U.K.I.P. and The Greens.

[Geilinor]

UKIP raises the viewership in the media in a way the Greens don't (or at least that's how the media is viewing it).

[The UK in Exile]

which is a false choice.

No, a false choice would be when the other alternatives aren't thought about. Not when they are considered and then one of the options is chosen as policy.

The policy presents itself as a choice.

picking immigrants by skills instead of letting in people with no skills.

picking a doctor over a labourer.

Why do we need to pick exactly? Unless UKIP want to arbitrarily cap immigration..

[Geilinor]

So its not yours but you have no issue repeating it?

It's a fact of policy. They looked at different options and made a choice. Or are you of the belief that political policies are inherently false dichotomies?

They made a choice where they didn't necessarily need to choose.

[The Nihilistic view]

No, a false choice would be when the other alternatives aren't thought about. Not when they are considered and then one of the options is chosen as policy.

The policy presents itself as a choice.

picking immigrants by skills instead of letting in people with no skills.

picking a doctor over a labourer.

Why do we need to pick exactly? Unless UKIP want to arbitrarily cap immigration..

Because oversupply is bad for wages. Great for corporate bosses bad for workers.

[The UK in Exile]

The policy presents itself as a choice.





Why do we need to pick exactly? Unless UKIP want to arbitrarily cap immigration..

Because oversupply is bad for wages. Great for corporate bosses bad for workers.

Unemployment is the lowest its been for 6 years......

[The Nihilistic view]

Because oversupply is bad for wages. Great for corporate bosses bad for workers.

Unemployment is the lowest its been for 6 years......

And wages in real terms are the lowest they have been in..........you guessed it! 6 years.

[The UK in Exile]

Unemployment is the lowest its been for 6 years......

And wages in real terms are the lowest they have been in..........you guessed it! 6 years.

well then there clearly isn't a link between the supply of labour and wages in this instance. is there? supplys been decreasing so, according to you, wages will have gone up.

[Nadkor]

And wages in real terms are the lowest they have been in..........you guessed it! 6 years.

well then there clearly isn't a link between the supply of labour and wages in this instance. is there? supplys been decreasing so, according to you, wages will have gone up.

I'm not entirely sure that you've understood this at all.

[The UK in Exile]

well then there clearly isn't a link between the supply of labour and wages in this instance. is there? supplys been decreasing so, according to you, wages will have gone up.

I'm not entirely sure that you've understood this at all.

It its any consolation, a very average man once said that certainty is the enemy of virtue.

[The Nihilistic view]

And wages in real terms are the lowest they have been in..........you guessed it! 6 years.

well then there clearly isn't a link between the supply of labour and wages in this instance. is there? supplys been decreasing so, according to you, wages will have gone up.

If supply has been decreasing yet wages have still not been rising in real terms then supply is still outstripping demand.

[Nadkor]

I'm not entirely sure that you've understood this at all.

It its any consolation, a very average man once said that certainty is the enemy of virtue.

Very average: my life goal.

I've succeeded.

[Pesda]

Wales has 40 MPs...

I'm talking party-wise not country-wise. Wales has no representation on the UK stage at all as PC is not represented in any debates at all. I'm pretty sure, or I hope, that you don't think the 'Respect party' is a country.

I think we might have misunderstood each other.

[Dejanic]

The rise of UKIP makes very little sense, what we have is a pro small state pro business party that economically is probably to the right of the Tory party under Thatcher, the party is against welfare, against unions, against the working class, and at it's core is a Thatcherite old school Conservative party; yet through populist rhetoric they have managed to pass themselves off as some sort of "workers party", and have now begun to pick up traditional working class support that would have never voted Tory because they're too fiscally right wing, yet they vote for UKIP who are to the right of the Tories. UKIP are doing the job that the left should be doing.

As for the Greens? They're a decent enough party that would probably be as popular as UKIP right now if they had likewise received the absurdly high levels of media coverage, because honestly, the idea that UKIP "got popular" and THEN started to receive a lot of media coverage is a myth. UKIP began to receive proportionally high levels of media coverage back before the 2010 general election.

[Nadkor]

:o The rise of UKIP makes very little sense .

Of course it doesn't. It makes perfect sense.

[L Ron Cupboard]

I loathe UKIP, but I kind of understand why the BBC gives them more prominence than the Greens. UKIP could cause a major split in the Conservative Party, breaking up a major party is not something the Greens have ever seemed likely to do, and that makes them more of a news-worthy story.

[Angleter]

As for the Greens? They're a decent enough party that would probably be as popular as UKIP right now if they had likewise received the absurdly high levels of media coverage, because honestly, the idea that UKIP "got popular" and THEN started to receive a lot of media coverage is a myth. UKIP began to receive proportionally high levels of media coverage back before the 2010 general election.

Really? Obviously, they received extra media coverage at the 2009 European elections (and before that, the 2004 ones - and during the whole Kilroy saga surrounding that), and when Farage ran against Bercow and was involved in that plane crash, but other than that, they weren't exactly big news. Especially not in late 2011 to early 2012, when they started making headway (i.e. polling above 5%).

[Greater-London]

British culture is based on a history of immigration, failure to repel invaders, and success in becoming invaders.
It's UKIP's views on immigration that are foreign.

