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New Evidence Suggests Stone Age Europeans Discovered America

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Walden Pond
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New Evidence Suggests Stone Age Europeans Discovered America

Postby Walden Pond » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:45 am

The first people of North America were from Europe. Thousands of years later, invaders from Asia crossed the land bridge from Siberia and stole our land.

New evidence suggests Stone Age hunters from Europe discovered America
New archaeological evidence suggests that America was first discovered by Stone Age people from Europe – 10,000 years before the Siberian-originating ancestors of the American Indians set foot in the New World. A remarkable series of several dozen European-style stone tools, dating back between 19,000 and 26,000 years, have been discovered at six locations along the US east coast. Three of the sites are on the Delmarva Peninsular in Maryland, discovered by archaeologist Dr Darrin Lowery of the University of Delaware. One is in Pennsylvania and another in Virginia. A sixth was discovered by scallop-dredging fishermen on the seabed 60 miles from the Virginian coast on what, in prehistoric times, would have been dry land.


Does this information change how you view race relations in North America? How you view the "Native Americans" and "First Nations"?

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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:48 am

I can't say I think anything differently about the Native Americans. Not sure why I would.
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Tubbsalot
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Postby Tubbsalot » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:49 am

I'm so glad this thread turned out to be about how white people are genetically superior.
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Meowfoundland
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Postby Meowfoundland » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:49 am

I view them exactly the same as I did before. Why should my views change?
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Walden Pond
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Postby Walden Pond » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:51 am

Tubbsalot wrote:I'm so glad this thread turned out to be about how white people are genetically superior.
No one mentioned anything about genetics.

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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:52 am

Tubbsalot wrote:I'm so glad this thread turned out to be about how white people are genetically superior.

Course we are. We invented genetics such that we would be. We're tricky like that.
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Walden Pond
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Postby Walden Pond » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:52 am

Meowfoundland wrote:I view them exactly the same as I did before. Why should my views change?
Because they're not the first people in America, they came to America and genocided the Native white people.

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Tubbsalot
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Postby Tubbsalot » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:53 am

Walden Pond wrote:No one mentioned anything about genetics.

No, but you did mention that the natives stole the rightfully earned land of the hardworking Europeans, and from there I can make some inferences.

And I think I will.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:54 am

Walden Pond wrote:
Meowfoundland wrote:I view them exactly the same as I did before. Why should my views change?
Because they're not the first people in America, they came to America and genocided the Native white people.

Hahaha. Yeah buddy, the presence of some ancient European style tools in North America proves that the people who made and used them were destroyed by genocide.
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Meowfoundland
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Postby Meowfoundland » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:54 am

Walden Pond wrote:
Meowfoundland wrote:I view them exactly the same as I did before. Why should my views change?
Because they're not the first people in America, they came to America and genocided the Native white people.

Why do you assume they were "genocided"? Could they not have just been out competed?
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Saint Jade IV
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Postby Saint Jade IV » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:55 am

I'm confused about what impact this discovery should have on the way I view the shocking treatment of the Native Americans by the colonists.
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Walden Pond
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Postby Walden Pond » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:55 am

Ifreann wrote:
Walden Pond wrote:Because they're not the first people in America, they came to America and genocided the Native white people.

Hahaha. Yeah buddy, the presence of some ancient European style tools in North America proves that the people who made and used them were destroyed by genocide.
As a result of these factors the Solutrean (European originating) Native Americans were either partly absorbed by the newcomers or were substantially obliterated by them either physically or through competition for resources.

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Meowfoundland
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Postby Meowfoundland » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:58 am

Saint Jade IV wrote:I'm confused about what impact this discovery should have on the way I view the shocking treatment of the Native Americans by the colonists.

Don'tcha know? The possible maybe in the distant past actions of a group of people negates their descendants' suffering.
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Walden Pond
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Postby Walden Pond » Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:03 am

Tubbsalot wrote:
Walden Pond wrote:No one mentioned anything about genetics.

No, but you did mention that the natives stole the rightfully earned land of the hardworking Europeans, and from there I can make some inferences.

And I think I will.
what does that have to do with anyone being "genetically superior"? What does that even mean?

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Saint Jade IV
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Postby Saint Jade IV » Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:04 am

Meowfoundland wrote:
Saint Jade IV wrote:I'm confused about what impact this discovery should have on the way I view the shocking treatment of the Native Americans by the colonists.

Don'tcha know? The possible maybe in the distant past actions of a group of people negates their descendants' suffering.


No I didn't. Silly me.
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It's my estimation that every man ever got a statue made of him was one kind of son of a b*tch or another.
Nothing sucks more than that moment during an argument when you realise you're wrong.
Whenever someone says "I'm not book smart, but I'm street smart", all I hear is "I'm not real smart, but I'm imaginary smart".

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Postby The Matthew Islands » Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:06 am

God damn immigrants Teking our jerbs even the stone age.
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Postby Conserative Morality » Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:08 am

My views are exactly the same. Vae Victis, etc etc.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:09 am

Walden Pond wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Hahaha. Yeah buddy, the presence of some ancient European style tools in North America proves that the people who made and used them were destroyed by genocide.
As a result of these factors the Solutrean (European originating) Native Americans were either partly absorbed by the newcomers or were substantially obliterated by them either physically or through competition for resources.

So you agree that you were mistaken to assume that genocide occurred. Excellent.
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Tagmatium
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Postby Tagmatium » Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:11 am

It's 19,000 - 26,000 years ago.

It basically only truly affects the academic side - which does mean it is pretty interesting.

It shouldn't - unless you're a crazy - affect how anyone views Native Americans.
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Saint Jade IV
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Postby Saint Jade IV » Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:14 am

Ifreann wrote:
Walden Pond wrote:

So you agree that you were mistaken to assume that genocide occurred. Excellent.

