Erdogan: Women are not equal to men

[Degenerate Heart of HetRio]

Women weren't built the same way men were. Men are typically stronger. I wouldn't ask a woman to lift something.

Sexual dimorphism among human beings is largely negligable. Great physical strength is hardly vital for most occupations anyway. Claims about a biological inequality between men and women is absurd.

It's not even like they couldn't have more ease developing muscles than us with levels of testosterone more in line with our average, through artificial hormonal treatment or a hormonal condition that isn't even often regarded as intersex.

[Gezi Park]

Welp, there goes secular Turkey. Where's zombie Atatürk when you need him?

His children are here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013–14_protests_in_Turkey

[Conserative Morality]

I'm talking on average, I'm not saying that every woman is weak. But on average the man is much more capable of physical tasks than the woman is.

I dispute 'much more'. Men are typically larger - and there's a some 10% difference in skeletal muscle mass - but that's hardly a deciding factor in things like 'lifting a box' or 'anything less than competitive lifting, wrestling, or arm wrestling'.

[Degenerate Heart of HetRio]

I'm talking on average, I'm not saying that every woman is weak. But on average the man is much more capable of physical tasks than the woman is.

I dispute 'much more'. Men are typically larger - and there's a some 10% difference in skeletal muscle mass - but that's hardly a deciding factor in things like 'lifting a box' or 'anything less than competitive lifting, wrestling, or arm wrestling'.

Agreed. I am at least 50% larger than my mother and I'm a wimp when compared to her.

[Conserative Morality]

His children are here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013–14_protests_in_Turkey

[Threlizdun]

Eh? Women, pound for pound, have a negligible (Or nearly so - it comes into play with competitions, particularly ones in which a fraction of a second matters or the absolute limits of the human body are strained) physical difference from men. There's generally a size difference (Thus the qualifier pound-for-pound), but women are equal in all ways that matter. And no, the Olympics don't.

I'm talking on average, I'm not saying that every woman is weak. But on average the man is much more capable of physical tasks than the woman is.

No, the average man has slightly more muscle mass, not much more, and most physical tasks don't require great strength, so it's largely irrelevant.

[Servinta]

I'm talking on average, I'm not saying that every woman is weak. But on average the man is much more capable of physical tasks than the woman is.

I dispute 'much more'. Men are typically larger - and there's a some 10% difference in skeletal muscle mass - but that's hardly a deciding factor in things like 'lifting a box' or 'anything less than competitive lifting, wrestling, or arm wrestling'.

And now we role into the stereotypes that are present and dominant in our world.

Men must be strong

Women must be good at other stuff (had something but it was slightly offensive)

[Conserative Morality]

And now we role into the stereotypes that are present and dominant in our world.

Men must be strong

Women must be good at other stuff (had something but it was slightly offensive)

What?

[Geilinor]

And Ataturk rolls over in his grave for the millionth time.

[Gezi Park]

And Ataturk rolls over in his grave for the millionth time.

Ironically his cult still remains strong in Turkey.

[Servinta]

And now we role into the stereotypes that are present and dominant in our world.

Men must be strong

Women must be good at other stuff (had something but it was slightly offensive)

What?

Thats not my personal opinion but it is the dominant one.

What I mean is that men compare themselves to other through masculinity, exercise, sports and other things like that.

Most Women don't exactly have the same idea as men do and instead do the feminine thing, do I look pretty, keeping slim, ect ect

EDIT: But that's the stereotypes that are standard for most of the world, I'm not saying everyone goes by it.

[Baltenstein]

And Ataturk rolls over in his grave for the millionth time.

Ironically his cult still remains strong in Turkey.

Oddly, that pic is reminding me of "the picture of Dorian Gray".

[Conserative Morality]

Ironically his cult still remains strong in Turkey.

(Image)

The only cult worth considering.

Thats not my personal opinion but it is the dominant one.

What I mean is that men compare themselves to other through masculinity, exercise, sports and other things like that.

Most Women don't exactly have the same idea as men do and instead do the feminine thing, do I look pretty, keeping slim, ect ect

Those ideas are dying. Have been dying for a while now.

[Gezi Park]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/turkish-president-equality-between-men-and-women-is-against-nature-9879993.html

Erdogan. Dude. This is wrong on so many levels!

Ok, no longer hot. Now just weird. Incestuous foot fetish is a no-no.

