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War Crimes?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

War Criminal?

George Walker Bush is a war criminal.
87
53%
No he is not.
62
38%
War Criminal!? Obama's the Enemy of Humanity!
15
9%
 
Total votes : 164

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Californian Mod Haters
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War Crimes?

Postby Californian Mod Haters » Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:25 pm

Apparently someone thinks we(/George Bush) did war crimes.
Alternet, http://www.alternet.com/world/38604/ wrote:...Perhaps no person on the planet is equipped to identify and describe our war crimes than Ben Ferencz, a former chief prosecuter of the Nuremberg Trials...

The implacations of this is startling. This means George Bush could be executed once Europe stops acting like wusses. Opinions?

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Rolling squid
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Postby Rolling squid » Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:30 pm

I would say that Bush committed war crimes, what with all the secret torture prisons, openly admitted torture prisons, and invading a sovereign nation without justification. I'm fairly sure at least one of those is a violation of the Geneva convention, ergo, Bush is a war criminal.
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Verlorenen
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Postby Verlorenen » Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:31 pm

Californian Mod Haters wrote:Apparently someone thinks we(/George Bush) did war crimes.
Alternet, http://www.alternet.com/world/38604/ wrote:...Perhaps no person on the planet is equipped to identify and describe our war crimes than Ben Ferencz, a former chief prosecuter of the Nuremberg Trials...

The implacations of this is startling. This means George Bush could be executed once Europe stops acting like wusses. Opinions?

Who cares? He overstepped his bounds in the name of religion and democracy.
We're still living with the abomination of the PATRIOT Act and Guantanamo Bay. As far as I'm concerned, Bush, Cheney, all of them can go to trial for perverting American liberty and smearing our name in the history books. Oh yeah, and the hideous war crimes that they committed.

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Fredrikshamn
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Founded: Oct 08, 2009
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Postby Fredrikshamn » Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:32 pm

Technically, he invaded a sovereign nation under false pretenses and he knew those pretenses were false at the time too, so I do believe this would constitute a war crime although I am no expert of International law or diplomacy.

So I believe just because he is an American that doesnt give him or any American for that an automatic immunity from being tried at an International level.

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Unchecked Expansion
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Founded: May 06, 2009
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Postby Unchecked Expansion » Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:35 pm

The Enemy Combatant school of thought was an incredibly immoral way to conduct a war. You cannot claim moral high ground in a war by refusing your enemy the rights you decry them for opposing. Detention without trial and torture seem like war crime to me

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Isolous
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Founded: Sep 01, 2009
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Postby Isolous » Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:36 pm

I don't think anyone would want to piss off the US by threatening their (edt: former, thank god) leader, war crimes or not.
Last edited by Isolous on Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Lackadaisical2
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Founded: Mar 03, 2008
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Postby Lackadaisical2 » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:01 pm

Verlorenen wrote:
Californian Mod Haters wrote:Apparently someone thinks we(/George Bush) did war crimes.
Alternet, http://www.alternet.com/world/38604/ wrote:...Perhaps no person on the planet is equipped to identify and describe our war crimes than Ben Ferencz, a former chief prosecuter of the Nuremberg Trials...

The implacations of this is startling. This means George Bush could be executed once Europe stops acting like wusses. Opinions?

Who cares? He overstepped his bounds in the name of religion and democracy.
We're still living with the abomination of the PATRIOT Act and Guantanamo Bay. As far as I'm concerned, Bush, Cheney, all of them can go to trial for perverting American liberty and smearing our name in the history books. Oh yeah, and the hideous war crimes that they committed.


As long as all of Congress goes to jail too.
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Verlorenen
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Postby Verlorenen » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:03 pm

Lackadaisical2 wrote:As long as all of Congress goes to jail too.


Sure, why not. People need a goddamn wakeup call.

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Gauntleted Fist
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Founded: Aug 17, 2008
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Postby Gauntleted Fist » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:03 pm

Lackadaisical2 wrote:
Verlorenen wrote:
Californian Mod Haters wrote:Apparently someone thinks we(/George Bush) did war crimes.
Alternet, http://www.alternet.com/world/38604/ wrote:...Perhaps no person on the planet is equipped to identify and describe our war crimes than Ben Ferencz, a former chief prosecuter of the Nuremberg Trials...

The implacations of this is startling. This means George Bush could be executed once Europe stops acting like wusses. Opinions?

