it extremely difficult to re-found the region, giving the community hope and not be displaced for a countless number of years to come.

Hereby Liberates: Heroes Rise.

Not my work, just posting here because it goes to vote soon.
Last edited by Kaboomlandia on Thu Sep 29, 2016 4:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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We Are Not the NSA
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Postby We Are Not the NSA » Thu Sep 22, 2016 7:10 am

I'll start right off the bat with why this proposal is complete bullshit: The Natives already surrendered. The elected leader of Heroes Rise gave the Black Hawks the region as a gift, and none of the other natives have objected to it. If the Security Council liberates this region, it will not only be interfering in an agreement that has already been struck between two sovereign regions, but it will be going against the wishes of the native government. Frankly I'm appalled that anyone would even consider interfering at this stage of the operation.

The Black Hawks entered the region with the goal of proving on an international scale that the interregional alliance known as ORCA is a sham. After the leader of ORCA, in a private IRC that a TBH agent infiltrated, told his commanders that ORCA was going to pretend that Heroes Rise wasn't a part of ORCA and thus not obligated to help (which it was), the delegate of HR realized that he had been part of a corrupt organization, and handed HR off to the invading TBH, instructing the rest of the natives to abandon the region as well. He went on to begin managing an interregional Discord Chat, in which he is welcoming to all members of NS, including raiders.

Tl;dr Liberating this region is actually going against the natives' wishes.

Description: Noting that there is an intent to destroy and re-found the region, Heroes Rise, and displace the native community for numerous years to come by the current invading force; however, the liberation can prevent this from happening, allowing the proper authorities to free the region from the deviant hands of occupying forces.

"Numerous years"? They're only displaced until they find a new region. And who are these "proper authorities" that you speak of? I ask because unless it is a native led task force, they have no right to interfere in this.
Recognizing that it is the Security Council’s responsibility to safeguard regions, and promote peace and good will between regions, via force if necessary, and that the circumstances occurring in the region are well worthy of international action.

No, they're really not. This is actually going to interfere between the relative goodwill between TBH and HR.
Understanding that the elected representative of the native community has fled the region, surrendering the territory to the invading forces; nevertheless, this action should not justify leaving the region, and its community, to the iron will of the occupying forces, and a doomed fate.

But the community left too!
Urging defender forces to support this resolution in an effort to free the region from the reckless hardships forced upon the community by the invading entities and work to take whatever actions necessary to free the region [within international laws and norms], and ensure the territory’s security in the long run.

How are they going to do this without the ability to password the region?
Remarking that a liberation by force may not occur as soon as this resolution is confirmed; however, with the liberation in place by this council, invading forces will find it extremely difficult to re-found the region, giving the community hope and not be displaced for a countless number of years to come.[/quote]
I think everyone already knows my response to this clause.
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Wrapper
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Postby Wrapper » Thu Sep 22, 2016 8:04 am

There's a bad region tag in the HEREBY line too.

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Bhang Bhang Duc
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Postby Bhang Bhang Duc » Thu Sep 22, 2016 8:14 am

Unfortunately NSA most of the voters will not read what you've written and will just go "Arrgh, evil raiders" and vote for this pile of junk.

I have recommended that TWP's Delegate votes against this resolution.
Last edited by Bhang Bhang Duc on Thu Sep 22, 2016 8:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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We Are Not the NSA
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Postby We Are Not the NSA » Thu Sep 22, 2016 8:37 am

Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:Unfortunately NSA most of the voters will not read what you've written and will just go "Arrgh, evil raiders" and vote for this pile of junk.

I have recommended that TWP's Delegate votes against this resolution.

I've assisted in setting up a counter campaign, so it is possible that we could pull through.
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Ever-Wandering Souls
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Postby Ever-Wandering Souls » Thu Sep 22, 2016 9:52 am

NSA and Dream Killers have said all of this as well as I could hope to. Let me quote his post over this way as well:

(no quote tags so the images stay intact)
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=348110&p=29949723#p29914120

A very interesting operation, for sure.

