Europeia Embassy

[Onderkelkia]

I am also nobody's attack dog, but thanks. Albion citizens actually have their own opinions and express them as they wish.

I have not made any comment or implication linking your position in Albion to your remarks in this thread, as anyone who reads my above post can see.

I therefore do not understand, on any level, this part of your post. Please tell me what you are referring to.

Odd that such a concept seems strange enough to you to warrant harassment of our citizens.

Once again, I am forced to ask: What are you talking about?

I haven't spoken to any Albion citizens, who aren't also citizens of the LKE or Europeia, since this statement was released. Similarly, in no conversations, since the statement was released, with LKE-Albion or Albion-Europeia dual citizens, has Albion's position on this matter come up. What is this about?

390 words, 2339 characters, and you say nothing that hasn't been previously explained to you here or elsewhere.

Whereas I have previously explained all the points you have made (with the exception of those on Albion) to you here or elsewhere.

We disagree on these issues, hence why we are debating them. If you don't want to debate them, you don't have to post.

The length of my posts is entirely proportionate to the nature of the discussion and responses, which is spread over multiple tangents and points.

Ah, but the difference is what I'm saying /is/ the reality! You know, rather than your wishful thinking, which is the basis for the nonsense you repeat like a broken record. The LKE violated the rules, because admin says so. Admin rulings /are/ reality on this board.

Your position can be summed up as saying that the moderators are inherently right. It is no criticism of the moderators to say that is nonsense.

No human authority's judgments of any situation are, by virtue of being that authority's opinion alone, the actual reality of the situation.

Admin rulings are an assessment of what happened; they do not themselves constitute "reality on this board", which is what actually happened, rather than anyone's assessment. Admin rulings are an authoritative assessment from the ruling body, but that doesn't mean they are automatically correct.

The fact you are falling back on this, rather than discussing the merits of the matter, is telling.

It really isn't naive, and certainly not "in the extreme" to imagine that not everyone sees game in your rather narrow way, and to say otherwise demonstrates a ridiculous amount of arrogance on your part to be honest. Not everyone sees this game or wants to play like you Onderkelkia. Hell, in fact, the majority don't! If that fact is lost on you then I really can't help you with that.

Believing in the existence of gameplay politics, and that crippling the LKE and TBR has an impact on it, does not constitute arrogance.

This has nothing to do with how you want to play the game or not. I have no objection to how you want to play the game. The argument is about your assessment of gameplay politics, whether or not you wish to partake in it. The point is that there is a disproportionate impact on one side of gameplay.

The fact that others have noticed that impact is illustrated by the fact that your first reply in this thread on this issue wasn't directed to me.

Any impact it might have said, which you assert without evidence, is irrelevant. Balancing the sides in r/d shouldn't factor into these decisions.

Imposing sanctions on regions rather than individuals draws moderators into targeting groups and that inevitably involves crossover into gameplay politics.

From a policy perspective, it is undesirable for the moderators to be involved in gameplay politics, which targeting groups of players means that they do.

So the point is that the entire approach of targeting regions and individuals risks creating such impacts.

You have not "comprehensively rebutted" anything, despite the sheer volume of words you have published on this subject.

You are entitled to that view.

However, to return to the example I gave in my previous post, one of the features which a moderator drew attention to, in their attempt to justify targeting the LKE specifically, was whether the LKE should have known from analysing the number of telegrams blocked shown on the telegram API statistics. The telegram API statistics showed a figure was perfectly consistent with additional manual recruitment rather than automated recruitment.

There doesn't need to be a distinguishing factor right now because these are the first cases of it. <_< The distinguishing will become relevant in future cases where admin will look at specific context decide a judgment based on that instead of simply applying this one based on precedent. Not sure if you are incapable of grasping this or just repeatedly sidestepping.

If you are, from the outset, saying that the principle decided upon in a particular case should not be used as precedent, then you should say why you are nonetheless applying the principle in that case and that will, in essence, provide the criterion on which future cases can be distinguished upon.

