NationStates

Ovisterra wrote:

Sidhae wrote:You know, it's kind of amusing how seriously people tend to take this kind of trivialities. Seems like the political circles are full of sexually-frustrated sociopaths with a pathological urge to regulate how their fellow citizens use their genitals, one way or another, and they seem to have enough like-minded folk among the masses as well.

I find there are plenty of more important things that could use some regulation than whether it's appropriate or not to try and cure sexual deviants, so I neither condemn nor applaud California's decision, just pity them for failing to address more important issues. But then again, knowing their leftie liberal ways, it's rather unsurprising.

I'm often disappointed when some people on NS generalise sweepingly, but knowing their conservative ways, it's hardly surprising.

Leepaidamba wrote:

Madredia wrote:
Oh really, because if a 35 year old and his sister have sex thats harming children right? And by liberal I'm not referring to political labels (I don't really like political labels) I'm referring to your apparent social and moral views. Lets not even use the word liberal anymore because it has to many different connotations attached to it. I'm not an economic liberal, but I do believe in personal freedoms. It gets confusing.

How then could you possibly advocate for the criminalization of homosexuality, even if as an alternative to a perceived inconsistency.

Madredia wrote:Anyway I'm back to the main topic, even if these camps don't work people should be allowed to attend. Its not like they're getting govt. funding. If almost everyone who went to fat camp came back still fat would you shut it down? Or better yet, why not first take all those weight loss products that don't work off the market. Or actually you know what, just go ahead and ban tarot card readings and crystal balls while you're at it.

Madredia wrote:

Leepaidamba wrote:How then could you possibly advocate for the criminalization of homosexuality, even if as an alternative to a perceived inconsistency.

I don't advocate the illegalization of homosexuality. However I do find it immoral (don't even go into attacking that belief because I'm tired of trying to defend it.)

Madredia wrote:Anyway I'm back to the main topic, even if these camps don't work people should be allowed to attend. Its not like they're getting govt. funding. If almost everyone who went to fat camp came back still fat would you shut it down? Or better yet, why not first take all those weight loss products that don't work off the market. Or actually you know what, just go ahead and ban tarot card readings and crystal balls while you're at it.

Genivaria wrote:

Madredia wrote:
Oh really, because if a 35 year old and his sister have sex thats harming children right? And by liberal I'm not referring to political labels (I don't really like political labels) I'm referring to your apparent social and moral views. Lets not even use the word liberal anymore because it has to many different connotations attached to it. I'm not an economic liberal, but I do believe in personal freedoms. It gets confusing.

No you don't. You believe in making things that harm noone illegal. You believe in restricting the rights of a minority.

Madredia wrote:

Leepaidamba wrote:How then could you possibly advocate for the criminalization of homosexuality, even if as an alternative to a perceived inconsistency.

I don't advocate the illegalization of homosexuality. However I do find it immoral (don't even go into attacking that belief because I'm tired of trying to defend it.)

Madredia wrote:

Genivaria wrote:No you don't. You believe in making things that harm noone illegal. You believe in restricting the rights of a minority.

Dude where did you get that idea! I'm not in support homosexual marriage arguments (because giving people a certificate of marriage isn't a right) but I don't believe homosexuals should have any less rights than me.

Madredia wrote:

Genivaria wrote:No you don't. You believe in making things that harm noone illegal. You believe in restricting the rights of a minority.

Dude where did you get that idea! I'm not in support homosexual marriage arguments (because giving people a certificate of marriage isn't a right) but I don't believe homosexuals should have any less rights than me.

Madredia wrote:

Leepaidamba wrote:How then could you possibly advocate for the criminalization of homosexuality, even if as an alternative to a perceived inconsistency.

I don't advocate the illegalization of homosexuality. However I do find it immoral (don't even go into attacking that belief because I'm tired of trying to defend it.)

Genivaria wrote:

Madredia wrote:Anyway I'm back to the main topic, even if these camps don't work people should be allowed to attend. Its not like they're getting govt. funding. If almost everyone who went to fat camp came back still fat would you shut it down? Or better yet, why not first take all those weight loss products that don't work off the market. Or actually you know what, just go ahead and ban tarot card readings and crystal balls while you're at it.

