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The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

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Evil Wolf
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The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Evil Wolf » Thu Jun 11, 2009 9:55 pm

Hello, hello. I, as a player, am very aware of the time Nationstates updates. For all those not in the know when NS updates you get new issues, the WA World Census and rankings are updated and, most importantly for the way I like to play the game, the delegacy is changed at said time.

Now, it should be said, I consider myself a player in the vast raider/defender “mini-game” that is contained within NS. We raiders and defenders had long been used to the update time that was traditionally 1-2 AM EST USA (that’s GTM -5) however, over the past few months we having been having to deal with an update that occurs at 4 AM EST. I know that the Brits and the Euros must love this time and the Aussies probably don’t care because update has always been in the PM for them but those living in the Americas *hate* this update time.

I have known many players who have simply given up on the raiding/defending mini-game completely and even quit the game because of this time slot. Its ungodly late and since most operations are carried out close to update to avoid being spotted by the other side this update time has put a very large kink in the way we do things.

So my question is to the mods and the great ADMIN, wherever he may be, what can be done about this issue so we can go back to the way things were?
Kryozerkia wrote:In the good old days raiding was illegal and players who formed the Black Hawk would've seen the underside of the mod's iron boot.
Crazy Girl wrote:Invading was never illegal

Mallorea and Riva should be a Game Moderator.

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Erastide
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Erastide » Thu Jun 11, 2009 9:56 pm

Come on Wolfie, ask for more than the way it was, ask for primetime America and be greedy. :p

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Evil Wolf
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Evil Wolf » Thu Jun 11, 2009 9:59 pm

Nah, then the Euros would be all annoyed. :p

I just want it so that update isn't in the dead of the night for a good chunk of the player base.
Kryozerkia wrote:In the good old days raiding was illegal and players who formed the Black Hawk would've seen the underside of the mod's iron boot.
Crazy Girl wrote:Invading was never illegal

Mallorea and Riva should be a Game Moderator.

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Kharkistania
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Kharkistania » Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:02 pm

Agreed, 5 or so hours earlier, give or take, would be fantastic. :)

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TannerFrankLand
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby TannerFrankLand » Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:03 pm

Evil Wolf wrote:Nah, then the Euros would be all annoyed. :p

I just want it so that update isn't in the dead of the night for a good chunk of the player base.

If it was earlier raiding/defending would be easier... wouldn't that take the fun out of it?

Is really frightened that it would make raiding go out of control.
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Evil Wolf
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Evil Wolf » Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:04 pm

Do tell :p

Also it was fun when I could raid and still get sleep. Never sleeping because the update is at *4 AM* is not fun at all.
Last edited by Evil Wolf on Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Kryozerkia wrote:In the good old days raiding was illegal and players who formed the Black Hawk would've seen the underside of the mod's iron boot.
Crazy Girl wrote:Invading was never illegal

Mallorea and Riva should be a Game Moderator.

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Israel Territories
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Israel Territories » Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:06 pm

Even though I hate Evil Wolf, I agree. :p

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Todd McCloud
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Todd McCloud » Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:10 pm

Evil Wolf wrote:Hello, hello. I, as a player, am very aware of the time Nationstates updates. For all those not in the know when NS updates you get new issues, the WA World Census and rankings are updated and, most importantly for the way I like to play the game, the delegacy is changed at said time.

Now, it should be said, I consider myself a player in the vast raider/defender “mini-game” that is contained within NS. We raiders and defenders had long been used to the update time that was traditionally 1-2 AM EST USA (that’s GTM -5) however, over the past few months we having been having to deal with an update that occurs at 4 AM EST. I know that the Brits and the Euros must love this time and the Aussies probably don’t care because update has always been in the PM for them but those living in the Americas *hate* this update time.

I have known many players who have simply given up on the raiding/defending mini-game completely and even quit the game because of this time slot. Its ungodly late and since most operations are carried out close to update to avoid being spotted by the other side this update time has put a very large kink in the way we do things.

So my question is to the mods and the great ADMIN, wherever he may be, what can be done about this issue so we can go back to the way things were?

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Marcuslandia
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Marcuslandia » Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:11 pm

A set update time will inevitably favor some few while being disadvantageous to many others. How is that fair?

As a simulation of the Real World (to a very slight degree) how often do large-scale invaders KNOW the exact moment major changes occur?

How about randomizing the update time for every region, every day? As long as there is one update between 12 a.m. and 11:59 p.m., over the course of a year, everything averages out.

With absolutely no way of knowing when a given region will update, no one is forced to get up in the middle of the night to launch an invasion or defend against one. Makes it more realistic. Instead of only being concerned for a half-hour or so, everybody could get paranoid all day long!

