Are Church Donations Trade?

[Free Atheist Peoples]

Are Church Donations Trade?

Yes they are. Now, most donations don't personally benefit the donator significantly, nor is there any type of serious compensation involved. Now the Christian doctrine calls for its followers to attend a service at a Church. Now to obey this obligation, and to give the people what they want, which is a SERVICE, they must request a fee from their members. Though this service is not mandatory, it is heavily urged by the Church. The same can be said for any business organization. If you step inside a McDonalds you are urged to buy something, but don't have to. On the other hand, christians are often coaxed and intimidated into giving funds to the church to prevent them from being shunned by those around them. Now what if people did not "donate" this money to maintain the church? The church would certainly go out of business as a result of massive debt and financial instability. Since the people coming to this church are voluntarily coming, they donate money to maintain and receive a service they want. This is no different than going to a store and buying something. Though you may not receive any direct compensation, you are giving money to receive a particular service. Just like a business, churches need money to maintain their existence and provide the service they intend to keep on maintaining . Now this can be said of any other donation, but those other donations are not given in Church. Jesus clearly threw out the traders in the temple, as their was to be no bartering in the house of the lord. What makes a donation to a church any different than bartering or trading, the answer is...nothing. Church goers are also urged by God in the Old Testament, to give a tithe or ten percent of their income. Though some do not donate, as long as some do the service will still stand.

Comparing Modern Capitalist Purchases and Services to Church Donations

1. Both are optional
2. Both exchange currency for the supply of a particular service, and in the case of Catholicism, church goers receive actual physical compensation for donations, this compensation is eaten and drank. No different than exchanging money to buy a burger and soda at McDonalds.
3. Some need to give money in order to maintain and receive the service they want.
4. Christianity and modern capitalism both have something in common, Luke 6:38- "Give, and you will receive." YOU give money in exchange for a service YOU want to maintain and receive. Without YOUR donation or the donations of others, the organization will have trouble providing those services. Thus organization closes down or results to laying off employees.
5. Just as in capitalism, some Churches employ persons to administer services, such as priests or pastors. These persons have their income maintained by the Church.
6. Some Churches advertise for more profit, asking others to donate to them. Thus they are advertising for more money to maintain a particular service. No different from a McDonalds ad that asks you to buy something to receive and maintain a particular service.
7. What exactly are you purchasing? You are purchasing a service and according to the bible, a guaranteed life after death.

In conclusion, religions are businesses, providing a particular service for members in exchange for currency. Without this currency from those attending, the church can no longer perform the service it promised. Church donations are not donations, they are simply a particular amount of currency going to an organization that needs the currency to maintain and administer a service that the "donators" want. You purchase the service that you want.

[Vetalia]

Uh, assuming you're in good standing with the Church you can receive Communion regardless of whether you donate or not. And I really don't think a wafer and sip of wine are quite on par with a Big Mac and Coke.

[Vetalia]

And actually, an interesting fact; when you donate money to a religious organization, they issue you a statement that says "no goods or services were received in exchange for this donation other than intangible religious benefits", so they do recognize them as a sort of exchange, albeit one that does not violate the rules regarding charitable contributions.

[Diopolis]

Nope. Church donations are donations.

[Pope Joan]

Nobody has to pay anything to go to my church. The offering is a show of thanks, for those who feel thankful and can afford it. If you are broke, you can still come. And you can be an elder, and eat our food, and get free winter fuel and gasoline if you need it.

Oh, Christians are so hideous. Not.

[Galloism]

First, I want to say that I completely believe your first post being a reasonably decently spoken one with a really bad premise in concept in no way makes me think you're a puppet of someone else.

I swear.


1) Yes, as are most things.

2) Most religions do not require donations for attendance. They also do not require attendance for donations. As such, both exchanges are voluntary, rather than one being traded for the other. If "coercion" is what makes it a trade, you really need to talk to those people who have the feeding children in Africa commercials on national TV.

3) But the individual does not need to give money to give services, unlike in a business transaction. Similarly, some must give money so that a police department can exist. That does not make paying taxes a business transaction.

