Communism!A Dream or a Ideology?

[Mercator Terra]

Gender or race wise no but there will always be leaders.

[Sibirsky]

They scare me. Such universal, unconditional support, for an idea that is such shit, not only in practice, but also in theory, by assholes who live in the west, and enjoy their freedoms, and use capitalist tools to sling mud at it all day, is, frankly outrageous.

Well, the communism that I am saying positive things about is anarchist communism/left-communism.

I wasn't talking about you. I agree with you in most details. Some, rather major, I disagree with, but it's not worth making a fuss over.

[Laerod]

This makes how hard you work largely irrelevant to how high your pay is compared to other jobs. Ergo, what you said is utterly wrong and useless for predicting how much pay a job receives.

Okay I should have said "usefulness of skill"

Wrong again. CEOs, as mentioned, are rewarded richly even for wholly inadequate work.

-snip-

1. You're conflating governance with the state. Law would be in the form of contracts and a plurality of dispute resolution and personal defense agencies, without a central authority, and without a monopoly on force-thus without a state.

Without a monopoly on force there is no monopoly on enforcement.

2. Do you know what I mean by mutual aid? I mean voluntary cooperation for mutual benefit, as opposed to coercion and servitude. If you believe that this cannot address people's needs, you're pretty much saying that personal friendships should be maintained through force, and that you need someone holding a gun to your head to tell you how to ration slices of pizza at a party. Also, structure doesn't have to be coercive. It's a big jump from "we need social structure" to "we need the state".

Yes, that is what I thought you meant by mutual aid. And no, I'm not the strawman you're making me out to be; I'm not suggesting friendships should be maintained by coercive means. I am, however, convinced that it is completely unreliable and to base a society off of charity and friendship to ensure everyone gets what they needs is not going to work. Charity might work if friends shelter a family whose house has burned down, but not if the entire village got washed away by a flash flood.

[Meryuma]

Gender or race wise know but there will always be leaders.

In a sense, however there don't have to be authority figures.

[Meryuma]

-snip-

1. Of course there's no monopoly on enforcement, that doesn't mean there's no enforcement of anything.
2. Charity is not mutual aid. Charity is one-sided. I'm also not claiming you intented to say friendships should be coerced, just that that's the logical conclusion of what you're saying. It's a reductio ad absurdum. I'm also not claiming that everything would be mutual aid-just as many things would be accomplished individually. Society would be based around self-interest, mutual aid is simply the extension of self-interest into interpersonal relations.

[Great Nepal]

Okay I should have said "usefulness of skill"

Wrong again. CEOs, as mentioned, are rewarded richly even for wholly inadequate work.

I am sure CEOs do the most important task in a company and are perhaps most educated ones.

[Kraznya Syn]

My theory:

If capitalism and libertarian socialism got together and had a one night stand but they got pregnant so they had a kid which was regulated economy and libertarian social policies.

[Arranfirangia]

My theory:

If capitalism and libertarian socialism got together and had a one night stand but they got pregnant so they had a kid which was regulated economy and libertarian social policies.

I also thought of mutualism (the anarchist ideology of social-ish markets) being the "child" of capitalism and libertarian socialism.

[Greater Tezdrian]

As a fascist, I am bound to say that communism is not a dream, but a nightmare. Personally, I have far less problems with authoritarian communism than other types, and even admire some communists (Hoxha, possibly Tito).

[Jakaragua]

As a fascist, I am bound to say that communism is not a dream, but a nightmare. Personally, I have far less problems with authoritarian communism than other types, and even admire some communists (Hoxha, possibly Tito).

Weird, most people think the opposite, but I never got into the mindset of "Oh mai gawd so ruthless *Wankwankwank*.

[Meryuma]

My theory:

If capitalism and libertarian socialism got together and had a one night stand but they got pregnant so they had a kid which was regulated economy and libertarian social policies.

Libertarian socialism isn't pro-state. A mixed economy is the combination of markets and statism, not capitalism and libertarian socialism.