It is, of course, possible and common to distinguish cases subsequently, but if you are from the outset seeking to make a narrow ruling, the decision should be accordingly specific. Otherwise, you are simply making a broad ruling and saying whether or not it applies depends on however the decision-maker feels.

Here, the moderators have, as you have said, stressed that it should not necessarily be used as precedent in the future. In which case, the obvious question is, why use this principle in this case and how do you anticipate future cases may differ? That is not an at all unreasonable question to ask.

They don't regard this as a precedent to strictly apply. Cases will be assessed on an individual basis. That doesn't mean the same judgment won't be applied if deemed appropriate. So very simple.

I'm sorry, but it's not that simple. On what factors will the assessment be made? Why and where would this course of action be deemed appropriate?

If you are defending their action by pointing out that they need not follow the same course of action in the future if they deem it problematic in the future, then it is perfectly fair to consider why the principle is being applied in this case and why this case is not considered problematic, when one considers the injustice faced by the LKE of being punished very severely for what it did not do, either as an in-game entity or as a collective group of players.

[Ambroscus Koth]

I am also nobody's attack dog, but thanks. Albion citizens actually have their own opinions and express them as they wish.

I have not made any comment or implication linking your position in Albion to your remarks in this thread, as anyone who reads my above post can see.

I therefore do not understand, on any level, this part of your post. Please tell me what you are referring to.

Guilty conscience, Onder.

[Consular]

I have not made any comment or implication linking your position in Albion to your remarks in this thread, as anyone who reads my above post can see.

I therefore do not understand, on any level, this part of your post. Please tell me what you are referring to.

Guilty conscience, Onder.

Oh let's not play coy. You sent a private message to a government member of Albion, /telling/ them to /tell/ our King to muzzle some Albion citizens from partaking in their right to freedom of speech.

There are so many things wrong with that.

Whether in response to this thread or other comments the tone of the message was thoroughly inappropriate, as was what it was insinuating, and what it was /telling/ us to do.

The rest of your post takes us in circles so addressing it wouldn't get us anywhere.

[RiderSyl]

Oh let's not play coy. You sent a private message to a government member of Albion, /telling/ them to /tell/ our King to muzzle some Albion citizens from partaking in their right to freedom of speech.

Sounds like a great story for an Imperialist tabloid, Consular.

[Onderkelkia]

Guilty conscience, Onder.

Oh let's not play coy. You sent a private message to a government member of Albion, /telling/ them to /tell/ our King to muzzle some Albion citizens from partaking in their right to freedom of speech.

This is simply untrue.

I have not sent any private messages to any government members of Albion since March, let alone a message requesting they don't talk about this.

Recently, the only Albion government member I have had any non-public contact with is Christopher Bishop, on Skype, not private messages. Moreover, no request to gag anyone was submitted in any of those conversations (unless you count objecting to Joshua IX's choice of nation names with the word 'Onder').

Whom exactly am I meant to have messaged and when exactly did I message them?

Whether in response to this thread or other comments the tone of the message was thoroughly inappropriate, as was what it was insinuating, and what it was /telling/ us to do.

The tone of the message cannot have been been making inappropriate insinuations about Albion because there was never any such message.

That is simpIy because I haven't contacted anyone in Albion after this thread was started.

Shortly before the thread was started, as indicated above, I did speak with Christopher Bishop on Skype, but that was to enquire as to whether he could ask whether Albion was to join our other allies in signing it; it made no request to gag anyone, it was only concerned with Albion's official position (nothing to do with Albion citizens' views), it bears no resemblance to what you are describing and I am happy to publish the full log of the conversation if you wish.

[Christopher Bishop]

I made a one off comment as a joke, which was taken too far. This is referring to the attack dog comment that Consular was referring to. Onder talked to me earlier and it was only to ask about Albion's support on the statement that was released. He was his respectful self during the conversation.

