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Opinions on Muslim Ban

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Should we have a Muslim ban?

No, there should be no restrictions on Muslims coming in the US
175
41%
No, but we should make are vetting process stronger
111
26%
No, but we should ban Muslims from countries that harbor terrorists
33
8%
Yes, we should temporary ban Muslims until we update our vetting process
36
8%
Yes, we should impose a religious test, banning Muslims from entering the US permanently
8
2%
Yes, we should ban Islam and deport Muslims
61
14%
 
Total votes : 424
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Skyviolia
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Posts: 939
Founded: Sep 04, 2015
Ex-Nation

Opinions on Muslim Ban

Postby Skyviolia » Thu Jul 28, 2016 4:41 am

So in light of Donald Trump as the Republican Nominee, the Muslim ban as once again come under fire and support. With the rise of terrorists and terror attacks, the opinion on Muslims have dipped. My opinion is that when you bar certain people and or make them feel like they are dangerous, they will strike back. A good example being the French Wars of Religion. If we alienate Muslims, terrorists will seek to radicalize them. But I do support making the vetting process stronger.

What is your opinion, NationStates?
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Uxupox
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Posts: 13447
Founded: Nov 13, 2014
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Postby Uxupox » Thu Jul 28, 2016 4:42 am

Ban everybody. Only let me live in the good old US of A.
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The Intergalactic Universe Corporation
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Posts: 4466
Founded: May 15, 2014
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Postby The Intergalactic Universe Corporation » Thu Jul 28, 2016 4:42 am

I think a good option would be to ban travel to and from nations that terror attacks commonly originate from. Like: Iraq, Syria, Afghanistan etc...
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The Romulan Republic
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Founded: May 20, 2008
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Postby The Romulan Republic » Thu Jul 28, 2016 4:44 am

Voted for option one.

Their should be border security, but the criteria should have fuck all to do with religion.
"Our progress in degeneracy appears to me to be pretty rapid. As a nation, we began by declaring that "all men are created equal." We now practically read it "all men are created equal, except negroes" When the Know-Nothings get control, it will read "all men are created equal, except negroes, and foreigners, and Catholics." When it comes to this I should prefer emigrating to some country where they make no pretence of loving liberty -- to Russia, for instance, where despotism can be taken pure, and without the base alloy of hypocracy." - President Abraham Lincoln.
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Dahon
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Founded: Nov 11, 2015
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Postby Dahon » Thu Jul 28, 2016 4:44 am

Don't discriminate based on religion, thorough vetting, that's all.
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The Intergalactic Universe Corporation
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Founded: May 15, 2014
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Postby The Intergalactic Universe Corporation » Thu Jul 28, 2016 4:46 am

Ban travel from countries harbouring terrorists. That would be enough and would send a clear message across, and at the same time, toughen border security and strengthen the vetting process too.
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The Romulan Republic
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Founded: May 20, 2008
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Postby The Romulan Republic » Thu Jul 28, 2016 4:47 am

The Intergalactic Universe Corporation wrote:Ban travel from countries harbouring terrorists. That would be enough and would send a clear message across, and at the same time, toughen border security and strengthen the vetting process too.


Ban on anyone from countries harbouring terrorists, or only Muslims from those countries?

I mean, I'd be opposed to either as discriminating against innocent people, but only the latter would be religious discrimination.
"Our progress in degeneracy appears to me to be pretty rapid. As a nation, we began by declaring that "all men are created equal." We now practically read it "all men are created equal, except negroes" When the Know-Nothings get control, it will read "all men are created equal, except negroes, and foreigners, and Catholics." When it comes to this I should prefer emigrating to some country where they make no pretence of loving liberty -- to Russia, for instance, where despotism can be taken pure, and without the base alloy of hypocracy." - President Abraham Lincoln.
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The Intergalactic Universe Corporation
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Founded: May 15, 2014
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Postby The Intergalactic Universe Corporation » Thu Jul 28, 2016 4:48 am

The Romulan Republic wrote:
The Intergalactic Universe Corporation wrote:Ban travel from countries harbouring terrorists. That would be enough and would send a clear message across, and at the same time, toughen border security and strengthen the vetting process too.


Ban on anyone from countries harbouring terrorists, or only Muslims from those countries?

