NATION

PASSWORD

An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Talk about nation management, regional politics, and why llamas are a cooler national animal than squirrels.
Not a roleplaying forum.
User avatar
Unibot
Senator
 
Posts: 4292
Founded: May 25, 2008
Ex-Nation

An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Unibot » Fri May 29, 2009 8:09 pm

An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Contributed by Unibot

"Every generation imagines itself to be more intelligent than the one that went before it, and wiser than the one that comes after it." ~ George Orwell



In the spirit of presenting copies of good ol' threads on the new Beta Forums, here is my Analysis of NationStates Generations. However its not entirely old - I've updated it with some new dates, and will continue to do so. For example, with the coming of a new forum - anyone new is of the Raleigh generation not the Theseus generation.




I’ve been thinking about doing an anthropological analysis of NationStates generations for a while now. This isn’t a complete analysis by any means. Furthermore I do not know the history of NationStates as one would if I had ACTUALLY been there, so please correct me if I make a mistake. I use a theory of generational archetypes that I find works with the generations, if you are unfamiliar with this system; I have copied an explanation of the generational archetypes for you from a wiki article. The basis of these archetypes is on the notion that the dispositions of generations repeat with the cycles of human events.

Prophet/Idealist. A Prophet (or Idealist) generation is born during a High, spends its rising adult years during an Awakening, spends midlife during an Unraveling, and spends old age in a Crisis. Prophetic leaders have been cerebral and principled, summoners of human sacrifice, wagers of righteous wars. Early in life, few saw combat in uniform; late in life, most come to be revered as much for their words as for their deeds.

Nomad/Reactive. A Nomad (or Reactive) generation is born during an Awakening, spends its rising adult years during an Unraveling, spends midlife during a Crisis, and spends old age in a new High. Nomadic leaders have been cunning, hard-to-fool realists, taciturn warriors who prefer to meet problems and adversaries one-on-one.

Hero/Civic. A Hero (or Civic) generation is born during an Unraveling, spends its rising adult years during a Crisis, spends midlife during a High, and spends old age in an Awakening. Heroic leaders are considered to have been vigorous and rational institution-builders, busy and competent in old age. All of them entering midlife were aggressive advocates of technological progress, economic prosperity, social harmony, and public optimism.

Artist/Adaptive. An Artist (or Adaptive) generation is born during a Crisis, spends its rising adult years in a new High, spends midlife in an Awakening, and spends old age in an Unraveling. Artistic leaders have been advocates of fairness and the politics of inclusion, irrepressible in the wake of failure.



The Generations of NationStates and their Archetypical Representations


Protogonus Generation (Pioneers)= Hero/Civic
Zelus Generation (Afterwards creation, preceding baby boom) = Artist/Adaptive
Proteus Generation (Pre Influence) = Prophet/Idealist
Lotophagi Generation (Post Influence) = Nomad/Reactive
Theseus Generation (Post WA + Decline) = Hero/Civic
Raleigh Generation (Post-Jolt/Great Revival) = Artist/Adaptive
--------------------------------------------------
A Hypothesized "Alaric" Generation = Prophet/Idealist



Archetypical Events in the Course of NationStates History



Crises= Creation, the disbandment of the UN, the Great Decline, the failure of the Jolt forums and the collapse of NS2.
Awakenings= Regional Influence
Unraveling= the humdrum years following Regional Influence, cultural disintegration
High = the culture renaissance of NS (preceding Influence), the inclusion of multiple feeder regions to account for the Baby Boom, a hypothetical second culture renaissance?


A Brief Analysis of the NationStates Generations



Protogonus Generation

Very few of these veterans still exist; they are the pioneers of the game. They came to NationStates like Columbus with a great discovery, and conquered the world like Napoleon. They forged the first regions, and experimented with the first social societies and organizations. The generation’s main function was establishing systems, and new regions. A good real world example would be the Republican Generation (though George Washington was born a few years before it) that led the revolutionary war. The Protogonus had a remarkably low life expectancy, just over 21 days on average (deletion due to inactivity was 21, not 28 days in this era).

One self "diagnosed" Protogonus and notorious roleplayer, Automagfreek, commented on his generation, it's history, the great decline and the future with a lot of passion that I think will connect with fellow Protogonuses. I encourage you took take a further look:

"I'd by and large have to agree with the generational descriptions and my place on the chart (I'm honored to have been mentioned by the way), since I've been here for everything but the very beginning of NationStates. 6 years is a lot of time to spend on a game, and things are so very different now in comparison to 2003. I can really only speak for my experience in International Incidents since I have RP'd there exclusively, and I agree that a great decline has indeed taken place.

