[Draft] Liberate Ixnay

[Bears Armed]

Oh, really?!? Did their refounding threaten your lives, or to enslave you, or something else at that level?!? No? Thought not. There's nothing "necessary" at all about raiding...

It threatened the operation, so from a raider perspective it threatened months of work and planning. So yes, from our raiding perspective it was indeed necessary. Will this be held in reserve in order to be deployed once a password is put up or is it the intention of the author to submit the moment a suitable draft is created?

So, no legitimate "necessity" from a non-raider viewpoint then,

[Mallorea and Riva]

It threatened the operation, so from a raider perspective it threatened months of work and planning. So yes, from our raiding perspective it was indeed necessary. Will this be held in reserve in order to be deployed once a password is put up or is it the intention of the author to submit the moment a suitable draft is created?

So, no legitimate "necessity" from a non-raider viewpoint then,

In the same sense that this proposal is not a "necessity" from a raider viewpoint.

[Kistan]

The foremost problem here is that the raiders aren't even letting people try to avoid the R/D game. Woohoo. They have a couple megabytes more of the web. But that gain in pretty worthless in comparison to what the raiding did for us: it disrupted our role playing and organization, as well as displacing our WA members and threatening us with being refounded by a raider. As the situation stands, it's nothing short of harassment; in fact, it's refusing to leave us alone. We don't want to participate, but they still insisted on foisting an occupation on us.

Now, invading and then refounding the region in one's own image? I'm not going to even go there. Please, us natives are of one mind on this. We want our region back so that we can continue our roleplaying, and if the WA won't help it's own members, they're just hurting everyone but the raiders.

[Moronist Decisions]

Just so it's clear, there's no password on the region now, right? What are the chances of a hidden password actually being implemented by the TBR delegate?

[Nierr]

Just so it's clear, there's no password on the region now, right? What are the chances of a hidden password actually being implemented by the TBR delegate?

They've openly stated their intention to refound the region. Presumably this would include a password prior to refounding.

[Kistan]

Just so it's clear, there's no password on the region now, right? What are the chances of a hidden password actually being implemented by the TBR delegate?

They've openly stated their intention to refound the region. Presumably this would include a password prior to refounding.

If they redound, then the region's a lost cause. First they invade, then deliberately make it inhospitable for the natives. Wonderful.

[Edlichbury]

Are you really going to claim it's just coincidence? Really?

C'mon, Mall. It's about as coincidental as Afforess just suddenly having a burning urge to draft and post a Liberate Haven proposal.

As it is, this proposal is unneeded and I am against.

My understanding of the situation is that the natives responded to the Liberate Haven proposal by going for a refound, they had a poll running and had distributed a telegram instructing nations to leave. The potential for a change in the password or having the point removed necessitated immediate action. The timing then is not coincidental, but the causality is not what is claimed in the proposal.

But you know, if you are a founderless region you can totally refound at any time as you and your raider allies claimed. That a region is being destroyed now for doing exactly what they were told was the safest option is in no way indicative of crass hypocrisy by your groups.

[Mallorea and Riva]

My understanding of the situation is that the natives responded to the Liberate Haven proposal by going for a refound, they had a poll running and had distributed a telegram instructing nations to leave. The potential for a change in the password or having the point removed necessitated immediate action. The timing then is not coincidental, but the causality is not what is claimed in the proposal.

But you know, if you are a founderless region you can totally refound at any time as you and your raider allies claimed. That a region is being destroyed now for doing exactly what they were told was the safest option is in no way indicative of crass hypocrisy by your groups.

It's not being raided because it was trying to refound. It's being raided at this point in time rather than another due to that fact. It was targeted months ago.

[Ramaeus]

The Draft has been updated.

[Imperator of the CRG]

The United Imperial Armed Forces, Love Wolves United, and Sicarius,

I don't see myself voting for a SC Proposal that can't get an Organisation's name right.

Why are there discrepancies between versions? It was right the second time.

[Ramaeus]

I don't see myself voting for a SC Proposal that can't get an Organisation's name right.

Why are there discrepancies between versions? It was right the second time.

Typo.
I've fixed it.

[Nierr]

But you know, if you are a founderless region you can totally refound at any time as you and your raider allies claimed. That a region is being destroyed now for doing exactly what they were told was the safest option is in no way indicative of crass hypocrisy by your groups.

It's not being raided because it was trying to refound. It's being raided at this point in time rather than another due to that fact. It was targeted months ago.

And maybe someone should've said 'eh, we're let this one go for once'. They had to know the reaction it would cause and they had to know that it would only inflame things.

[Mekhet]

Remember this though, if TBR does not intend to refound liberating the region will leave it open to raids which will require a lot more work in holding it down until the liberation can be repealed. Though, if TBR does intend to, then that makes this proposal necessary.

[Nierr]

They've said as much - or at least alluded to it.

[Toronina]

Backing this. May support a retaking of the region for the natives if they want one

[The Macabees]

It threatened the operation, so from a raider perspective it threatened months of work and planning. So yes, from our raiding perspective it was indeed necessary. Will this be held in reserve in order to be deployed once a password is put up or is it the intention of the author to submit the moment a suitable draft is created?

And by raiding RP regions you disrupt months...even years...of planning and organization, subjecting RPers to a facet of the game they're not interested in playing.

[Saintland]

I'm definitely for the liberation (and for an operation to drive the raiders out) and will encourage fellow RPers across the site to support this effort. Raiders should respect the unwritten rule separating gameplay and roleplay (and it should stay an unwritten rule because written rules would be impossible to enforce fairly and any form of RP opt-out would inevitably be misused). If they will not, then maybe roleplayers should get involved in gameplay for the sole purpose of thwarting the efforts of raiders who won't leave RP regions alone. If things were different and raiders would voluntarily stay away from RP regions, I would be inclined to become a raider at some point. However, if the War on RPing continues, many RPers may just have to get involved in gameplay, just to oppose raider groups that won't stay out of RP regions. As far as I'm concerned, an attack on any RP region is an attack on every RP region and should be treated accordingly by the RP community.

The one thing that I hope every RPer learns from this is to immediately change (and hide) the regional password whenever you decide to go for a refound. Assume that there are always raider sleepers in your region, unless you know for a fact that every nation in the region is not associated with any raiding group that raids RP regions.

[Wrapper]

Okay, someone has to say it:

Ixnay on the iberationlay.

[Absurrania]

So...as a native I'd like to know for sure....this proposal is dead, right?

[Ramaeus]

So...as a native I'd like to know for sure....this proposal is dead, right?

It's not dead. I've been watching the situation, but a Liberation doesn't yet appear necessary.

[Republic of Minerva]

We do not find this region worthy of a liberation. Forty member nations at it's height is literally nothing. That and we do not find having the WA go after TBR every time they raid a region to liberate it a good use of it's time and energy.

[The Blaatschapen]

We do not find this region worthy of a liberation. Forty member nations at it's height is literally nothing. That and we do not find having the WA go after TBR every time they raid a region to liberate it a good use of it's time and energy.

Simon Chaap walks in and says "40 nations is literally nothing?". "Well, I guess that you are figuratively being wrong in your word usage".

Simon smirks before leaving the hall.

[Republic of Minerva]

"Instead, somebody liberate us from the grammar fascists."

[Mundiferrum]

Nothing fascist about proper criticism.

[Save All the Animals]

I support this resolution and I encourage it to be proposed soon so that we can speedily overthrow TBR and bring Ixnay back to its former glory.