Seriously. It's about the only way to put EVERYBODY on an equal footing.
Last edited by Marcuslandia on Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Evil Wolf
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Evil Wolf » Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:15 pm

Oh I'm totally for making it completely random but I just suspect that changing it back to the way it was just a few months ago would be easier for the great ADMIN is all.
Kryozerkia wrote:In the good old days raiding was illegal and players who formed the Black Hawk would've seen the underside of the mod's iron boot.
Crazy Girl wrote:Invading was never illegal

Mallorea and Riva should be a Game Moderator.

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TannerFrankLand
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby TannerFrankLand » Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:39 pm

Is there a reason the time is every 24 hours? I mean if it was made 23 hours between updates the update time would change by one hour everyday. So tonight it may be midnight, but tomorrow it will be 11pm, and then 10, that way everyone would get an update time... seems fair to me...

I like the random idea, but it sounds to complicated...
Last edited by TannerFrankLand on Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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[violet]
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby [violet] » Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:58 pm

The reason daily updates happen at the LEAST CONVENIENT TIME FOR EVERYBODY is I deliberately picked our period of lowest traffic load. Daily updates are fairly server-intensive, so we schedule them for when the least number of people are playing.

The thing is, though, we have a honking great new server, and I suspect we can now do daily updates any time we like without slowing things down. We can probably even do full daily updates twice a day, so Delegates would be elected every 12 hours, not 24.

What say you: would that be good?

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Marcuslandia
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Marcuslandia » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:00 pm

TannerFrankLand wrote:Is there a reason the time is every 24 hours? I mean if it was made 23 hours between updates the update time would change by one hour everyday. So tonight it may be midnight, but tomorrow it will be 11pm, and then 10, that way everyone would get an update time... seems fair to me...

I like the random idea, but it sounds to complicated...


A less-than-24-hour cycle would eventually result in two updates in one day.

Not all that complicated. The program is tied to a clock. One line of code tells the program to update at XX:XX:XX. In place of that one line of code, you could insert about 6 lines that create a time random number generator. As the program works through the sequence it hits the line that presently says, "Update at XX:XX:XX." When the clock hits that time, the update occurs and the the next block of code says, "Update next at (time calculated by random number generator)."

The bother is that at present, updates are coded by region, of which there are about 6,000. The program change could be a template, but it still would have to be written into each of the 6,000 regions.

But then ANY change would have to be done for each region. One of the reasons programmers aren't hot to change thing unless the change is really, really great or really, really necessary.

[Did I get that anywhere close to right?]
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TannerFrankLand
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby TannerFrankLand » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:01 pm

[violet] wrote:The reason daily updates happen at the LEAST CONVENIENT TIME FOR EVERYBODY is I deliberately picked our period of lowest traffic load. Daily updates are fairly server-intensive, so we schedule them for when the least number of people are playing.

The thing is, though, we have a honking great new server, and I suspect we can now do daily updates any time we like without slowing things down. We can probably even do full daily updates twice a day, so Delegates would be elected every 12 hours, not 24.

What say you: would that be good?

1) That wouldn't solve the fact that the wolf guy still has to be up very late...

2) I don't care that would ROCK!!! :bow: :bow:




Marcuslandia, your probably right, I know nothing about Computers, so a solution that sounds like common sense to me may be completely unrealistic for a computer person.
Last edited by TannerFrankLand on Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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SC #3 ~ Condemn Nazi Europe [SORRY!]
SC #12 ~ Commend Todd McCloud
SC #18 ~ Commend Sedgistan
SC #27 ~ Condemn Unknown
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SC #51 ~ Commend Fudgetopia
SC #67 ~ Commend Naivetry
SC #71 ~ Repeal Condemn Unknown.
WA General Assembly:
GA #81 ~ Disaster Preparedness Act
GA #105 ~ Preparing For Disasters
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Hadisthe
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Hadisthe » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:02 pm

[violet] wrote:The reason daily updates happen at the LEAST CONVENIENT TIME FOR EVERYBODY is I deliberately picked our period of lowest traffic load. Daily updates are fairly server-intensive, so we schedule them for when the least number of people are playing.

The thing is, though, we have a honking great new server, and I suspect we can now do daily updates any time we like without slowing things down. We can probably even do full daily updates twice a day, so Delegates would be elected every 12 hours, not 24.

What say you: would that be good?


Nay! A single update at a slightly earlier time!

Mini-updates for issues are fine, but two updates would ruin errthang.

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[violet]
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby [violet] » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:02 pm

Marcuslandia wrote:Did I get that anywhere close to right?]

No, but it was kinda funny. :)

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Marcuslandia
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Marcuslandia » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:07 pm

[violet] wrote:
Marcuslandia wrote:Did I get that anywhere close to right?]