Given the name of the region and our initial intentions of testing out the capabilities of ORCA we believed that this was going to be a relatively short lived deal. One would think that, when given the opportunity to "rise to the challenge", it would be met with enthusiasm for the contest. To the dismay of the natives and all of those who were outright lied to in ORCA, we were wrong. ORCA failed and gave up entirely; their organization is in flames as we speak - reduced to nothing more than an RP region with members jumping ship daily. Liberation attempts by The Grey Wardens and TITO as well as their allies, while being notable, failed to gain real momentum. It was ultimately this combination of events that lead to the death of the community within Heroes Rise.

We now have a World Assembly Security Council proposal that will undoubtedly reach quorum aimed at "liberating" the region. No discussion thread has been established for it and I suspect the reasoning is simple: the powers behind it do not want to discuss the reality of the situation. This is a public relations nightmare for those involved, and one of their own doing. There is nothing left to liberate at this point. 34 days have passed. Even if things work out in their favor with the password being removed and the region eventually " " liberated " " by defender-aligned forces the damage has been done.

Image
Image
Image

Image


Drop the proposal and give up Heroes Rise. It is over. Everyone who actually called the region home has moved on.


also:

Scardino wrote:This whole series of events should serve as a point of embarrassment for defenders. The inhabitants were laughed at in Lone Wolves United's own Discord voice channel by defenders and completely ignored, only to be given one half-measure liberation attempt before being ultimately forsaken. Their own defender aligned mother organization, ORCA, never even attempted to put up any noticeable fight and abandoned them at the very beginning.


A liberation at this point is a last-ditch attempt by defenders to save face, a mockery of all the conversations we've since had with Acid (the former delegate), and false credit for organizations that literally laughed out loud at the idea of assisting preliminary efforts by ORCA to stage a liberation (only after the delegate said he no longer wanted their damn help, mind you). This matter has been deemed sufficiently settled by all relevant parties, only to be brought back from the dead in violation of the sovereign choices of the region's former leaders to pass it on to new ones, a decision made with absolutely zero suggestion or prompting from TBH, stemming entirely from the region's inhabitants.

Don't prove those who say the SC is just a tool for defenders to save face when they've failed to liberate a region right. Liberations should be passed for the benefit of the region's natives, and this proposal is in direct opposition to their wishes.
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Postby Mousebumples » Thu Sep 22, 2016 10:58 am

For the record, I plan to vote against shortly after this makes it to vote at the major update. I'd encourage any WA Delegate (or voter, frankly) who is strongly opposed to this sort of non-native supported nonsense to join me. 12am EDT/5am BST - hope to see you voting then!

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We Are Not the NSA
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Postby We Are Not the NSA » Thu Sep 22, 2016 11:16 am

Wrapper wrote:There's a bad region tag in the HEREBY line too.

Technically speaking doesn't that count as an R3 violation? :P
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We Are Not the NSA
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Postby We Are Not the NSA » Thu Sep 22, 2016 1:06 pm

We Are Not the NSA wrote:
Wrapper wrote:There's a bad region tag in the HEREBY line too.

Technically speaking doesn't that count as an R3 violation? :P

After some time pondering this joke, I just realized something: This is a Rule 3 violation.

The operative clause does not match the proposal's target (Precedent). It is calling for the Liberation of a region called " Heroes Rise", a region which does not exist, while the proposal itself is Liberating the region known as "Heroes Rise". Now, we all know what the author means, but that does not change the fact that practically speaking the operative clause calls for the Liberation of the wrong region.