Who cares? He overstepped his bounds in the name of religion and democracy.
We're still living with the abomination of the PATRIOT Act and Guantanamo Bay. As far as I'm concerned, Bush, Cheney, all of them can go to trial for perverting American liberty and smearing our name in the history books. Oh yeah, and the hideous war crimes that they committed.


As long as all of Congress goes to jail too.

Why?

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Conservative Alliances
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Postby Conservative Alliances » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:20 pm

I do not think he is.
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
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Hellond
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Founded: Aug 07, 2009
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Postby Hellond » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:23 pm

Morally, he is a war criminal. But the US is the #1 military power in the world, so he isn't a war criminal.

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CommunistSovietAmerica
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Postby CommunistSovietAmerica » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:23 pm

Bush and Cheney were some of the worst leader this nation has ever seen along with Andrew Jackson, Nixon, and now Obama, but they weren't War Criminals.
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Libertarian Governance
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Postby Libertarian Governance » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:26 pm

I believe there is the possibility for any nation on Earth to prosecute Baby Bush for war crimes. The nation just has to issue a warrant and then arrest. Maybe Chavez will get him. We can only hope.
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Conservative Alliances
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Postby Conservative Alliances » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:27 pm

CommunistSovietAmerica wrote:Bush and Cheney were some of the worst leader this nation has ever seen along with Andrew Jackson, Nixon, and now Obama, but they weren't War Criminals.


I would actually put Bush right in the middle. He was not great, but he was not horrible. I can think of way too many presidents that were worse, at least in my opinion.
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
I am the Ghost of Sparta
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Glorious Homeland wrote:Although some individuals provided counter-points which tended to put to bed a few of my previous statements (conservative alliances, zoingo)

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FreeSatania
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Founded: May 26, 2008
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Postby FreeSatania » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:30 pm

In keeping with the precedent set by the Nobel Committee to honour his future potential War Crimes and in order to fit in with all of you baby murdering liberals I too voted for Obama.

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Birminghamia
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Founded: Jul 11, 2009
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Postby Birminghamia » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:34 pm

If "pro" is the opposite of "con", then what is the opposite of "progress"? :)

Their war-criminal status is debatable, but every Representative and Senator who voted for the USA PATRIOT Act, as well as Bush, are criminals anyway for violating the 4th amendment (warranted search and seizure).
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Birminghamia wrote:
Peisandros wrote:The kid was never in the balloon, infact he was hiding in the attic and they let it go off. I think it's pretty self-explanatory.

I thought so, also, but the Sheriff's Dept. says publicly they suspect it wasn't.

Bah, they're just trying to save face because they got pwned by a 6 year old.

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CommunistSovietAmerica
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Postby CommunistSovietAmerica » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:35 pm

Libertarian Governance wrote:I believe there is the possibility for any nation on Earth to prosecute Baby Bush for war crimes. The nation just has to issue a warrant and then arrest. Maybe Chavez will get him. We can only hope.


Chavez, really? :eyebrow:
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Brajh
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Postby Brajh » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:36 pm

Libertarian Governance wrote:I believe there is the possibility for any nation on Earth to prosecute Baby Bush for war crimes. The nation just has to issue a warrant and then arrest. Maybe Chavez will get him. We can only hope.


No one will ever prosecute any American leader for anything. Look what it took Nixon to resign. With the only other two impeachments being total bullshit (Andrew Johnson, Bill Clinton), US Presidents are basically immune to the law, unless they do something clearly and seriously in the wrong.
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Birminghamia
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Postby Birminghamia » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:48 pm

Brajh wrote:
Libertarian Governance wrote:I believe there is the possibility for any nation on Earth to prosecute Baby Bush for war crimes. The nation just has to issue a warrant and then arrest. Maybe Chavez will get him. We can only hope.


No one will ever prosecute any American leader for anything. Look what it took Nixon to resign. With the only other two impeachments being total bullshit (Andrew Johnson, Bill Clinton), US Presidents are basically immune to the law, unless they do something clearly and seriously in the wrong.


Why do you think I want to President? To serve my country when I can buy tortoises for $0.30 in Madagascar and sell them for $10,000 in America? ;) jk
Yootopia wrote:
Nercer - wrote:Workers of the World Unite!

They can take our pocket money, BUT THEY CAN NEVER TAKE OUR FREEEEEEEDOOOOOOOM!


Peisandros wrote:
Birminghamia wrote:
Peisandros wrote:The kid was never in the balloon, infact he was hiding in the attic and they let it go off. I think it's pretty self-explanatory.

I thought so, also, but the Sheriff's Dept. says publicly they suspect it wasn't.

Bah, they're just trying to save face because they got pwned by a 6 year old.