No, but it was kinda funny. :)


Glad I could make your day, er, um, night? (Given the Internet, you could be _anywhere_ so.....)

Ow. Might head is hurting again! [sniffle]

:lol:

[It was FORTRAN IV programming, almost 40 years ago. Haven't a clue about today's programming.]
Last edited by Marcuslandia on Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Evil Wolf
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Evil Wolf » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:08 pm

[violet] wrote:The thing is, though, we have a honking great new server, and I suspect we can now do daily updates any time we like without slowing things down. We can probably even do full daily updates twice a day, so Delegates would be elected every 12 hours, not 24.


I think I love you. :p
Kryozerkia wrote:In the good old days raiding was illegal and players who formed the Black Hawk would've seen the underside of the mod's iron boot.
Crazy Girl wrote:Invading was never illegal

Mallorea and Riva should be a Game Moderator.

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Spartzerina
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Spartzerina » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:19 pm

[violet] wrote:The thing is, though, we have a honking great new server, and I suspect we can now do daily updates any time we like without slowing things down. We can probably even do full daily updates twice a day, so Delegates would be elected every 12 hours, not 24.

What say you: would that be good?

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Todd McCloud
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Todd McCloud » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:19 pm

[violet] wrote:The reason daily updates happen at the LEAST CONVENIENT TIME FOR EVERYBODY is I deliberately picked our period of lowest traffic load. Daily updates are fairly server-intensive, so we schedule them for when the least number of people are playing.

The thing is, though, we have a honking great new server, and I suspect we can now do daily updates any time we like without slowing things down. We can probably even do full daily updates twice a day, so Delegates would be elected every 12 hours, not 24.

What say you: would that be good?

Yeah, that works for me
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Marcuslandia
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Marcuslandia » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:24 pm

Two is better than one. (More is better than less.) [Still would prefer random, though.]
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Naivetry
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Naivetry » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:28 pm

Marcuslandia wrote:With absolutely no way of knowing when a given region will update, no one is forced to get up in the middle of the night to launch an invasion or defend against one. Makes it more realistic. Instead of only being concerned for a half-hour or so, everybody could get paranoid all day long!

Seriously. It's about the only way to put EVERYBODY on an equal footing.

This would give even more of an advantage to the raiders in a game that tipped decisively in their favor with the invention of Influence. Raiders can always get together and plan when they're going to try a raid. They might get the random update time wrong, but they would all have moved together. Defenders would have to be ready constantly both to spot such movement and to respond with equal force. We (defenders) do not have the manpower (or, frankly, the willpower these days) to impose a 24-7 watch on NS. We can barely get people to track events around update.

Imagine trying to play a basketball game where the baskets moved to different places on the court every 2 seconds, and you'll get some idea of what a randomized update would be like.

In addition, liberations would be impossible - just a crap shoot, and not dependent on skill, dedication, or planning in any way. "Pile into the region... you might get lucky this time" - it would completely destroy the military game.

And liberations are already and always have been incredibly weighted towards the raider side...

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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Allrule » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:31 pm

[violet] wrote:The reason daily updates happen at the LEAST CONVENIENT TIME FOR EVERYBODY is I deliberately picked our period of lowest traffic load. Daily updates are fairly server-intensive, so we schedule them for when the least number of people are playing.

The thing is, though, we have a honking great new server, and I suspect we can now do daily updates any time we like without slowing things down. We can probably even do full daily updates twice a day, so Delegates would be elected every 12 hours, not 24.

What say you: would that be good?

:bow: :bow: :bow: This suggestion=win.
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Naivetry
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Naivetry » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:32 pm

[violet] wrote:The thing is, though, we have a honking great new server, and I suspect we can now do daily updates any time we like without slowing things down. We can probably even do full daily updates twice a day, so Delegates would be elected every 12 hours, not 24.

What say you: would that be good?

No. It would be an utter nightmare.

It's perfectly fine for the raiders - they get to pick and choose when they want to be active. Defenders would effectively have their workload doubled, and we're already (not to put too fine a point on it) utterly failing at spotting and preventing raids for lack of motivated players.

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Kandarin
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Re: The Update Time Makes Me Wanna Cry

Postby Kandarin » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:38 pm

What Naivetry said.

And if you think it's bad for defenders, that doesn't hold a candle to how bad it would be for all the neutral/RP/etc. regions that are getting raided. Right now, invaders expect them to be on at update to keep watch every day if they're going to survive. Make it twice a day, and that'll become even more impossible. A single update at a slightly earlier time is more practical for everyone.
Last edited by Kandarin on Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:40 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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