Christian Discussion Thread IV

[Tarsonis Survivors]

That depends on whether they actually practice what they believe, or just go to church on Sunday but otherwise don't take their faith very seriously.

If everyone in the world were a truly practicing Christian - actually, never mind everyone in the world; if just the people who currently call themselves Christians were truly practicing Christians - that would be enough to end world poverty, and greatly reduce the number of wars and other conflicts. This is because truly practicing Christians are people who spend most of their time trying to help their brothers and sisters in need.

But I do not believe that it will ever be possible to get a majority of the world (let alone everyone) to be truly practicing Christians.

Really? do you have any statistics to back this up? I've never seen any actual statistics on Christianity charity - I dare say charity would rather take a hit,while local churches would recieve more and put back into the community due to the small/close knit communities,bigger churches would slush the money into closed books to do god knows what with it

I'm not sure about less wars though;the same faith does deter invasions (I mean,not a lot of people want to kill someone of their own faith),but when everyone beliefs the same it falls to the background as a unimportant factor in day to day life (like taking the train to your job,it's routine and background radiation rather then a deciding factor)

You missed his point. If all Christians acted like Christians, the mega churches wouldn't embezzle, we'd all take care of our fellow man, we'd all be Roman Catholic, etc etc. All those things you listed are a result of people not acting according to the faith.

[Tarsonis Survivors]

Unfortunately this is not "obvious": the Catholic Church has taken the opposite position.

No... it hasn't. Medical necessity is the only time the Catholic Church permits abortion.

Though sometimes strongly Catholic countries may ignore the official Church stance; I believe Ireland has at times forbade abortion even when the mother will die otherwise.

Uh, you might want to check this. From my understandi abortion is a big no no under any circumstances...

[Tarsonis Survivors]

Not with a crime as grave as murder.

When you kill someone in self-defence, the Church considers that murder. It is a very grave sin. But in many places, the state does not consider it murder, and it is legal.

The Church's definition of murder and the legal definition of murder are different in most countries. Yet there is no movement to bring the legal definition perfectly in line with the Church's definition.

Not true, killing in self defense or to prevent the shedding of innocent bloox is considered justfied. If not, you better talk to your priests who consecrate military weapons.

[Tarsonis Survivors]

He's right in what he said. Perhaps he should have said why, but then again statements such as this hardly warrant argumentation.

The reason your argument is utterly wrong is because you're judging an institution for things it did in the Middle Ages. If you're going to do that you have to judge everything and everyone from that time period. Are we also gonna say England is terrible and evil? France? Germany? Every other country? No, to do so would be foolish, because people then had an entirely different paradigm of thought, and applying modern ideals to people 1000 years ago is incredible naive.

Did the Church turn it's infallibility off in the middle ages or something?

You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. If the Church didn't know better then anyone else, then what's it for?

The Church isn't infallible... at least in the can do no wrong sense.

[Lalaki]

Really? do you have any statistics to back this up? I've never seen any actual statistics on Christianity charity - I dare say charity would rather take a hit,while local churches would recieve more and put back into the community due to the small/close knit communities,bigger churches would slush the money into closed books to do god knows what with it

I'm not sure about less wars though;the same faith does deter invasions (I mean,not a lot of people want to kill someone of their own faith),but when everyone beliefs the same it falls to the background as a unimportant factor in day to day life (like taking the train to your job,it's routine and background radiation rather then a deciding factor)

You missed his point. If all Christians acted like Christians, the mega churches wouldn't embezzle, we'd all take care of our fellow man, we'd all be Roman Catholic, etc etc. All those things you listed are a result of people not acting according to the faith.

I agree. Much of the negative things we discuss in churches arise from people not truly practicing the faith.

[Nationalist State of Knox]

It's a newer idea, so therefore it's automatically wrong?

I smell chronological snobbery.

If an idea being old makes it true, then the only true religion is the totemism and animal worship that the Neanderthals practiced.

Correct.

[Menassa]

If an idea being old makes it true, then the only true religion is the totemism and animal worship that the Neanderthals practiced.

Correct.

Grug nog say fire speaks to Grug nog, Grug nog say personal revelation.

[Conscentia]

Correct.

Grug nog say fire speaks to Grug nog, Grug nog say personal revelation.

Og the Wise says Grug nog should lay off those berries he found.