As a fascist, I am bound to say that communism is not a dream, but a nightmare. Personally, I have far less problems with authoritarian communism than other types, and even admire some communists (Hoxha, possibly Tito).

Why the hell do you fetishize authority so much?

[Mercator Terra]

My theory:

If capitalism and libertarian socialism got together and had a one night stand but they got pregnant so they had a kid which was regulated economy and libertarian social policies.

Libertarian socialism isn't pro-state. A mixed economy is the combination of markets and statism, not capitalism and libertarian socialism.

As a fascist, I am bound to say that communism is not a dream, but a nightmare. Personally, I have far less problems with authoritarian communism than other types, and even admire some communists (Hoxha, possibly Tito).

Why the hell do you fetishize authority so much?

Because he takes advantage of the liberties we have now to mudsling it.

[East Fancainia]

Kenyamism.

You give all your money to a Kenyan who will then give it to a Yam.

[Greater Tezdrian]

As a fascist, I am bound to say that communism is not a dream, but a nightmare. Personally, I have far less problems with authoritarian communism than other types, and even admire some communists (Hoxha, possibly Tito).

Why the hell do you fetishize authority so much?

Authority is the only thing that gets things done and keeps people in check.

[The Merchant Republics]

A Nightmare. If it must be one or the other. Yet one more thread which dwells upon the old chestnut that communism is a fantastic ideal. Everything, is good on paper, so I am getting very tired of people talking about how communism is "great on paper" or a "great mindset", it's no better then any other "paper" society, no negatives and all positives so long as you totally ignore reality.

[Threlizdun]

I'm an anarcho-syndicalist and libertarian socialist

[Jakaragua]

Why the hell do you fetishize authority so much?

Authority is the only thing that gets things done and keeps people in check.

I.E, take away freedoms when that imaginary concept called "nation" is said to be in danger.

[Greater Tezdrian]

Authority is the only thing that gets things done and keeps people in check.

I.E, take away freedoms when that imaginary concept called "nation" is said to be in danger.

Freedom, like everything, is secondary to nation. The nation is the building block for humanity and civilization itself.

[Jakaragua]

I.E, take away freedoms when that imaginary concept called "nation" is said to be in danger.

Freedom, like everything, is secondary to nation. The nation is the building block for humanity and civilization itself.

What would you say to a minority nation within a country you ran, wanting independence?

[Mercator Terra]

Kenyamism.

You give all your money to a Kenyan who will then give it to a Yam.

That gave me a good laugh and reminded me of this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBrHkxqNT7s

[Greater Tezdrian]

Freedom, like everything, is secondary to nation. The nation is the building block for humanity and civilization itself.

What would you say to a minority nation within a country you ran, wanting independence?

Pan-nationalism is heavily debated among 3Pists, but I personally would let them go, as they are not part of the national culture, and have their own.

[East Fancainia]

Kenyamism.

You give all your money to a Kenyan who will then give it to a Yam.

That gave me a good laugh and reminded me of this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBrHkxqNT7s

I saw that one before.

[Mercator Terra]

That gave me a good laugh and reminded me of this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBrHkxqNT7s

I saw that one before.

Its funny amiright?

[East Fancainia]

I saw that one before.

Its funny amiright?

Yep.

[Jakaragua]

What would you say to a minority nation within a country you ran, wanting independence?

Pan-nationalism is heavily debated among 3Pists, but I personally would let them go, as they are not part of the national culture, and have their own.

Then there are big contradictions amongst many nations if we had this "Pan Nationalism". English/Welsh/Scottish Nationalists and British Nationalists... Spanish and Catalan/Basque nationalists... Albanian and Serbian nationalists.

Again, this calls for a defining feature of a "nation", because they are are quite often just made up. Nations try to refer to a group of people who share genetic qualities, culture and are self-identifying. This means people need to come up with the idea of nation before the nation can even exist. Which means a people would cease to be a nation if they simply stop identifying as one, is that right?