I mean, I'd be opposed to either as discriminating against innocent people, but only the latter would be religious discrimination.

Everybody. Not just Muslims
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Anti: Liberalism, Socialism, Communism, Mao, Marx, Hillary, Democratic Party, EU, DPRK, USSR
Class D4 Nation according to The Civilization Index
I'm a Proud Member of the DEUN! Are you?
I'm a proud member of LMTU. Are you?
Liberal Democrats: The Party of Common Sense! in the NSG Senate!

_[' ]_
(-_Q) If you support capitalism, put this in your signature.

OOC: I do not use NS Stats.
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Skyviolia
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Posts: 939
Founded: Sep 04, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Skyviolia » Thu Jul 28, 2016 4:53 am

Honestly, how do you know if someone is Muslim. Wouldn't they just lie?
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The Intergalactic Universe Corporation
Senator
 
Posts: 4466
Founded: May 15, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby The Intergalactic Universe Corporation » Thu Jul 28, 2016 4:54 am

Skyviolia wrote:Honestly, how do you know if someone is Muslim. Wouldn't they just lie?

Background info
Pro: Capitalism, Nationalism, Conservatism, Trump, Thatcherism, Reagan, Pinochet, Lee Kuan Yew, Republican Party, Conservative Party, USA, UK

Anti: Liberalism, Socialism, Communism, Mao, Marx, Hillary, Democratic Party, EU, DPRK, USSR
Class D4 Nation according to The Civilization Index
I'm a Proud Member of the DEUN! Are you?
I'm a proud member of LMTU. Are you?
Liberal Democrats: The Party of Common Sense! in the NSG Senate!

_[' ]_
(-_Q) If you support capitalism, put this in your signature.

OOC: I do not use NS Stats.
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Skyviolia
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Founded: Sep 04, 2015
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Postby Skyviolia » Thu Jul 28, 2016 4:56 am

The Intergalactic Universe Corporation wrote:
Skyviolia wrote:Honestly, how do you know if someone is Muslim. Wouldn't they just lie?

Background info

Do they record what religion you are, I didn't know they did that.
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The Intergalactic Universe Corporation
Senator
 
Posts: 4466
Founded: May 15, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby The Intergalactic Universe Corporation » Thu Jul 28, 2016 4:57 am

Skyviolia wrote:
The Intergalactic Universe Corporation wrote:Background info

Do they record what religion you are, I didn't know they did that.

They always have all the info about you, blood type, religion, and all. At least it is done here in my country (I am not from the US).
Pro: Capitalism, Nationalism, Conservatism, Trump, Thatcherism, Reagan, Pinochet, Lee Kuan Yew, Republican Party, Conservative Party, USA, UK

Anti: Liberalism, Socialism, Communism, Mao, Marx, Hillary, Democratic Party, EU, DPRK, USSR
Class D4 Nation according to The Civilization Index
I'm a Proud Member of the DEUN! Are you?
I'm a proud member of LMTU. Are you?
Liberal Democrats: The Party of Common Sense! in the NSG Senate!

_[' ]_
(-_Q) If you support capitalism, put this in your signature.

OOC: I do not use NS Stats.
HoloNet News: Congress To Meet Next Monday | Public Sector Sees Slower Wage Growth In 2036 | Public Debt Expected To Reduce Again | Consumer Spending Up For Chinese New Year Season
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Uxupox
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Posts: 13447
Founded: Nov 13, 2014
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Postby Uxupox » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:01 am

The Intergalactic Universe Corporation wrote:
Skyviolia wrote:Do they record what religion you are, I didn't know they did that.

They always have all the info about you, blood type, religion, and all. At least it is done here in my country (I am not from the US).


Taqiyya is a thing you know.
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Nariterrr
Minister
 
Posts: 2435
Founded: Jan 27, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Nariterrr » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:04 am

Yeah, no. We have laws against discrimination. Banning Muslims is unconstitutional and discriminatory.
Honestly who knows what about anything anymore.
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Vassenor
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 68113
Founded: Nov 11, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Vassenor » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:05 am

The Intergalactic Universe Corporation wrote:
Skyviolia wrote:Do they record what religion you are, I didn't know they did that.