I can see why that sounded ridiculous to you guys as you're irrelevant to Turkey, but that is actually a traditional religious saying derived from Hadiths that stresses out the importance of mothers. "Paradise lies under the feet of mothers". I'm anti-religious but I like this saying and I always share it on Mother's Day.

[Servinta]

Ironically his cult still remains strong in Turkey.

(Image)

The only cult worth considering.

Thats not my personal opinion but it is the dominant one.

What I mean is that men compare themselves to other through masculinity, exercise, sports and other things like that.

Most Women don't exactly have the same idea as men do and instead do the feminine thing, do I look pretty, keeping slim, ect ect

Those ideas are dying. Have been dying for a while now.

Dying but not dead by a long shot, I still don't see many female based sports aside from softball, basketball and swimming, I' sure there's more than that but I'm generalizing.

[Baltenstein]

Ok, no longer hot. Now just weird. Incestuous foot fetish is a no-no.

I can see why that sounded ridiculous to you guys as you're irrelevant to Turkey, but that is actually a traditionally religious saying derived from Hadiths that stresses out the importance of mothers. "Paradise lies under the feet of mothers". I'm anti-religious but I like this saying and I always share it on Mother's Day.

There is nothing wrong with the saying. Talking about having an childhood obsession with your mother's feet on the other hand...

[The Great Warrior Rivers]

BBC: Turkey president Erdogan: Women are not equal to men

Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has said women cannot be treated as equal to men, and has accused feminists of rejecting motherhood.

"You cannot put women and men on an equal footing," he told a meeting in Istanbul. "It is against nature."

He also said feminists did not grasp the importance of motherhood in Islam.

His comments often seek to appeal to his pious core supporters, says the BBC's Mark Lowen in Istanbul, but they anger more liberal voters.

Turks who have more secular views argue that the government's social policies are taking the country in a dangerous direction, our correspondent says.

Mr Erdogan has previously urged women to have three children, and has lashed out against abortion and birth by Caesarean section.
'Delicate nature'

His latest remarks were delivered at a women's conference in Istanbul.

"In the workplace, you cannot treat a man and a pregnant woman in the same way," Mr Erdogan said, according to the Anatolia news agency.

Women cannot do all the work done by men, he added, because it was against their "delicate nature".

"Our religion regards motherhood very highly," he said. "Feminists don't understand that, they reject motherhood."

He said women needed equal respect rather than equality.

Mr Erdogan also told the Istanbul meeting that justice was the solution to most of the world's issues - including racism, anti-Semitism, and "women's problems".

The Turkish leader often courts controversy with his statements.

Earlier this month, he claimed that Muslims had discovered the Americas more than 300 years before Christopher Colombus.

In his 11 years as prime minister, Mr Erdogan became a crucial player in regional politics.

However, his reputation has suffered recently over the crisis in Syria, and accusations of authoritarianism.

Erdogan's crazy train seems to be running at full steam.

Isn't it an Islamic ideal that women and men are spiritually equal under Allah's eyes?

[Degenerate Heart of HetRio]

Thats not my personal opinion but it is the dominant one.

What I mean is that men compare themselves to other through masculinity, exercise, sports and other things like that.

Most Women don't exactly have the same idea as men do and instead do the feminine thing, do I look pretty, keeping slim, ect ect

EDIT: But that's the stereotypes that are standard for most of the world, I'm not saying everyone goes by it.

Gender roles, gender identity, gender expression, birth gender designation and actual sexual corporeality (biological sex, detailed) might all be very dissimilar from each other, do you know that, right?

[Servinta]

Thats not my personal opinion but it is the dominant one.

What I mean is that men compare themselves to other through masculinity, exercise, sports and other things like that.

Most Women don't exactly have the same idea as men do and instead do the feminine thing, do I look pretty, keeping slim, ect ect

EDIT: But that's the stereotypes that are standard for most of the world, I'm not saying everyone goes by it.

Gender roles, gender identity, gender expression, birth gender designation and actual sexual corporeality (biological sex, detailed) might all be very dissimilar from each other, do you know that, right?

Oh hi there.

EDIT:Stupid me put High instead of hi

Well as its been stated before, men have a small advantage in basic body build over women, but the fact that masculinity demands that a man be physically fit and capable of performing physical tasks would lead to him trying to "Build" himself to be stronger

Femminism doesn't really demand that and therefor they are on average not a fit as men.

[Degenerate Heart of HetRio]

Oh high there.