4) This is true of every nonprofit ever. If no one gives them money, they shut down.

5) Some churches employ ministers. In some ministers themselves are volunteer. Not for profits also employ administrators, whom they pay, in order to operate the not for profit. As I recall, the Executive Administrator of the Red Cross draws a seven figure salary.

6) Once again, please call those "feed children in africa" people. They advertise for donations. So does the Red Cross, the Salvation Army, the local Food Bank...

7) Actually, you are donating to a continuation of a service. If you fail to donate, you get the service anyway. If no one donates, it ends, that's true. However, this is true of every single charitable organization in existence.

[The Grey Wolf]

Nobody has to pay anything to go to my church. The offering is a show of thanks, for those who feel thankful and can afford it. If you are broke, you can still come. And you can be an elder, and eat our food, and get free winter fuel and gasoline if you need it.

Oh, Christians are so hideous. Not.

^ This.

[Free Atheist Peoples]

And actually, an interesting fact; when you donate money to a religious organization, they issue you a statement that says "no goods or services were received in exchange for this donation other than intangible religious benefits", so they do recognize them as a sort of exchange, albeit one that does not violate the rules regarding charitable contributions.

But they are receiving compensation. They are paying for a service they want. What would happen if every single christian stopped donating right now? The Churches would have to close because they don't have enough money to continue the services people want. The same thing would happen if I ran a business, and I was not making any money. People can come in to my store to look around, buy nothing, and leave, but the only true way to guarantee my business's survival is if I people who will buy things from me.

[Fascist Russian Empire]

Yeah, that shit might fly in the Catholic Church (selling pardons for sins), but it sure as hell ain't the case in any Protestant church that I know of. In my church, donations are actually used for charity, and my church is quite active in helping the community. Never, once, has anyone had to pay to be a member of my church; donations might be encouraged, considering the fact that the church relies entirely on money gathered from donations, but they are not required.

[Diopolis]

And actually, an interesting fact; when you donate money to a religious organization, they issue you a statement that says "no goods or services were received in exchange for this donation other than intangible religious benefits", so they do recognize them as a sort of exchange, albeit one that does not violate the rules regarding charitable contributions.

But they are receiving compensation. They are paying for a service they want. What would happen if every single christian stopped donating right now? The Churches would have to close because they don't have enough money to continue the services people want. The same thing would happen if I ran a business, and I was not making any money. People can come in to my store to look around, buy nothing, and leave, but the only true way to guarantee my business's survival is if I people who will buy things from me.

The same is true of every nonprofit.

[Nadkor]

Nope.

No consideration = no contract = no trade.

[Free Atheist Peoples]

But they are receiving compensation. They are paying for a service they want. What would happen if every single christian stopped donating right now? The Churches would have to close because they don't have enough money to continue the services people want. The same thing would happen if I ran a business, and I was not making any money. People can come in to my store to look around, buy nothing, and leave, but the only true way to guarantee my business's survival is if I people who will buy things from me.

The same is true of every nonprofit.

If I donate money to help african children, what compensation do I get? Do I get anything in return? In most cases not, and that is how it should be. When I give money to help others, I don't want anything in return, other than the fact that my money has helped feed the needy or contributed to healing the sick. What do churches do? They ask and try to convince to give money, so they can pay their employees, maintain the service that you want, and provide the service that the purchasers want. Why do you donate to your Church if not to purchase and maintain a service you want. That is compensation is it not? You are receiving a service in return for your purchase. The same can be said for musical concerts. You are paying to hear someones voice, what compensation are you getting out of the concert for your purchase if not here the voice of another?

[Draica]

Who cares if it's trade or not? Churches need funds to keep the doors open. If people wish to give churches money to keep the doors open, they are allowed to do it, trade or not.

[Fascist Russian Empire]

The same is true of every nonprofit.

If I donate money to help african children, what compensation do I get? Do I get anything in return? In most cases not, and that is how it should be. When I give money to help others, I don't want anything in return, other than the fact that my money has helped feed the needy or contributed to healing the sick. What do churches do? They ask and try to convince to give money, so they can pay their employees, maintain the service that you want, and provide the service that the purchasers want. Why do you donate to your Church if not to purchase and maintain a service you want. That is compensation is it not? You are receiving a service in return for your purchase. The same can be said for musical concerts. You are paying to hear someones voice, what compensation are you getting out of the concert for your purchase if not here the voice of another?