[Consular]

Okay, it appears our own Director of Intelligence of all people deliberately misrepresented something you said to provoke a reaction from me. As to why he thought that was a good idea I have no fucking clue. Incredible, really.

I sincerely apologise for my accusation and my general aggressive tone, it was apparently entirely baseless.

Drama llamas be rampaging right now.

[Alabaster Isles]

We've been a little over excited with the new outlook we are currently progressing through. (Including the light-hearted trolling of one another.) It would seem this has filtered through to the Gameplay forums somewhere along the lines.

While it's obvious Albion has sided with the mods on this particular incident, no ill intent was, is or has been purposely intended against the LKE and their point of view regarding these unfortunate circumstances.

[King HEM]

Invader regions who haven't violated the rules are free to continue much as they have done. This isn't even remotely about r/d and r/d balance doesn't factor into it at all.

The mods have also already said their judgment is not precedent on this, each case may be completely different. It's like some of you people don't read.

Hi, I don't think we've met before!

I think were your judgment errs here, is assuming that SAYING something makes it so. You can say "this action has is giving us no precedent" for the future, but the action itself is creating the precedent. If a similar situation occurs, let's say three years from now, like it or not, the moderators will look to this past sanction as an example. They may use this experience as a guide of what NOT to do (which is what I would hope), but regardless it has set a precedent for future actions.

We've been a little over excited with the new outlook we are currently progressing through. (Including the light-hearted trolling of one another.) It would seem this has filtered through to the Gameplay forums somewhere along the lines.

[Consular]

I think were your judgment errs here, is assuming that SAYING something makes it so. You can say "this action has is giving us no precedent" for the future, but the action itself is creating the precedent. If a similar situation occurs, let's say three years from now, like it or not, the moderators will look to this past sanction as an example. They may use this experience as a guide of what NOT to do (which is what I would hope), but regardless it has set a precedent for future actions.

I don't think it an error in judgment to interpret Sedge and [violet] literally when they say this decision is not to be a strictly applied precedent for future cases. It's all about application and process, how a decision is reached, not just the end result - very similar to modern legal precedent in that way. The only precedent created here is that admin/mods will look at specific context of a situation and issue a ruling based on that, rather than imposing hard (and unavoidably vague given this is new territory, therefore difficult to enforce) guidelines as to what will and will not warrant a certain punishment.

[Onderkelkia]

It's all about application and process, how a decision is reached, not just the end result - very similar to modern legal precedent in that way.

Actually, stare decisis is very much about the "what" rather than the "how" of a judgment - the "what" being the decision on the legal issues involved, rather than the outcome as applied to the facts, obviously. As with the occasion when you were bringing the rule of strict liability into an earlier discussion on the recruitment block and suggesting that the moderators regarded illegal recruitment as a strict liability offence, as if that was an answer to my contention that there was no conduct element on the part of the LKE itself, I see no reason to assume any similarities between the moderators' decisions and RL law.

Indeed, unlike RL legal processes (in liberal democracies anyway), the presumption of innocence, for crying out loud, has gone out of the window here.

The only precedent created here is that admin/mods will look at specific context of a situation and issue a ruling based on that, rather than imposing hard (and unavoidably vague given this is new territory, therefore difficult to enforce) guidelines as to what will and will not warrant a certain punishment.

In reality, that's not a precedent at all. It has no bearing on decisions on the substance of the issue.

Instead, it is the active avoidance of creating any actual rule for deciding these kinds of cases.

Which returns to my point: If the decision is so unsound that the moderators refuse to identify any specific principle, then why apply it here? In what ways would the contexts in future cases differ from what the context here that would justify a different outcome without it being completely arbitrary?

[The Agnostic Collective]

In the end, this entire thread will achieve nothing. Sure, you can keep it up, at least the LKE is persistent, but if you're hoping the mods will change their mind, then keep dreaming. You should be more like DEN and take it like a man (even if you're not a man )

[Ambrella]

Folks, I'd prefer not to have Europeia's allies arguing in our embassy, if at all possible.