I remember a time when tech levels freely mixed, when the populace of entire nations consisted of fantastical beings such as vampires, cyborgs, elves, and so on. I remember when World War 4 first broke out and not sleeping for two days because I was just so excited and drawn into what was happening that I wanted to be there the second a new development broke. Granted the quality of roleplay and indeed gameplay was much...less evolved, but the volume was so great that there was never a dull moment.

However there was a trade off to the decline in volume and variety. In I.I. for example, the decline in variety meant an increase in quality, and I'm proud to have helped shape the RP community there over the years. Even though I'm still going strong 6 years after joining NS, I'm finding it difficult to continue because quite frankly, everything has been done already.

I think what needs to happen in order to keep things interesting is a regression of sorts, back to a state where variety and creativity abound. I want to see the fantastical nations and cultures, I want to see the imposing alliances, I want conflict that doesn't break down into total bitchfests. There was a time when people really didn't care about "winning" or "losing" at this game, and getting nuked or having an asteroid dropped on your nation simply meant you got a chance to start over and rebuild.

In I.I., it seems that wild creativity is punished because there is a strong sense of realism and wanting to make things feel as true to what is familiar in the modern day as possible. I think people need to let go a bit. Some of the best fun I've had was RPing a clone army, demons and ghosts freely moving about, and wild technologies that more often than not were completely absurd and really didn't do anything that practical. That's what makes this game fun; sculpting out a fantasy world outside of the real one where anything is possible. What's stopping us from doing it all over again?"



Some NationStates examples of the Protogonus Generation are,
Maxtopia (Sir Protogonus himself)
Ineptia (Founder of the Heartland)
The Bruce (Founder of Wysteria)
Cupertino (Founder of Farkistan)
Sirocco
The Most Glorious Hack
Automagfreek


(Dates of Emergence, Nov 2002 - June 2003. Antiquity before Moderators!)

Zelus Generation

These players arrived to the game with playful ambitions to a progressive NationStates world. Under their direction, NationStates exploded with a cultural renaissance. They were also easily frightened of crises. With their involvement, a baby boom progressed. These explorers of the modern world found that NationStates needed a bit more creativity, and added greatly to the already established systems, created new ones, and tried to bring order and righteousness to them with moderation, they were enthusiastic players. A real world example that correlates back to the Zeluses would be, the silent generation, that were a hard working group of people, known to be strong activists, though also were criticized for being “withdrawn, cautious, unimaginative, indifferent, unadventurous and silent.”. The Zeluses improved on the life expectancy of their forefathers, and played the game with more consistency, their averaged life expectancy was 58 days.

The United Nations Old Guard (UNOG) was formed by many of this generation in response to the addition of a repeal feature to the UN.

Some NationStates examples of the Zelus Generation are...
HotRodia
Frisbeeteria
1 Infinite Loop (opened the original NS flag Service)

(Dates of Emergence, June 2003 - May 9 2004. Antiquity in a Post-Mod era!)

Proteus Generation

This generation arrived in a baby boom that naturally followed the cultural renaissance of NationStates. They found themselves in a very developed world, with several different demographics and styles of play. Many players frolicked in the wide variety of organizations and institutions that had been created by their forefathers. However there was an increasingly large dispute over Influence, which divided them from their conservative predecessors. As well, the creation of a Repeal Function in Oct. 2004 for the UN, divided the Older, and Conservative United Nations members and the Proteuses who supported the new ability. There also seems to be prevalent liking of humor, which stemmed from this generation. As for a main function, expansion was one the underlining principles under the Proteus Generation’s prevalent years.

The mod conspiracy theories stems from this generation, but flourished in the Lotophagi generation. The best example of a Proteus Generation in Real Life would be the Baby-boomers, who alienated authority and were the first to really relish in the life style of a “teenager”. After the "Awakening", they died away fairly quickly, and became very conservative in their manner and roleplays (focusing on mostly Real Tech and strict political guidelines). This shift to realism might have been caused by the turbulence of the age, but no matter what, it obviously was a factor in the Great Decline. This could correlate back to real life, with the radical teenagers of the 60's becoming business oriented "yuppies" of the later years. The Proteuses had a lower life expectancy then the Zeluses, and on average, players died away at 49 days. This drop in the expectancy could be due to the overwhelming amount of expendable puppets at the time created for roleplays.

One Proteus describes his memories of the generation...