All charities ask for money to maintain their operations. A charity which gives food to hungry people? They will obviously ask for money to buy food and keep employees on their payroll. All charities and non-profit organizations need money to maintain what they do, and churches are no different.

[Galloism]

The same is true of every nonprofit.

If I donate money to help african children, what compensation do I get? Do I get anything in return?

Of course. You get a sense of self-satisfaction and the reward that comes with doing something good. It's well documented that you receive activation in your reward centers for giving, and thus you receive a small "high" from the donations.

Also, watch PBS do a charity drive sometime.

[Lubby]

Are Church Donations Trade?

Yes they are. Now, most donations don't personally benefit the donator significantly, nor is there any type of serious compensation involved. Now the Christian doctrine calls for its followers to attend a service at a Church. Now to obey this obligation, and to give the people what they want, which is a SERVICE, they must request a fee from their members. Though this service is not mandatory, it is heavily urged by the Church. The same can be said for any business organization. If you step inside a McDonalds you are urged to buy something, but don't have to. On the other hand, christians are often coaxed and intimidated into giving funds to the church to prevent them from being shunned by those around them. Now what if people did not "donate" this money to maintain the church? The church would certainly go out of business as a result of massive debt and financial instability. Since the people coming to this church are voluntarily coming, they donate money to maintain and receive a service they want. This is no different than going to a store and buying something. Though you may not receive any direct compensation, you are giving money to receive a particular service. Just like a business, churches need money to maintain their existence and provide the service they intend to keep on maintaining . Now this can be said of any other donation, but those other donations are not given in Church. Jesus clearly threw out the traders in the temple, as their was to be no bartering in the house of the lord. What makes a donation to a church any different than bartering or trading, the answer is...nothing. Church goers are also urged by God in the Old Testament, to give a tithe or ten percent of their income. Though some do not donate, as long as some do the service will still stand.

Comparing Modern Capitalist Purchases and Services to Church Donations

1. Both are optional
2. Both exchange currency for the supply of a particular service, and in the case of Catholicism, church goers receive actual physical compensation for donations, this compensation is eaten and drank. No different than exchanging money to buy a burger and soda at McDonalds.
3. Some need to give money in order to maintain and receive the service they want.
4. Christianity and modern capitalism both have something in common, Luke 6:38- "Give, and you will receive." YOU give money in exchange for a service YOU want to maintain and receive. Without YOUR donation or the donations of others, the organization will have trouble providing those services. Thus organization closes down or results to laying off employees.
5. Just as in capitalism, some Churches employ persons to administer services, such as priests or pastors. These persons have their income maintained by the Church.
6. Some Churches advertise for more profit, asking others to donate to them. Thus they are advertising for more money to maintain a particular service. No different from a McDonalds ad that asks you to buy something to receive and maintain a particular service.
7. What exactly are you purchasing? You are purchasing a service and according to the bible, a guaranteed life after death.

In conclusion, religions are businesses, providing a particular service for members in exchange for currency. Without this currency from those attending, the church can no longer perform the service it promised. Church donations are not donations, they are simply a particular amount of currency going to an organization that needs the currency to maintain and administer a service that the "donators" want. You purchase the service that you want.

Catholics don't pay for pardons..

Every non-profit advertises...

[Free Atheist Peoples]

If I donate money to help african children, what compensation do I get? Do I get anything in return?

Of course. You get a sense of self-satisfaction and the reward that comes with doing something good. It's well documented that you receive activation in your reward centers for giving, and thus you receive a small "high" from the donations.

Also, watch PBS do a charity drive sometime.

You are right, I do feel good after I donate. But is that enough to qualify it as a purchase? I don't think so. In Church, I sit on pews, read the books they have, under a roof, with the employees, the decor, and all other wonderful things inside I pay for. If I am giving money to a Church, I am getting something significant in return am I not. I walk into a burger king, and I try one of their burgers, and I absolutely love it. I also love the decor, the walls, the chairs, and pretty pictures. So I think to myself and say, "You know, this is delicious, I want some more so I can sustain this service and this establishment." It is no different than a Church.