I'm not denying that's true however this isn't what "British Culture" is based on; just about every country in the WORLD is one based on the invading and settling thing.

UKIP's views on immigration may be wrong but thy are in keeping with actually what plenty of people up and down the country feel. Hence why the Labour & Conservative party have gone all "anti-immigrant" recently. On the contrary having a relaxed view on immigration is a particularly foreign view (at the moment at least)

[Holyrood]

Funny how over the past three days every single paper has ran a story about how Milliband is in trouble due to the SNP, Greens, AND UKIP picking up votes in Red Tory strongholds and yet people still claim UKIP deserves to be in the debates but the other two don't. Pure stupidity, it's time to shut the BBC down.

[Celritannia]

Funny how over the past three days every single paper has ran a story about how Milliband is in trouble due to the SNP, Greens, AND UKIP picking up votes in Red Tory strongholds and yet people still claim UKIP deserves to be in the debates but the other two don't. Pure stupidity, it's time to shut the BBC down.

The news side perhaps.
Nothing else.

[Fukien]

So with that all covered, why don't the Greens get similar coverage in the media, or even a chance to debate in front of an audience?

Most likely because the Green Party platform actually challenges the status quo of the British ruling class, including the interests of the people who own the media, in a way that the agenda of the UKIP does not.

[The Matthew Islands]

Funny how over the past three days every single paper has ran a story about how Milliband is in trouble due to the SNP, Greens, AND UKIP picking up votes in Red Tory strongholds and yet people still claim UKIP deserves to be in the debates but the other two don't. Pure stupidity, it's time to shut the BBC down.

I would hazard to say that a lot of people are wary of the Greens because they are too liberal on issues like immigration, which a lot of people in this country are concerned about so they don't have the broad mainstream appeal or support to actually make them really relevant.

The SNP focus on Scotland exclusively and since they lost the referendum they aren't really as 'relevant' any more.

UKIP are a party that have managed to capture a Tory Seat, nearly took a Labour seat that had a majority of 16,000 and reduced it to like, 450 and could possibly be an important factor in the next UK general election and continuously make themselves appeal more and more to an electorate that is feeling thoroughly dissatisfied and disconnected with a political system that basically belittles and insults them by either branding them as either racist, bigoted, backwards or ignorant or outright ignores them. I have no idea why the BBC would wan't to cover that.

[The Nihilistic view]

Funny how over the past three days every single paper has ran a story about how Milliband is in trouble due to the SNP, Greens, AND UKIP picking up votes in Red Tory strongholds and yet people still claim UKIP deserves to be in the debates but the other two don't. Pure stupidity, it's time to shut the BBC down.

Look, the SNP aren't getting on a national debate about issues mostly not relevant to them and hijacking it. The getting on is what would be pure stupidity. I and most British people outside Scotland don't care what the SNP have to say about UK wide issues, as we can't vote for them. However virtually everyone can vote UKIP in 2015 and most people will have the chance to vote Green. The SNP just aren't that important on a national level and trying to shoehorn them in as equal or more important to two fully national parties to the nation as a whole in a general election is silly.

As happened last time the proper place for them is in regional debates with the Scottish leaders of the parties standing in Scotland.

[Sebastianbourg]

Funny how over the past three days every single paper has ran a story about how Milliband is in trouble due to the SNP, Greens, AND UKIP picking up votes in Red Tory strongholds and yet people still claim UKIP deserves to be in the debates but the other two don't. Pure stupidity, it's time to shut the BBC down.

Look, the SNP aren't getting on a national debate about issues mostly not relevant to them and hijacking it. The getting on is what would be pure stupidity. I and most British people outside Scotland don't care what the SNP have to say about UK wide issues, as we can't vote for them. However virtually everyone can vote UKIP in 2015 and most people will have the chance to vote Green. The SNP just aren't that important on a national level and trying to shoehorn them in as equal or more important to two fully national parties to the nation as a whole in a general election is silly.

As happened last time the proper place for them is in regional debates with the Scottish leaders of the parties standing in Scotland.

Not only does Holyrood believe the SNP to be of national importance but he proposes we shut down the BBC!

[Barrera]

The debates should be between either: 1) all the parties with a seat in parliament, or; 2) the two party leaders with an actual chance of being prime minister. Given the first option would be impractical—not to mention irrelevant in the case of the SNP, PC, DUP, Sinn Féin that are all, effectively, local parties—I would support the second option.

A debate between Cameron and Miliband seems the way to go, IMHO.

[Nadkor]

Funny how over the past three days every single paper has ran a story about how Milliband is in trouble due to the SNP, Greens, AND UKIP picking up votes in Red Tory strongholds and yet people still claim UKIP deserves to be in the debates but the other two don't. Pure stupidity, it's time to shut the BBC down.

Look, the SNP aren't getting on a national debate about issues mostly not relevant to them and hijacking it. The getting on is what would be pure stupidity. I and most British people outside Scotland don't care what the SNP have to say about UK wide issues, as we can't vote for them. However virtually everyone can vote UKIP in 2015 and most people will have the chance to vote Green. The SNP just aren't that important on a national level and trying to shoehorn them in as equal or more important to two fully national parties to the nation as a whole in a general election is silly.

As happened last time the proper place for them is in regional debates with the Scottish leaders of the parties standing in Scotland.

...is correct.