...and a picture of a llama is not much of an apology.

[Alabaster Isles]

For the sake of clarity, the llama wasn't intended as part of the apology. I'm not entirely sure how it appears as such exactly. Nonetheless, it was merely a response to Consular's reference to rampaging drama llamas. Because indeed, that's how they'd look.

[Anumia]

Supreme Chancellors

• HEM
• Lethen
• Mousebumples (Vice-Chancellor)

World Assembly Delegate

• Mousebumples
• Fajihas(Deputy-Delegate)

Executive

• President - Writinglegend
• Vice-President - Calvin Coolidge
• Grand Admiral - Kraketopia
• Foreign Affairs - Starstream Tribe
• Citizenship Integration - Drecq
• Regional Recruitment - Fortunado
• Culture - Cassy Styles Anumia
• Communications - Sopo
• Attorney General - Malashaan

Legislative

• Speaker - HEM
• Senators - HEM, Brunhilde, Kraketopia, Drecq, zapperzx, Shadowlurker
• Citizens' Assembly Chair - Fortunado

Judicial

• Chief Justice - Drecq
• Associate Justices - Pope Lexus X, Kraketopia, Vacant

50th Senate!

Very recently, Europeia held elections for its 50th Senate. Before the election, there was a festival to commerate our 50th Senate. Europeia has come a long way since the very first Senate and it is truly a landmark achievement. A wide variety of awards were given out to Senators of past and present - a full list of awardees can be heard at the link below.

http://mixlr.com/ebc-radio/showreel/senate-awards-announcements/

Following the festival, elections were held for the 50th Senate. 10 candidates ran for a total of six seats. This election featured a lot of newcomers as well as a few experienced old hands. In the end, the elected Senate was HEM, Brunhilde, Kraketopia, Drecq, zapperzx, and Shadowlurker. This is a mix of experienced as well as slightly newer Senators. This Senate is now hard at work, with HEM returning to the helm as the new Speaker.

---

War Games: A Postive Step

A Mixlr Supplement to Notty Talk 009

War Games with EPSA
On June 7 Grand Admiral Kraketopia of the Europeian Rebpublican Navy (ERN) and Erelim General of the East Pacific Sovereignty Army (ESPA) Xoriet came together in a first for both regions to host their own war games.

There were four objectives in total, each side had to try and take the same region and scored points based on the amount of nations in the objective and who took it. Each side also took turns defending a region against the other side's invading force. Finally, there was a competition that tested the reaction times of each side, scoring points for the number of nations in the objective and being penalized for going too early. In total the EPSA won two of the objectives; the ERN won one of the objectives, and one was considered to be a draw.

"The War Games with the EPSA were a great way to bond with the members of the EPSA, as well as drill different military skillsets in a fun, competitive environment," said Kraketopia while discussing the benefits of War Games. "I look forward to hosting more War Games with TEP and other regions as well."

The Benefit
War games provide excellent training for all involved whether it be learning new things or drilling in already known tactics. Many different situations in such a short space of time requires service-members to think and act quickly to be able to succeed. Practicing such war games will in the long run will help the ERN. War games don't just help to learn and hone military tactics but they also help to strengthen bonds between regions. Recently there has been an increase in diplomatic activity between Europeia and TEP, and state visits and these games have undoubtedly helped to improve Europeia's relationship with TEP.

New skills are developed for those who participated. "It was certainly a good way of honing jump timing and coordination," said Mate CptCarrot of the ERN, who participated in the war games. "It also helped me realize the importance of precise timing."

Servicemembers worked on a variety of skills at the war games, such as triggering, jumping, raiding, and defending. "Defending was the hardest part," said President Writinglegend. "I've never participated in a "proper defense" before, so it was something different; it was new, exciting, and it really helped me better understand certain skills."