If this mistake was located anywhere else in the proposal, or if the author had decided not to include a region link, it would be fine. Unfortunately, the author decided to provide a link, and they provided it in the operative clause. If I were writing a Liberation of HYDRA Command, and my operative clause was,
Hereby Liberates HYDRA Command.

it would be counted as a Rule 3 violation, because it now has to be read as Liberating the command of the region Hydra (Precedent- working in reverse from the point Ardchoille is making, this is at least implied if not explicitly stated). It is the same mistake, just more obvious than it is in the proposal in the OP. Either way the author made a mistake when using the [region] BBCode. Another example is if I wanted to Commend the West Pacific, but I wrote "the West Pacific".

As the second piece of Precedent I linked to states, the inclusion/location of regional links does in fact have an effect on the meaning of an operative clause, and can, in fact, change the target of an operative clause. Because of this, the broken link in this proposal's operative clause does not state the intention to Liberate the targeted region, and therefore is in violation of Security Council Rule #3.

I hope a moderator notices this soon and removes the illegal proposal, and if not, I hope a moderator can provide a very good explanation of how this is not a Rule 3 violation.
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Bhang Bhang Duc
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Postby Bhang Bhang Duc » Thu Sep 22, 2016 1:11 pm

Stick a GHR in to get a Mod to look at it quicker.
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Pierconium wrote:I see Funk as an opportunistic manipulator that utilises the means available to him to reach his goals. In other words, a nation after my own heart.

RiderSyl wrote:If an enchantress made it so one raid could bring about world peace, Unibot would ask raiders to just sign a petition instead.

Sedgistan wrote:The SC has just has a spate of really shitty ones recently from Northumbria, his Watermelon fanboy…..

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We Are Not the NSA
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Postby We Are Not the NSA » Thu Sep 22, 2016 1:17 pm

Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:Stick a GHR in to get a Mod to look at it quicker.

Already done.
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Crazy girl
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Postby Crazy girl » Thu Sep 22, 2016 1:28 pm

Well spotted. It is indeed a rule 3 violation (use region tags at your own risk and double check them using the preview function). Proposal deleted, if anyone is interested this is the list of approvals:

Approvals: 141 (Nay-o-bi, The Kerguelen Archipelago, Universal Socialism, Eagrose, Cresenthia, Kanaata, Gotesbourg, New Trotskyist Union, Bettisia, Froiiland, Salvostella, Western Arab Empire, Drifting Colonys of Aaron, Khornera, Overlord69, The Swadian Peoples, Exotic Lemon, Ransium, Froedal, Belgaam, Greater Warcholiss, Aeternabilis, Kosmicheskaya Stantsiya 13, Dylan Coopers State, Serbior, Laharao, SMUDZLANDIA, Dark Moist, The Former Alpine Nations, Prosperity Village, Baptized Believers, Neulacia, Wiepolskie, Zach-Way, Greater Curdistan, Holy Anri Thearchy, Arcturus Alpha, Bathor, Devernia, Goathland, Nuak, Vetega, Portugal and Brazil and Algarves, Senora Free State, Zasnia, Uspua Republic, North Campbell Nation, Socialist Cantons, Canaerus, The Los Angeles, Rifinti, Mushcap, Folzofia, Lollerland, Pholy Holine, Kaiser Adolf, The Anarchic fascist republic of an isle, Social Democratic Unions, MickyDs, Vladimirstan, Jean-Luc Picardia, Reismov, Arceus125, Goositania, External Nation, Ozzast, Almira, Iander, Limonostan, RunDown, Pug Paradise, East Perseland, Bastetopia, Opyros, Nova Roma et agros captos, King Rankmore, Savalen, Eclixia, Stars Edge, Wolfhawk, Caesarean, Lacmhacarh, Santos Derpa, Adesiem, Republic of Slovenia, Nihiliston, Colandane, Kingdom of Neph, Faunhaven, Destiny Island, Tee Googly Coffee Me, Latioa, Republic Of Hollinsgurd, Elksland, Chuporosa, Apathie, Frigidopia, Hlaalu Morrowind, Velorapt, Dunkayleeeel, Jerusalem and the Shire, Lux Dominion, The Union of Mandalorian Erebor, Squimsquid, Eurpenansv, Ancient Free and Accepted Masons, Jamaker, Otaku Stratus, Imperium Robinum, Prybourne WA, Steves Potatoes, Sylnaea, Free People of the World, Republic of Tacos, Ashtami, The Brave Barili Cebu, Carolina Alliance, New Nationale Einheit, Ienovo, Sealands Little Brother, Gillespie-Stantwick, Avendonia, The City-States of Kataria, The Germanic European Empire, OhNoMyCatHasAids, The Callesta, The Confederate States of Virginia, Noahs Second Country, Durecho, Bad Defence, Rheneland, Stormriven, Serenarea, Peoples Sane Holy Empire, Caffeine Addicts, Eythonia, Gentlemanly behaviours, Banspa, DogeSolo, Steelhand Grimnn, Janz)