[Tarsonis Survivors]

Ig wug make wheel

[Lleu llaw Gyffes]

One wheel completely useless until Aeg invent SECOND wheel, while Ig just rides unicycle.

[Conscentia]

Og the Wise already has cave sketches of automobiles, but no-one will understand them until the automobile is actually invented several millenia later.

... I think we should return to the topic of Christianity now. (Though stereotypically named cave people trying to one-up each other might work as an f7 thread.)

[Distruzio]

I have a question:

Suppose everyone in the world beliefs in god,more specifically one form of Christianity,then what?
Will the world change in any aspect? will it be any better?

It absolutely would be better. Caesaropapism/elective absolute monarchy is best government structure.

[Lalaki]

Do you guys think that the Catholic Church will continue to become more progressive with each Pope?

[Lalaki]

I have a question:

Suppose everyone in the world beliefs in god,more specifically one form of Christianity,then what?
Will the world change in any aspect? will it be any better?

It absolutely would be better. Caesaropapism/elective absolute monarchy is best government structure.

Even with everyone in the world a Christian, I would still support a secular democratic republic.

[Distruzio]

Do you guys think that the Catholic Church will continue to become more progressive with each Pope?

I don't see her as "progressive." I see her as more liberal. The two are not, necessarily, synonymous.

[The Union of the West]

A couple questions for believers in Papal Infallibility:

1) If the Pope were to claim to be God, would that make it true?

2) Back in the days of Galileo, the Church and Pope Paul V held the position that the Earth was at the center of the universe and the sun revolved around the Earth. Modern science has proven that this is obviously wrong. Is this not an error on behalf of the Pope, therefore making him fallible?

[Distruzio]

It absolutely would be better. Caesaropapism/elective absolute monarchy is best government structure.

Even with everyone in the world a Christian, I would still support a secular democratic republic.

Eww.

/puts on bibliolotrous hat\

That's unbiblical, sir!

[Menassa]

A couple questions for believers in Papal Infallibility:

1) If the Pope were to claim to be God, would that make it true?

Probably the same thing as if a man would claim to be God.

Thank you, I'll be here all weak.

Try the veal!

[Lalaki]

A couple questions for believers in Papal Infallibility:

1) If the Pope were to claim to be God, would that make it true?

2) Back in the days of Galileo, the Church and Pope Paul V held the position that the Earth was at the center of the universe and the sun revolved around the Earth. Modern science has proven that this is obviously wrong. Is this not an error on behalf of the Pope, therefore making him fallible?

The Pope is only infallible in faith and morals.

[Distruzio]

A couple questions for believers in Papal Infallibility:

1) If the Pope were to claim to be God, would that make it true?

That's not how it works. He cannot make such a claim.

2) Back in the days of Galileo, the Church and Pope Paul V held the position that the Earth was at the center of the universe and the sun revolved around the Earth. Modern science has proven that this is obviously wrong. Is this not an error on behalf of the Pope, therefore making him fallible?

The Church held that view because that was the contemporary scientific consensus. Galileo was censured because he attacked that consensus before his findings could be verified. Moreover, the Church has endorsed the Big Bang Theory - it was a catholic who developed the theory. Einstein rejected the theory as hogwash.

[Sun Wukong]

Do you guys think that the Catholic Church will continue to become more progressive with each Pope?

Umm... kind of?

If society is driving down the autobahn of progress, then the Catholic Church is an old guy driving with his blinkers on. He'll always lag annoyingly behind and be in the way, but that doesn't mean he isn't moving.

[The Union of the West]

A couple questions for believers in Papal Infallibility:

1) If the Pope were to claim to be God, would that make it true?

That's not how it works. He cannot make such a claim.

If he has vocal chords and a big enough ego, he can.

[Lalaki]

That's not how it works. He cannot make such a claim.

If he has vocal chords and a big enough ego, he can.

Like I said, the Pope is only infallible in faith and morals. Claims of divinity are outside of his jurisdiction.

[Lleu llaw Gyffes]

Og the Wise already has cave sketches of automobiles, but no-one will understand them until the automobile is actually invented several millenia later.

... I think we should return to the topic of Christianity now. (Though stereotypically named cave people trying to one-up each other might work as an f7 thread.)

Let's do the Cavemen like the Yorkshire-men sketch: Cave! CAVE! You had it soft.

[Distruzio]

That's not how it works. He cannot make such a claim.

If he has vocal chords and a big enough ego, he can.

No. He cannot. That's not how papal declarations work.