Notolecta Discusses the Benefits of Wargames (40 Seconds, YouTube)

The Future of War Games
Undoubtedly, war games have a bright future in the Europeian Republican Navy. Those who participated in the war games with the EPSA clearly noted their development and further understanding of new naval techniques. War games are another way to use our military to beneficially cooperate with another region, and it's a strategy of cooperation we don't see that often. In a time when Europeia should be opening up to unique ideas and ways, it's safe to say that war games will continue to be used for foreign cooperation and the development of domestic sailors.

Written by Zapperzx and Writinglegend
Edited by Writinglegend, Noto, Deepest House
Originally published by the Europeian Broadcasting Corporation

---

World Assembly Advancement Program

In a program aimed at building up World Assembly and Europeian Republican Navy membership, Europeia has established the World Assembly Advancement Program. Coordinated by Mousebumples, Fajihas, and Kraketopia, the WAAP rewards endorsing other nations as well as participating in ERN missions. The program has been successful so far in its first run, between May 25 and June 8, 2015.

In the first run of awarding, Meropis ran away with the EndoTarting awards, giving out a staggering 383 endorsements in the two-week period. In fact, not including Mousebumples, 12 different nations handed out more than 200 endorsements during the period. The program also encourages nations to join the ERN and participate on missions by awarding them badges. The program has also helped Mousebumples' endorsement count spike from below 310 when the program was announced to 326 at the time of writing.

---

The Europeian Broadcasting Corporation Presents...
Each report we file will feature at least one article from Europeia's state run media, the EBC, or from our private media center, the LethoMonarchy.

Written By Brunhilde
Brunhilde is an Europeian Senator and Minister of Foreign Affairs of The Communist Bloc

(Image)

Couches are a beautiful thing, aren't they? They're a place of supreme comfort. A place to lie down after a long day with a nice, cold beverage so that you can relax and stop worrying about the troubles of the day. Until about a week ago, they were the only thing in my mind I associated with sofas. A nice, comfortable place to lie down. That's what popped into my mind when someone talked about a sofa to me. Not a military pact that ensures the military training of a region or the potential military dominance that a partnership between two of the largest UCRs in NationStates. I didn't even think about the real life equivalent of a SOFA, otherwise known as a Status of Forces Agreement. Now, when I hear the word my brain fights between what I am used to and what I have been immersed in creating for this passed week. It's an odd experience, partnering a couch with a military pact. It leads my imagination into places that would make an American proud.

Regardless of the mental images it puts in my head, working on this agreement has been one of the more rewarding experiences in my NationStates career.

This entire situation began on the 28th of May, 2015(Okay, admittedly the discussion about the state of our military started a few days before that, but those weren't official discussions and no proposals were made). It was the day of my appointment to Minister of Foreign Affairs in The Communist Bloc. To be honest, the ministry was in bad shape. I don't know how it was still working, really. Zenny was providing the bulk of the effort. From writing the update to delivering it and even to fielding opportunities by herself, it all sat on her plate. Sadly, her appointment featured one of those unfortunate moments when someone seems competent and talks a big game but turns out to be a dud when actually appointed. At the same time, we lacked a military leader. Zenny was competent, sure, and had done the job herself for quite a while to respectable levels. The issue came when Zenny found herself with too much to do and not enough hands to do it. With no one capable of doing the job, we were left with a sizable military without a rudder to lead it.

Both of these ministries needed someone or something to help them. The Foreign Ministry needed the diplomatic corp rebuilt from the ground up. At the same time, the region needed a project. Something to be happy about. Sure, we had recently passed a treaty with the Kingdom of Great Britain but that just wasn't the same. A military treaty with no military just doesn't provide the same substance. We needed more. We needed something that would allow us to pursue our ideals as an independent military force and give the region we served something to look forward to in our foreign affairs. In comes the SOFA.. Or rather, in comes the raw material for SOFA.