Status: Quorum Reached: In Queue!

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Bhang Bhang Duc
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Postby Bhang Bhang Duc » Thu Sep 22, 2016 1:33 pm

Crazy girl wrote:Well spotted. It is indeed a rule 3 violation (use region tags at your own risk and double check them using the preview function). Proposal deleted, if anyone is interested this is the list of approvals:


*Sends CG a tanker full of coffee*
Former Delegate of The West Pacific. Guardian (under many Delegates) of The West Pacific. TWP's Former Minister for World Assembly Affairs and former Security Council Advisor.

The West Pacific's Official Welshman, Astronomer and Old Fart
Pierconium wrote:I see Funk as an opportunistic manipulator that utilises the means available to him to reach his goals. In other words, a nation after my own heart.

RiderSyl wrote:If an enchantress made it so one raid could bring about world peace, Unibot would ask raiders to just sign a petition instead.

Sedgistan wrote:The SC has just has a spate of really shitty ones recently from Northumbria, his Watermelon fanboy…..

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We Are Not the NSA
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Postby We Are Not the NSA » Thu Sep 22, 2016 1:45 pm

Crazy girl wrote:Well spotted. It is indeed a rule 3 violation (use region tags at your own risk and double check them using the preview function). Proposal deleted, if anyone is interested this is the list of approvals:

Approvals: 141 (Nay-o-bi, The Kerguelen Archipelago, Universal Socialism, Eagrose, Cresenthia, Kanaata, Gotesbourg, New Trotskyist Union, Bettisia, Froiiland, Salvostella, Western Arab Empire, Drifting Colonys of Aaron, Khornera, Overlord69, The Swadian Peoples, Exotic Lemon, Ransium, Froedal, Belgaam, Greater Warcholiss, Aeternabilis, Kosmicheskaya Stantsiya 13, Dylan Coopers State, Serbior, Laharao, SMUDZLANDIA, Dark Moist, The Former Alpine Nations, Prosperity Village, Baptized Believers, Neulacia, Wiepolskie, Zach-Way, Greater Curdistan, Holy Anri Thearchy, Arcturus Alpha, Bathor, Devernia, Goathland, Nuak, Vetega, Portugal and Brazil and Algarves, Senora Free State, Zasnia, Uspua Republic, North Campbell Nation, Socialist Cantons, Canaerus, The Los Angeles, Rifinti, Mushcap, Folzofia, Lollerland, Pholy Holine, Kaiser Adolf, The Anarchic fascist republic of an isle, Social Democratic Unions, MickyDs, Vladimirstan, Jean-Luc Picardia, Reismov, Arceus125, Goositania, External Nation, Ozzast, Almira, Iander, Limonostan, RunDown, Pug Paradise, East Perseland, Bastetopia, Opyros, Nova Roma et agros captos, King Rankmore, Savalen, Eclixia, Stars Edge, Wolfhawk, Caesarean, Lacmhacarh, Santos Derpa, Adesiem, Republic of Slovenia, Nihiliston, Colandane, Kingdom of Neph, Faunhaven, Destiny Island, Tee Googly Coffee Me, Latioa, Republic Of Hollinsgurd, Elksland, Chuporosa, Apathie, Frigidopia, Hlaalu Morrowind, Velorapt, Dunkayleeeel, Jerusalem and the Shire, Lux Dominion, The Union of Mandalorian Erebor, Squimsquid, Eurpenansv, Ancient Free and Accepted Masons, Jamaker, Otaku Stratus, Imperium Robinum, Prybourne WA, Steves Potatoes, Sylnaea, Free People of the World, Republic of Tacos, Ashtami, The Brave Barili Cebu, Carolina Alliance, New Nationale Einheit, Ienovo, Sealands Little Brother, Gillespie-Stantwick, Avendonia, The City-States of Kataria, The Germanic European Empire, OhNoMyCatHasAids, The Callesta, The Confederate States of Virginia, Noahs Second Country, Durecho, Bad Defence, Rheneland, Stormriven, Serenarea, Peoples Sane Holy Empire, Caffeine Addicts, Eythonia, Gentlemanly behaviours, Banspa, DogeSolo, Steelhand Grimnn, Janz)