The difference is that "Gay Conversion" camps inflict real physical and psychological harm on the their prisoners.

Leepaidamba wrote:

Madredia wrote:
I don't advocate the illegalization of homosexuality. However I do find it immoral (don't even go into attacking that belief because I'm tired of trying to defend it.)

Have you not said that homosexuality should be illegal? Yes? I thought so.
You advocate for people to be taken away the right to have consensual sex in certain circumstances, therefore you can't say you believe in personal freedoms without adding in qualifiers.

Madredia wrote:

Genivaria wrote:The difference is that "Gay Conversion" camps inflict real physical and psychological harm on the their prisoners.

Listen to yourself. Prisoners? Camps? If a psychologist's patients are reported to have psychological problems, shut his practice down. But don't ban it across the board.

Madredia wrote:

Genivaria wrote:The difference is that "Gay Conversion" camps inflict real physical and psychological harm on the their prisoners.

Listen to yourself. Prisoners? Camps? If a psychologist's patients are reported to have psychological problems, shut his practice down. But don't ban it across the board.

Genivaria wrote:

Madredia wrote:
Dude where did you get that idea! I'm not in support homosexual marriage arguments (because giving people a certificate of marriage isn't a right) but I don't believe homosexuals should have any less rights than me.

The fact that you don't see the contradiction in that statement is rather telling.

Leepaidamba wrote:

Madredia wrote:
I don't advocate the illegalization of homosexuality. However I do find it immoral (don't even go into attacking that belief because I'm tired of trying to defend it.)

Have you not said that homosexuality should be illegal? Yes? I thought so.
You advocate for people to be taken away the right to have consensual sex in certain circumstances, therefore you can't say you believe in personal freedoms without adding in qualifiers.

The Black Forrest wrote:

Madredia wrote:
Dude where did you get that idea! I'm not in support homosexual marriage arguments (because giving people a certificate of marriage isn't a right) but I don't believe homosexuals should have any less rights than me.

That's a good start. How about a gay couple kissing in public?

Israslovakahzerbajan wrote:

Paulmania wrote:
Parents technically force their kids into everything.

Parents are the respective legal guardians of minors. They can do whatever they please to children as long as they don't disrupt their integrity as human beings.

The Black Forrest wrote:

Madredia wrote:
I don't advocate the illegalization of homosexuality. However I do find it immoral (don't even go into attacking that belief because I'm tired of trying to defend it.)

It's simple really.

Moral codes are only for ourselves. Don't expect others to follow them.

Madredia wrote:Thats fine for them. Personally I would be disgusted, but I don't have to watch.

Liriena wrote:"Gay conversion therapy" has been rejected by every single respectable psychological organization. Banning it makes perfect sense. If it is not hurtful to the individuals that are subjected to it, then it is at the very least fraud.

Paulmania wrote:there is no evidence that they harm people according to the article.

The House of Petain wrote:

Leepaidamba wrote:Have you not said that homosexuality should be illegal? Yes? I thought so.
You advocate for people to be taken away the right to have consensual sex in certain circumstances, therefore you can't say you believe in personal freedoms without adding in qualifiers.

It could be he views homosexuality as personally immoral, but believes everybody has the right to choice because his views are not everybody else's.

Zaras wrote:

Madredia wrote:
Listen to yourself. Prisoners? Camps? If a psychologist's patients are reported to have psychological problems, shut his practice down. But don't ban it across the board.

Gay conversion camps bring nothing but harm, and have had no consequences that weren't negative. Shut them all down across the board.

Madredia wrote:

Leepaidamba wrote:Have you not said that homosexuality should be illegal? Yes? I thought so.
You advocate for people to be taken away the right to have consensual sex in certain circumstances, therefore you can't say you believe in personal freedoms without adding in qualifiers.

I was merely saying it should be categorized with other sexual acts of the same kind.