"While we were the newbies in the RP world at the time, it seems to me at least that we quickly came to dominate it, along with the more motivated '03 posters. (In II the so-called Proteus Generation gave rise to posters such as Praetonia, Doomingsland, The Kraven Corporation, etc.) Oddly enough, while we tried to break the rules a lot starting out, we later on became the most conservative of the generations so far, nearly flattening the political landscape before disappearing from the scene, mostly due to RL obligations. (Or something.) Nowadays it's hard to find a Proteus who's still active enough to count; even in the General Forum they're gradually dying off -- generally those who stay in the UN or become moderators last the longest. As far as generations go, though, it has a shorter staying power (only 2-3 years) than any of the two that preceded it, although longer than the succeeding generation's (which can be less than 2 years on average)."


Some NationStates examples of the Proteus Generation are...
Flibbleites
Ardchoille
Omigodtheykilledkenny
Evil Wolf
Eireann Shamrock

(Dates of Emergence, May 9 2004 - April 6 2006. Anyone who isn't Antiquity, but remembers a pre-influence era. Ol' time Jolters!)

Lotophagi Generation

Afterwards the cultural disintegration following Regional Influence’s activation, new nations found old organizations to join. Cultural progress is at an all-time low. There is a slow steady decline of population in this era, (NS looses about 45% of its size over two or so years). At this point in time, some start talking about a possible sequel. The residents become apathetic, if one went to the technical forum with a suggestion for the game his answer back would be “the mods already turned that down, so it’s not going to happen” within a few minutes of posting. This generation found that gaining respect among players, becoming influential and savoring distinguished autonomies was important. Many of the players on NationStates are probably in a real world generation such as Lotophagi, but don’t even know it. Generation X would be a suitable example of such. One Lotophagi explained his generation's existence as a fairly ignored one, because they're "not old enough to be well regarded by the ancients and not young and brash enough to demand the attention of the Theseids". Also adding that

"they make a decadent playground of the mouldering monuments of a once grand civilisation for which they have a unjustified nostalgia, since they never experienced the Apotheosis at first hand. They are the Byzantines, Spain under Phillip IV, The Sassanians, The Late Hellenistic Kingdoms, The Mannerist and Baroque periods of 17th century Italy e.t.c".


The Lotophagi had the longest of life expectancies out of the generations, with 81 days on average. This depicts the generation as being the most dedicated base of players. Around this time, a revival of Past-Tech threads became popular, some of which tiptoed into the line of alternative history threads and sparked a lot of controversy.

Some NationStates examples of the Lotophagi Generation are...
Todd McCloud
Naivetry
Urgench
Zwangzug

(This one is a little more fickle (I apologize), April 6 2006 - April 1 2008, around the time of the UN collapse. But some Lotophagi still popped up as late as the end of May - Some)

Theseus Generation

As the Who said, "MY GENERATION!". These nations were born in an apathetic world that had been thrown on its side. Societies had been totally destroyed with a mysterious great decline, and the UN exploded into an “extra-dimensional fireball” to be replaced by a newfangled successor, the World Assembly. Many players of this generation find themselves lost on where to join, with a world that has been spread thin of dieing ideologies and playing styles, without the population to support it (as if a disease has ravaged through and sucked the meat off the belly of the beast, leaving only a skeleton). With a crisis emerging, their generation will do what it is necessary to fight through it, with a creative driven passion and determination. They at times don’t realize it, but with a crisis at hand, Theseuses have been raised to preserve what they can, as well as revive, restore and bring back the game with all its glory and might. This generation is in complete correlation with the real life generation that is edging on university age no doubt, the Millennials! NationStates has witnessed a large scale domination of roleplay threads based around future tech (FT) under the Theseus generation. It would be interesting to see if real world events such as Obama’s inauguration had an effect on NationStates. A rough life expectancy is calculated at 37 days on average. Much lower than previous generations, and obviously a sign of the Great Decline.

The Jolter's Club Thread offers insight into the Theseuses' future.

Some NationStates examples of the Theseus Generation are...
New South Hell
Unibot (Author of this amazing analysis)
Mayor for Life
Avalaun

(Dates of Emergence, April 1 2008 - May 1 2009. Anyone who can remember the days of Jolt and cutting at each others throats to get an early beta key to NS2 - but cannot remember the days with a UN (and not because you've forgotten :palm: ))

Raleigh Generation

A fresh, new generation which has joined a reborn NationStates. Inspired by the creativity, and the rapidity surrounding these turbulent years - they'll live it up! In most debates, the Raleigh's will side with the younger, 'hipper' Theseuses in debates, and be the ones that fill their older brother's new found institutions' memberlists - but they will receive their authority and learning from the Lotophagi, which is a particularly un-existentialist generation to receive an education from, and thus the Raleigh's won't be as particularly action-driven as the Theseuses were but instead, rule driven. Their chapter will be the institution 'cultivational' years of NationStates, with these new areas of the game being hoisted on the shoulder's of the Thesuses, expect the Raleigh's to play upon their shoulder's in the biggest playground that NationStates has ever seen - people will look back at this period of time as one of the golden ages of the game. The Great Revival. The new rules of the functioning playground will be made up by the Raleigh's with the help of their educators, the Lotophagi.