Sadly, none of us could snap our fingers and make the agreement come about with any prior discussion. No, at first it wasn't as pretty as it is now. I know, I know. It's a shocker. We didn't have everything perfect right off of the bat. Those involved are indeed mere mortals, as much as some of us might wish for more. I approached Zenny with my concerns about the military, she confided in me that she knew there was an issue and it came from her inability to continue to lead the military. She had been waking up early every morning six days a week to lead the raids on top of her school work. She simply could not continue any longer and she had no replacements. As a result of our mutual interest in an independent military, I asked Zenny if I had permission to discuss things with Writinglegend. The goal was to allow our military to remain relevant, secure training for our troops with the hope of building up a self sustaining military, and at the same time strengthen the relations between our regions at the same time.

This led to me approaching Writinglegend with my initial pitch. I think I probably blindsided him at first. It was a rather inconspicuous greeting at first. We went from me asking if he was about, him saying he was and congratulating me on my appointment to MoFA in TCB, and then to me launching into a long winded(long winded in skype terms) proposal explaining our situation and asking for the assistance of Europeia. In exchange for training and exercising our military, it would join with Europeia's own military under Kraken's command to create a sizable independent military force. Writinglegend assured me he was interested, though he would need to discuss things with Kraken and, undoubtedly, the External Affairs Advisory Committee(EAAC for short). I won't get into the details of the rest of the discussion but I will say they went smoothly. Everyone involved acted as professionals as we set ourselves to the discussion of this deal. Concerns were addressed, questions were answered, and the lovely team at Europeia drafted the original agreement. There was, of course, discussion on it and more questions. Boring stuff, really. In the end, we agreed on the proposal we have today.

It was a great experience, this entire thing. Working through adversity to come to a mutually beneficial agreement is something both sides of this can be proud to be a part of. In the process, we have improved the relationship of TCB and Europeia. We have created a military force to stand by as one of, if not the, largest independent forces and made a statement that the two of the largest UCRs in the game today are willing to be not only mature about their dealings but friendly in them as well.

It is a good day for Europeia and it is a good day for The Communist Bloc. I am glad to say that I was a part of this and I look forward to the future for both of our great regions.

---

This has been a production of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Republic of Europeia. Thank you for reading!

[Xoriet]

Defending really was a fun addition. Just having all raid-based activities would be boring. I like fun while mixing in the challenging elements.

Round two!

[Kaboomlandia]

I love how the CA Chair list is now outdated

[The Agnostic Collective]

It's an odd experience, partnering a couch with a military pact. It leads my imagination into places that would make an American proud.

I LOVE THAT COUCH!!!

America approves.

[RiderSyl]

Wait...
We played War Games in Gameplay on NationStates.

That means we played games in a game on a game.

[Kaboomlandia]

I actually wrote that WAAP article. Nice to see it in print.

[Ambroscus Koth]

Good to see Venico's wargame idea gaining traction in other places, I guess.

[Anumia]

What is the NS Summer Carnival?

The NationStates Summer Carnival is a Europeian hosted event of socialization between fellow NSers from a multitude of different regions. Whether you are just starting out in the game or are a premier player and have been playing for years, you will find a place within the Summer Carnival. Within this social aspect comes a multitude of games, radio, creativity, and discussions, where everyone can get to know and play with/against their fellow NSers.

Where will the NS Summer Carnival be held?

The Summer Carnival is being hosted on the forums of Europeia.

When is the NS Summer Carnival?

The Summer Carnival will be held on July 8th-July 18th.

[Consol Energy]

Yay! A Carnival. My ability to use one of my favorite scenes in cinema grows!

Only two things scare me and one of them is nuclear war.
What's the other?
Excuse me?
What's the other thing that scares you?
Carnies. Circus folk. Nomads, you know. Smell like cabbage. Small hands.

[Anumia]

Glad we could assist. Will you be visiting?

[Writinglegend]

The NS Summer Carnival is up here.