I was actually thinking this.
When you grow up, your heart dies.
It's my estimation that every man ever got a statue made of him was one kind of son of a b*tch or another.
Nothing sucks more than that moment during an argument when you realise you're wrong.
Whenever someone says "I'm not book smart, but I'm street smart", all I hear is "I'm not real smart, but I'm imaginary smart".

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Alyakia
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Postby Alyakia » Thu Mar 01, 2012 7:13 am

who gives a shit and what practical purpose does this ha-

oh

it's about marginalizing native americans?

cool
Grammar is a tool of the bourgeoisie and most attempts to police it by self-professed "grammar nazis" are little more than thinly veiled drops of pseudo-intellectualism mired in the sentiments of classism and racism designed to marginalize and hand-wave the opinions of groups that lack the ability to or refuse to express themselves in a nice little pre-approved format or were born into an area or socio-economic/racial/cultural group who are, along with their dialect, considered to be "unintelligent" and not worthy of proper respect. Such attempts to bully said groups out of expressing themselves are intolerable and therefore, to that extent, I have decided to make my posts the vanguard for the liberation of language from elitism.

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Alyakia
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Postby Alyakia » Thu Mar 01, 2012 7:16 am

Conserative Morality wrote:My views are exactly the same. Vae Victis, etc etc.

I'm going to either 1) kidnap you and bring you to my house and put you in a time machine and send you back and get the romans to do horrible horrible things to you or 2) make us both live forever, wait until your nation falls in power and then get someone to invade and stamp on your face forever while reading this post back at you.


There's a secret third option with American fascists, but that's not important. Do you have any paticular option you prefer or?

e: did you get that from the wiki or from playing too much legacy of kain. i won't judge you.

e2: well i might need to find some other posts to make it more appropiate

e3: obviously i prefer the roman option (this is secretely still only the second edit shh)
Last edited by Alyakia on Thu Mar 01, 2012 7:21 am, edited 2 times in total.
Grammar is a tool of the bourgeoisie and most attempts to police it by self-professed "grammar nazis" are little more than thinly veiled drops of pseudo-intellectualism mired in the sentiments of classism and racism designed to marginalize and hand-wave the opinions of groups that lack the ability to or refuse to express themselves in a nice little pre-approved format or were born into an area or socio-economic/racial/cultural group who are, along with their dialect, considered to be "unintelligent" and not worthy of proper respect. Such attempts to bully said groups out of expressing themselves are intolerable and therefore, to that extent, I have decided to make my posts the vanguard for the liberation of language from elitism.

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Republic of Tropical Partiers
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Postby Republic of Tropical Partiers » Thu Mar 01, 2012 7:18 am

Walden Pond wrote:The first people of North America were from Europe. Thousands of years later, invaders from Asia crossed the land bridge from Siberia and stole our land.

New evidence suggests Stone Age hunters from Europe discovered America
New archaeological evidence suggests that America was first discovered by Stone Age people from Europe – 10,000 years before the Siberian-originating ancestors of the American Indians set foot in the New World. A remarkable series of several dozen European-style stone tools, dating back between 19,000 and 26,000 years, have been discovered at six locations along the US east coast. Three of the sites are on the Delmarva Peninsular in Maryland, discovered by archaeologist Dr Darrin Lowery of the University of Delaware. One is in Pennsylvania and another in Virginia. A sixth was discovered by scallop-dredging fishermen on the seabed 60 miles from the Virginian coast on what, in prehistoric times, would have been dry land.


Does this information change how you view race relations in North America? How you view the "Native Americans" and "First Nations"?

? I thought the Clovis's where destroy by natural climate change?
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Postby Southern Patriots » Thu Mar 01, 2012 7:26 am

Meowfoundland wrote:
Walden Pond wrote:Because they're not the first people in America, they came to America and genocided the Native white people.

Why do you assume they were "genocided"? Could they not have just been out competed?

"Genocided" is the term that replaced "out competed" in studies of this nature. Clearly.
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Postby Nazis in Space » Thu Mar 01, 2012 7:33 am

  • New evidence? First citation I can find concerning the solutrean hypothesis dates to the 1950s
  • Back then, the evidence amounted to the same thing mentioned in the OP - tools remarkably reminiscent of (But not entirely identical with, and a few thousand years after) solutrean tools in Europe - were found in North America (Clovis technology), very much distinct from the tools found in siberia, from where colonisation of the Americas was supposed to have occured
  • However, nobody took the hypothesis seriously, since, you know... Sometimes technologies are invented in more than one place. Atlatls, bow & arrow, bronze... All were developed independently from each other in several different places (Old- as well as new world, to be specific). So why not clovis/ solutrean tools? Especially considering the whole 'Atlantic' deal in the way between Europe and North America. With an icesheet to follow, admittedly, but still. Independent development seems a tad more likely
  • This changed in the 2000s, when genetic markers (Haplogroups, I think? Too lazy to look up the details right now. Ask one of the resident archaeologists) were found among native americans, dating back to upwards of 10000 years ago, and related to European sources, which suddenly gave the solutrean hypothesis some validity. The genes in question must've got there somehow, after all
  • But of course, the whole 'Crossing the atlantic along the ice sheet over ten thousand years before the first paleo-eskimo cultures popped up, and on the other side of the northern hemisphere to boot?' made some people wonder, and thus more detailed analysis occured, which promptly found out that the 'European' genetic markers found among natives dating to these times were actually even more closely related to some altaic people - which opened up the possibility that the marker made it to north america with the general bering strait (Or previous coastal) migration while the now-rudimentary altaic people in question were still inhabiting the majority of northern asia. Which seems just a tad more likely than the solutrean hypothesis
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