[DEFEATED] Condemn Vandoosa Dreiundzwanzig

[Frisbeeteria]

The Security Council,

Recognizing The Holy Sakura Empire of Vandoosa Dreiundzwanzig as a raiding nation of whom holds ties to the infamous raiders bastion, The Black Riders.

Reiterating that raiding has already been established by the Security Council to be damaging and counterproductive to the further development of regions and nations within those regions.

Stating that raiding nations of any degree hold an equal threat to vulnerable regions who cannot defend themselves against these organized malevolent strategies.

Repulsed that The Holy Sakura Empire of Vandoosa Dreiundzwanzig has clearly damaged and disrupted regions with intentions to better the status of the world through the World Assembly and have been silenced by a selfish nation who does not have intentions to better the status of the world but enforce its own agenda on others through a means of brute force, and not democracy.

Appalled by the repression of regional democracy through malicious methods.

Hereby Condemns The Holy Sakura Empire of Vandoosa Dreiundzwanzig.

Firstly, this is not my proposal, this belongs to Pronunshaa.
Secondly, this proposal is only 2 approvals away from reaching vote. It has 70 at time of writing.
Thirdly, this proposal is Condemning... a raider puppet in Nugut.

Can the full weight of the SC come down and crush this misguided proposal or what? The real target should be Vandoosa, not one of the 100+ nations they use to raid. That's useless.

[Redsward]

I telegrammed him about it. He complied, but I guess he's just waiting for his proposal to fail before he resubmits it as a condemnation of Vandoosa himself.

[Lingang]

Just like the last Vandoosa Condemnation....this won't pass.

[Redsward]

Just like the last Vandoosa Condemnation....this won't pass.

Well, all the info here is true. Vandoosa's first condemnation contained false info. It said that the denizens of GNI (Glorious Nations of Iwaku) were defenders, when they were in fact mercs.

EDIT: Grammar fix

[New Brussels]

I was wondering how the condemnation of puppet #23 managed to reach quorum

[Ainocra]

well it reached quorum.

Ainocra is opposed to it. it is poorly written and does not contain enough true evil to merit a condemnation.



now that Syl guy on the other hand

[Panait]

...Recognizing The Holy Sakura Empire of Vandoosa Dreiundzwanzig as a raiding nation of whom holds ties to the infamous raiders bastion, The Black Riders...

"We are not exactly sure, but we are doubtful this (the red part) is grammatically correct. Also, is it customary for every condemnation involving a raider to mention TBR somewhere in its content?"

...Repulsed that The Holy Sakura Empire of Vandoosa Dreiundzwanzig has clearly damaged and disrupted regions with intentions to better the status of the world through the World Assembly and have been silenced by a selfish nation who does not have intentions to better the status of the world but enforce its own agenda on others...

"We need clarification. Did Vandoosa damage and disrupt regions, for the intention of bettering the status of the world, but one of the participants is subsequently silenced by a selfish nation who holds values the opposite of theirs? Or did Vandoosa damage and disrupt regions, where said regions had intentions to better the status of the world, but these regions have been silenced by some third party? If it's the former, which participant is it? If it's the latter, is the third (second, in this case) party Vandoosa? Also, whose what agenda is it?"

Appalled by the repression of regional democracy through malicious methods.

"Please elaborate. Which region's democracy is repressed? Who is repressing that region's regional democracy? What malicious method is employed for that purpose?"

"We take this condemnation as poorly written and presented. Therefore, we will vote AGAINST it for now."

[Sasten]

...Recognizing The Holy Sakura Empire of Vandoosa Dreiundzwanzig as a raiding nation of whom holds ties to the infamous raiders bastion, The Black Riders...

"We are not exactly sure, but we are doubtful this (the red part) is grammatically correct. Also, is it customary for every condemnation involving a raider to mention TBR somewhere in its content?"

-snip-

*Blue text is my edit, as I'm 99.999999% sure you are referring to The Black Riders and not The Black Hawks.

I'm unsure about custom, but given the size, quantity and scale of The Black Riders' operations, references to them do come up quite often. This is probably helped by their reputation as the giant boogeyman of R/D gameplay.

Edit: Actually made the referred-to edit. Hurr Durr.

[Chester Pearson]

Well... I am personally prepared to stack my four votes in favor, just to see what happens....

[Ramaeus]

Well... I am personally prepared to stack my four votes in favor, just to see what happens....

GCR Stack!

[Applebania]

Condemning a switcher? wut?

Against.

[Panait]

*Blue text is my edit, as I'm 99.999999% sure you are referring to The Black Riders and not The Black Hawks.

I'm unsure about custom, but given the size, quantity and scale of The Black Riders' operations, references to them do come up quite often. This is probably helped by their reputation as the giant boogeyman of R/D gameplay.

Edit: Actually made the referred-to edit. Hurr Durr.

OoC: Oh, right, thank you very much. Also, that bit was somewhat of an expression of my distaste at how TBR has to come up in the SC with a frequency tantamount to that of the word 'hereby' being plastered in legal documents.