They always have all the info about you, blood type, religion, and all. At least it is done here in my country (I am not from the US).


None of that information is on my passport. Just your name, country of residence, place of birth and pertinent dates.
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Ereria
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Founded: Feb 29, 2012
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Postby Ereria » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:06 am

Uxupox wrote:
The Intergalactic Universe Corporation wrote:They always have all the info about you, blood type, religion, and all. At least it is done here in my country (I am not from the US).


Taqiyya is a thing you know.


ugh people always bring up Taqiyya like it's a permission for muslims to lie about anything for everything :eyebrow:
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Greater Narkova
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Posts: 271
Founded: Jul 17, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Greater Narkova » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:07 am

There is one problem with this, quite a few of the attackers have been living in the US for years, banning Muslims will not stop the attacks 100%, it's not the solution to the problem of ISIS, which must be stamped out mercilessly and quickly
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Uxupox
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Posts: 13447
Founded: Nov 13, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Uxupox » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:08 am

Ereria wrote:
Uxupox wrote:
Taqiyya is a thing you know.


ugh people always bring up Taqiyya like it's a permission for muslims to lie about anything for everything :eyebrow:


It was practiced by one of the Prophet's own companions so yes it can be used as justification do virtually anything as long as the goal is safety at the end.
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Nariterrr
Minister
 
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Founded: Jan 27, 2016
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Postby Nariterrr » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:08 am

Ereria wrote:
Uxupox wrote:
Taqiyya is a thing you know.


ugh people always bring up Taqiyya like it's a permission for muslims to lie about anything for everything :eyebrow:

Well, it's a escape phrase for people who don't want to debate Muslims and don't want to hear them out. Just silence your enemy by saying that they are liars.
Honestly who knows what about anything anymore.
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Jochizyd Republic
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Posts: 6586
Founded: Jun 07, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Jochizyd Republic » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:09 am

Just ban fundamentalists. Keep everyone else if you want.

Pretty simple. But Anti Muslims and SJWs for some reason never seem to understand the concept. Either saying it's "cuckhold" or "Islamophobic".
Last edited by Jochizyd Republic on Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Alvecia
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Founded: Aug 17, 2015
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Postby Alvecia » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:10 am

Greater Narkova wrote:There is one problem with this, quite a few of the attackers have been living in the US for years, banning Muslims will not stop the attacks 100%, it's not the solution to the problem of ISIS, which must be stamped out mercilessly and quickly

Brings up a fair point. What proportion of terror attacks were actually commited by immigrants.
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Uxupox
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Founded: Nov 13, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Uxupox » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:11 am

Nariterrr wrote:
Ereria wrote:
ugh people always bring up Taqiyya like it's a permission for muslims to lie about anything for everything :eyebrow:

Well, it's a escape phrase for people who don't want to debate Muslims and don't want to hear them out. Just silence your enemy by saying that they are liars.


Maybe you should bring actual ideas instead of dismissing something that is actually approved by one of the Prophet's OWN companions.
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Jochizyd Republic
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Founded: Jun 07, 2016
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Postby Jochizyd Republic » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:11 am

Uxupox wrote:
Ereria wrote:
ugh people always bring up Taqiyya like it's a permission for muslims to lie about anything for everything :eyebrow:

It was practiced by one of the Prophet's own companions so yes it can be used as justification do virtually anything as long as the goal is safety at the end.

Lol. You have no idea what it is.

It's a Shi'a thing mostly to hide your religion to escape persecution.

To Populists it's mostly just a means to win an arguement "Oh a Muslim is making points? I'll just shout Taqiyyah"
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Nariterrr
Minister
 
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Founded: Jan 27, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Nariterrr » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:11 am

Alvecia wrote:
Greater Narkova wrote:There is one problem with this, quite a few of the attackers have been living in the US for years, banning Muslims will not stop the attacks 100%, it's not the solution to the problem of ISIS, which must be stamped out mercilessly and quickly

Brings up a fair point. What proportion of terror attacks were actually commited by immigrants.

The majority of terrorist attacks a committed by natives who were radicalized.
Honestly who knows what about anything anymore.
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Skyhooked
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Founded: Mar 18, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Skyhooked » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:12 am

Banning anyone to enter, because religious beliefs? It won't help to make any friends.
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