[Fascist Russian Empire]

Of course. You get a sense of self-satisfaction and the reward that comes with doing something good. It's well documented that you receive activation in your reward centers for giving, and thus you receive a small "high" from the donations.

Also, watch PBS do a charity drive sometime.

You are right, I do feel good after I donate. But is that enough to qualify it as a purchase? I don't think so. In Church, I sit on pews, read the books they have, under a roof, with the employees, the decor, and all other wonderful things inside I pay for. If I am giving money to a Church, I am getting something significant in return am I not. I walk into a burger king, and I try one of their burgers, and I absolutely love it. I also love the decor, the walls, the chairs, and pretty pictures. So I think to myself and say, "You know, this is delicious, I want some more so I can sustain this service and this establishment." It is no different than a Church.

Except, of course, for the fact that you don't have to pay to be in a church, nor do you have to pay for their services.

[Diopolis]

The same is true of every nonprofit.

If I donate money to help african children, what compensation do I get? Do I get anything in return? In most cases not, and that is how it should be. When I give money to help others, I don't want anything in return, other than the fact that my money has helped feed the needy or contributed to healing the sick. What do churches do? They ask and try to convince to give money, so they can pay their employees, maintain the service that you want, and provide the service that the purchasers want. Why do you donate to your Church if not to purchase and maintain a service you want. That is compensation is it not? You are receiving a service in return for your purchase. The same can be said for musical concerts. You are paying to hear someones voice, what compensation are you getting out of the concert for your purchase if not here the voice of another?

You get to feel self satisfied and get rid of first world guilt.

[Orla]

Nothing wrong with a church donating to something. Also, nothing wrong with someone donating to a church.

[Draica]

Nothing wrong with a church donating to something. Also, nothing wrong with someone donating to a church.

Exactly.

Unless your that person from Youtube who thinks Churches are evil and should be closed down with black magick.

[Orla]

Of course. You get a sense of self-satisfaction and the reward that comes with doing something good. It's well documented that you receive activation in your reward centers for giving, and thus you receive a small "high" from the donations.

Also, watch PBS do a charity drive sometime.

You are right, I do feel good after I donate. But is that enough to qualify it as a purchase? I don't think so. In Church, I sit on pews, read the books they have, under a roof, with the employees, the decor, and all other wonderful things inside I pay for. If I am giving money to a Church, I am getting something significant in return am I not. I walk into a burger king, and I try one of their burgers, and I absolutely love it. I also love the decor, the walls, the chairs, and pretty pictures. So I think to myself and say, "You know, this is delicious, I want some more so I can sustain this service and this establishment." It is no different than a Church.

In Sweden, you do not pay for church services. I don't think you do in US either.

[Free Atheist Peoples]

Nothing wrong with a church donating to something. Also, nothing wrong with someone donating to a church.

I never said there was anything wrong with it. I just said it was no different from common trade.

[Draica]

Nothing wrong with a church donating to something. Also, nothing wrong with someone donating to a church.

I never said there was anything wrong with it. I just said it was no different from common trade.

Ok "Free Atheist Peoples"?

Why do you even care if Church donations are trade or not?

[Geilinor]

The same is true of every nonprofit.

If I donate money to help african children, what compensation do I get? Do I get anything in return? In most cases not, and that is how it should be. When I give money to help others, I don't want anything in return, other than the fact that my money has helped feed the needy or contributed to healing the sick. What do churches do? They ask and try to convince to give money, so they can pay their employees, maintain the service that you want, and provide the service that the purchasers want. Why do you donate to your Church if not to purchase and maintain a service you want. That is compensation is it not? You are receiving a service in return for your purchase. The same can be said for musical concerts. You are paying to hear someones voice, what compensation are you getting out of the concert for your purchase if not here the voice of another?

Donations to churches are not payment. Most religious organizations don't require you to donate in order to come inside.