Well as its been stated before, men have a small advantage in basic body build over women, but the fact that masculinity demands that a man be physically fit and capable of performing physical tasks would lead to him trying to "Build" himself to be stronger

Femminism doesn't really demand that and therefor they are on average not a fit as men.

Except that gender roles still exist and, as you mentioned, influence that, but now women are freer to exist in most of the same social functions as men (except they still have a huge disadvantage at seeking that) and do with their own bodies and styling however they please, and transgender people might avoid the closet now.

Such inequality in regards to social perception is still very distant from tolerable, but it is not negligible.

[Servinta]

Oh high there.

Well as its been stated before, men have a small advantage in basic body build over women, but the fact that masculinity demands that a man be physically fit and capable of performing physical tasks would lead to him trying to "Build" himself to be stronger

Femminism doesn't really demand that and therefor they are on average not a fit as men.

Except that gender roles still exist and, as you mentioned, influence that, but now women are freer to exist in most of the same social functions as men (except they still have a huge disadvantage at seeking that) and do with their own bodies and styling however they please, and transgender people might avoid the closet now.

Such inequality in regards to social perception is still very distant from tolerable, but it is not negligible.

I'll agree, but the stereotypes for men and women haven't really fallen by the wayside that much, so as we type there are more men in a gym than there are women and there are more female models than men.

[Olerand]

What's so different in what he is saying and what many typical Republican politicians in the US are saying?...

[u]He's an Islamic Bush and that's all...Turkey's pretty much divided like the US but unfortunately conservatives have a numerical advantage like %55 vs. %45 so he keeps getting elected. It's quite hard for opposition parties to convince that part of the society because of their illiteracy, not to mention they first have to break through all this pro-government media manipulations and anti-opposition campaigns. It also doesn't mean that all conservatives are driven by religious ideas, it's just Erdogan is popular, religious-oriented parties in Turkey only got as much as %15 in the past and centre-right popular parties were all secular. Erdogan has conquered the centre-right mainly due to his economic success and well-reformed public services. If these people were all Sharia nuts they would just vote for parties that actually promise Sharia law. Erdogan has never advocated Sharia despite being in power for about 13 years, not that there's a huge demand on that even from conservatives segments of the society.

Precisely. None of the mainstream Rights in Europe, except maybe Poland I don't know what goes on there with the PiS or whatever, would say the things Republicans say.

Yup. No thank you.

Also, infantilizing and denigrating the electorate, as in considering them illiterate and stupid for not voting for one's preferred candidate, is bad politics and grasping at straws.

[Olerand]

There are more immigrants in Istanbul than locals themselves. But most of them reside in numerically extra large suburbs that let alone a tourist but anybody else would never even consider visiting unless they need to. Here are some results from Istanbul's most popular and well-known central districts:

http://secim.haberler.com/2014/kadikoy/
http://secim.haberler.com/2014/sisli/
http://secim.haberler.com/2014/besiktas/
http://secim.haberler.com/2014/bakirkoy/

These are the results of 3 provinces in East Thrace:

http://secim.haberler.com/2014/tekirdag/
http://secim.haberler.com/2014/edirne/
http://secim.haberler.com/2014/kirklareli/

Izmir, third biggest metropolitan in Turkey:

http://secim.haberler.com/2014/izmir/

And this is a province that borders Syria: (where lots of secular Arab Alawites live in)

http://secim.haberler.com/2014/hatay/

AKP doesn't win all places. Turkey is a huge country and there's enough space for us secular Turks. In fact; we own all places that make Turkey "Turkey" as it's known by tourists. AKP owes its success to numerical advantage of some shitty rural areas mainly in central and eastern Anatolia.

Are these immigrants not citizens? Can they not vote as they wish?

I never claimed all of Turkey wants Erdogan. I was precise in saying the Turkey bordering the Aegean doesn't, except for Istanbul.

However, a majority of Turks do. Such is the nature of democracy.

[Olerand]

Ok, no longer hot. Now just weird. Incestuous foot fetish is a no-no.

I can see why that sounded ridiculous to you guys as you're irrelevant to Turkey, but that is actually a traditional religious saying derived from Hadiths that stresses out the importance of mothers. "Paradise lies under the feet of mothers". I'm anti-religious but I like this saying and I always share it on Mother's Day.

That is very odd, and kind of unpleasant sounding. But sure.

Kind of vaguely knowing the eloquence and symbolism so present in Arabic, and the Koran, I guess I can understand.

Still weird though.

[Mesrane]

LOLz. Erdogan. What will he do next?