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Daistallia 2104
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Postby Daistallia 2104 » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:50 pm

Californian Mod Haters wrote:Apparently someone thinks we(/George Bush) did war crimes.
Alternet, http://www.alternet.com/world/38604/ wrote:...Perhaps no person on the planet is equipped to identify and describe our war crimes than Ben Ferencz, a former chief prosecuter of the Nuremberg Trials...

The implacations of this is startling. This means George Bush could be executed once Europe stops acting like wusses. Opinions?


Your link is broken...

And from what I can see, your info's far out of date.
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Brajh
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Postby Brajh » Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:46 pm

Birminghamia wrote:
Brajh wrote:
Libertarian Governance wrote:I believe there is the possibility for any nation on Earth to prosecute Baby Bush for war crimes. The nation just has to issue a warrant and then arrest. Maybe Chavez will get him. We can only hope.


No one will ever prosecute any American leader for anything. Look what it took Nixon to resign. With the only other two impeachments being total bullshit (Andrew Johnson, Bill Clinton), US Presidents are basically immune to the law, unless they do something clearly and seriously in the wrong.


Why do you think I want to President? To serve my country when I can buy tortoises for $0.30 in Madagascar and sell them for $10,000 in America? ;) jk


I want to be President so I can throw around the nuclear football on the White House lawn with my boys.
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Libertarian Governance
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Postby Libertarian Governance » Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:51 pm

Brajh wrote:
Libertarian Governance wrote:I believe there is the possibility for any nation on Earth to prosecute Baby Bush for war crimes. The nation just has to issue a warrant and then arrest. Maybe Chavez will get him. We can only hope.


No one will ever prosecute any American leader for anything. Look what it took Nixon to resign. With the only other two impeachments being total bullshit (Andrew Johnson, Bill Clinton), US Presidents are basically immune to the law, unless they do something clearly and seriously in the wrong.


I agree its highly unlikely. Still Chavez already said he was the Devil . The law is out there and accepted by everyone, so long as its not their people being prosecuted. All it would take is some ballsy leader to send the Snatch up boyz and cart Baby Bush right off. No one here except a few sordid government officials would really care.
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Brajh
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Postby Brajh » Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:52 pm

Libertarian Governance wrote:
Brajh wrote:
Libertarian Governance wrote:I believe there is the possibility for any nation on Earth to prosecute Baby Bush for war crimes. The nation just has to issue a warrant and then arrest. Maybe Chavez will get him. We can only hope.


No one will ever prosecute any American leader for anything. Look what it took Nixon to resign. With the only other two impeachments being total bullshit (Andrew Johnson, Bill Clinton), US Presidents are basically immune to the law, unless they do something clearly and seriously in the wrong.


I agree its highly unlikely. Still Chavez already said he was the Devil . The law is out there and accepted by everyone, so long as its not their people being prosecuted. All it would take is some ballsy leader to send the Snatch up boyz and cart Baby Bush right off. No one here except a few sordid government officials would really care.


I'm pretty sure President Obama would care that someone under the protection of the Secret Service was kidnapped. He'd be pissed.
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The Norse Hordes
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Postby The Norse Hordes » Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:54 pm

Wait, its a debate that he committed war crimes?

Torture is a war crime. We said so. Our own pecident makes it so. This isnt up for debate. Hes only not being prosecuted because Obama is being a wimp about it and most of congress are wimps.

The most that will happen is some countries will arrest him if he goes to said countries. Which would be a nice little symbolic gesture, but in practice wont actually do much as he can just...you know...not go to those countries.
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The Norse Hordes
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Postby The Norse Hordes » Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:56 pm

Libertarian Governance wrote:
Brajh wrote:
Libertarian Governance wrote:I believe there is the possibility for any nation on Earth to prosecute Baby Bush for war crimes. The nation just has to issue a warrant and then arrest. Maybe Chavez will get him. We can only hope.


No one will ever prosecute any American leader for anything. Look what it took Nixon to resign. With the only other two impeachments being total bullshit (Andrew Johnson, Bill Clinton), US Presidents are basically immune to the law, unless they do something clearly and seriously in the wrong.


I agree its highly unlikely. Still Chavez already said he was the Devil . The law is out there and accepted by everyone, so long as its not their people being prosecuted. All it would take is some ballsy leader to send the Snatch up boyz and cart Baby Bush right off. No one here except a few sordid government officials would really care.



With all do respect...are you on crack? If someone came in and essentially kidnapped a former US leader, the vast majority of people would be pissed.
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