Status: Quorum Reached: In Queue!

Thank you very much CG. I almost let it go without seriously brining it up. Then my geology lecture began and I got bored. :P
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Drasnia
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Postby Drasnia » Thu Sep 22, 2016 1:47 pm

We Are Not the NSA wrote:
Crazy girl wrote:Well spotted. It is indeed a rule 3 violation (use region tags at your own risk and double check them using the preview function). Proposal deleted, if anyone is interested this is the list of approvals:


Thank you very much CG. I almost let it go without seriously brining it up. Then my geology lecture began and I got bored. :P

But geology lectures rock! (Sorry, couldn't help myself.)

I'm interested to see if this gets resubmitted with the R3 violation fixed. I doubt it though.
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Ever-Wandering Souls
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Postby Ever-Wandering Souls » Thu Sep 22, 2016 1:59 pm

Drasnia wrote:
We Are Not the NSA wrote:Thank you very much CG. I almost let it go without seriously brining it up. Then my geology lecture began and I got bored. :P

But geology lectures rock! (Sorry, couldn't help myself.)

I'm interested to see if this gets resubmitted with the R3 violation fixed. I doubt it though.



If it does, the inevitable /third/ telegram campaign may create so much malcontent, that combined with an actual discussion thread now, may cause it to not even hit quorum.
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The Alicorns (Equestria) wrote:Let them stay, no need to badmouth them...From our view a bunch of nations just came in, seized the delegate position, and changed a few superficial things...we play NationStates differently...there's really no reason for us to be butthurt.
http://www.nationstates.net/page=rmb/postid=8944227
http://www.nationstates.net/page=rmb/postid=8951258

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Hobbesistan wrote:Don't think I understand the question.
The color or what?..

Jesus, Hobbes, it's 2015. You can't just call someone "the color".

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Postby Noahs Second Country » Thu Sep 29, 2016 8:54 am

Wasn't this approved of first, before the other resolution?
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Bhang Bhang Duc
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Bhang Bhang Duc » Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:10 am

Noahs Second Country wrote:Wasn't this approved of first, before the other resolution?

If you'd bothered to read through the thread you would have found that it got pulled from the queue due to an R3 violation.
Former Delegate of The West Pacific. Guardian (under many Delegates) of The West Pacific. TWP's Former Minister for World Assembly Affairs and former Security Council Advisor.

The West Pacific's Official Welshman, Astronomer and Old Fart
Pierconium wrote:I see Funk as an opportunistic manipulator that utilises the means available to him to reach his goals. In other words, a nation after my own heart.

RiderSyl wrote:If an enchantress made it so one raid could bring about world peace, Unibot would ask raiders to just sign a petition instead.

Sedgistan wrote:The SC has just has a spate of really shitty ones recently from Northumbria, his Watermelon fanboy…..


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