[Red Blackiland]

Against

[Main]

So is the raiding game the only thing the sc concerns itself with? A good percentage have recently been about praising defenders or condemning raiders. Not that there is anything wrong with that, it just gets a little boring.

[Chester Pearson]

Well... I am personally prepared to stack my four votes in favor, just to see what happens....

GCR Stack!

Of course there was a GCR stack on this one. Seems strange though, as the SC is all about passing pointless resolutions these days, and this is about as pointless as they get....

[Domar]

I'm sorry, To vote, I need more proof

[Solarmania]

What? Why are you condemming a puppet when you should be condemming the puppetmaster!

[Drewlantis]

First off, condemning only does anything if the nation does not wish to be condemned, otherwise it becomes a badge of skill or honor for their misdeeds.
Secondly it is ridiculous to condemn a puppet... Why would you? Only that part of the user is bad? What about their other nations?
It also appears to me that this resolution once again amounts to nothing. Almost like every other one of this type. Ultimately the power of this council is that of committing the WA members to denounce this puppet, not actually removing or otherwise damaging. It does not liberate regions currently under captivity or occupation, it also fails to bring the WA to a point in which we as a group could successfully counter raid regions or otherwise impose or inhibit TBR, or the puppet, or the master Vandoosa. The only damage is telling the puppet we don't like it, which since it's a puppet means no actual infliction of WA resolutions anyways. Also the user probably doesn't care whether we like them or not. The passage of this constitutes as of no importance or effect, what's the point? So what, who cares, this does absolutely nothing.

[Socialist Union of Citizens]

I agree. The Union Of Sovereign Nations, a region of mine, was destroyed by the Black Riders and they advertized their name and clan. We must stop them.

[Socialist Union of Citizens]

I'm sorry, To vote, I need more proof

I can't prove anything but can be witness to the events.

[District XIV]

I agree. The Union Of Sovereign Nations, a region of mine, was destroyed by the Black Riders and they advertized their name and clan. We must stop them.

Condemnations don't "stop" raiders; if anything, it's like a medal to them.

[Sternberg]

The Security Council,

Recognizing The Holy Sakura Empire of Vandoosa Dreiundzwanzig as a raiding nation of whom holds ties to the infamous raiders bastion, The Black Riders. ...

Multiple puppets or nations who raid would have some kind of link to TBR, given the latter region's major, driving role within the R/D arena - TBR has at least (at last count) 600 nations and puppets for their underhand work. Even so, has there been any examples where V.D. specifically and notably contributed to TBR operations? If not (and if the said condemned puppet operates purely under their own devices), then why make this accusation?

Repulsed that The Holy Sakura Empire of Vandoosa Dreiundzwanzig has clearly damaged and disrupted regions with intentions to better the status of the world through the World Assembly and have been silenced by a selfish nation who does not have intentions to better the status of the world but enforce its own agenda on others through a means of brute force, and not democracy.

Examples? Notable cases? If Vandoosa is such a danger to the international and inter-regional peace, then are there any notable cases of VD's involvement to support this clause? In short, why should the SC give a darn about VD when there are bigger fish, as it were, to fry?

Overall, there's nothing I could really say here that hasn't already been said by anyone else: condemning a puppet region (which would be kind of pointless if the "puppet-master" region has been recognised), mostly superfluous clauses which - while they lay the groundwork for a condemnation - don't really explain why the nation should be worthy of condemnation, etc., etc.

Yet perhaps the biggest issue I have with the condemnation is the utter void of supporting material to back up the legislation. It seemed to me as if the drafter either was operating on the assumption that "everyone knows everyone, even by hearsay" and would be aware of what Vandoosa D. had been up to, or charged through the drafting process and failed to provide any explanation within the clauses that could help the condemnation's cause. According to a quick check, this proposal is at least 2,000 characters short of the maximum limit of 3,500 characters - space that could easily have been filled by providing solid examples to back the proposal up. Without supporting evidence, any WA member or delegate would be voting "blind" and with no idea as to why this specific nation (puppet or otherwise) should be worthy of condemnation.

Whatever the case may be, it is this lack of adequate justification that, to me, is the critical decider in voting AGAINST this proposal.

[Domar]

I'm sorry, To vote, I need more proof

I can't prove anything but can be witness to the events.

So If the Black Riders is to take down smaller nations like yours. I don't need to worry because I think the South Pacific and fight them off. I just need more proof that Vandoosa is linked to the Black Riders

[Redsward]

So If the Black Riders is to take down smaller nations like yours. I don't need to worry because I think the South Pacific and fight them off. I just need more proof that Vandoosa is linked to the Black Riders

I agree. TBR can easily be stopped, but all the wannabe defenders just ruin the whole R/D game by trying to destroy TBR. As for Vandoosa, he is linked to TBR because he participates in their invasions. He's neutral in the R/D game though, because he is a merc. His region, Glorious Nations of Iwaku, is the largest merc region in the NS World.

[Vandoosa]

Aww.. they left out my other truly evil deeds like laughing when old folks fall down the stairs and j-walking in front of children!

Really? We have the largest region with mercenary tag? Haha! And Iwaku's military is actually very small and mostly inactive. It's more of an insane asylum for crazy yandere nations..