I would define a Raleigh as anyone who wasn't around to participate on the Jolt Forums (actually choosing to participate on the Jolt Forums is an entirely different matter however...) - therefore making this quick, turbulent environment of the newfound, beta forums - the only environment that the Raleigh's have ever known.

Some NationStates examples of the Raliegh Generation are...

Give it some time.

(Dates of Emergence, May 1 2009 - And Beyond, anyone who was not in the game when the Jolt forums were the official forums - in all of its ad-ridden bad karma anti-gloriousness !)

A Conversation between these Canonical Generations


An important aspect to this anthropological study is how these different generations get along. In NationStates it is common to read a conversation between members of varying seniorities. So let me elaborate on this concept with a thought experiment, imagine a big metaphysical, chronological, gravity defying, multiplying, air-looming, lobster cracking cube. In this magical box are representatives of the five generations. As if it is a lucid dream, their reason for being there in the box is arbitrary and undefined, and their attempts to distinguish their perceived reality as a dream are fruitless. The proceedings in the box would go something like this…

Protogonus paced around the box, unimpressed with his company. He felt just a tad awkward from all of the stares that the younger representatives gave him. Stroking his white wig, and addressing the scruffiness of his colonial attire.

(At times, the “fame” of being an older nation can estrange and alienate Protogonuses)

Zelus was a quieter man who looked over at Protogonus for advice. Apparently in the past, he had been his loyal apprentice. With Protogonus silent, so was Zelus. Which left Proteus to address the quietness, “So, is someone going to talk about something!? Or should I be leaving to find a magical magazine stand somewhere?”

The joke made the older crowd laugh, but had Theseus confused.

The young, fair-haired man interrupted the controlled laughter, “hey! Maybe we SHOULD be trying to leave this place, there has to be something more than just this box.” The father of Theseus, Lotophagi, shook his head, and smiled with embarrassment to the other representatives, “no son, that’s never going to happen. Proteus was just making a joke.” To Lotophagi’s embarrassment, Theseus continued. Now addressing the royal Protogonus with little of the reverence that Zelus or the others showed him, “Hey Protogonus! You founded this place! Why don’t yeh order a royal expedition…to discover the world outside of the box? Eh?”

Protogonus did not answer back. But Zelus stepped in to address the rowdy young man, “the answer is simple. There is nothing to explore out of this box. Believe me, Proteus has tried numerous times.” Zelus glared coldly at Proteus. To break up the awkwardness, Proteus and Lotophagi laughed at the boy’s folly.

But then something terrible happened, Lotophagi started to cough blood. Disease had spread throughout the box, and it was now apparent that their home was no longer safe.

Proteus and Zelus remained in a constant argument about what to do, Zelus wanted to care for Lotophagi but Proteus wanted to leave the cube, so he wouldn’t contract the disease, and therefore called Zelus an old fool.

This was when Protogonus pulled rank, putting his hand between the two confrontational men, he explained “It’s time for you two to listen; we shall take a royal expedition.”

Proteus and Zelus were stunned.

Protogonus finished his commands with a question, “and who will lead?”
Protus looked at Zelus because of his seniority, and Zelus looked at Protus because he felt like he had misjudged the situation with Lotophagi, and figured he DID deserve the position more.

While this was going on, Theseus jumped to grab their attention, he felt it was imperative for them to leave and he also thought his father could be saved. However, his attempts were futile, at least for now. But Protogonus knew that Theseus would come out of the expedition being the leader of the men, regardless of who started out as the supposed leader.


Breakdown of “Unibot’s Gerontocube”


There are some important aspects of intergenerational conversations that can be discussed with a breakdown of the story. To start, there is a definite ladder of power among the ambassadors, but it’s an awkward one. You must understand, Protogonus devised the Gerontocube, and therefore is fully respected by everyone, even the young Theseus to an extent. Zelus learned everything from Protogonus, and therefore is the most respectful of him, with an exception of Lotophagi. What separates their dealing with the elder is, Zelus is not afraid to communicate with Protogonus, because they were once close, but Lotophagi knows only of legends of the great elder, and therefore is embarrassed when his son tries to address him.

There is also a very thin line of control between Zelus and Proteus; these two generations can at times be confrontational, with one attempting to take the stance as parent over the other and the other attempting to throw the authority off his shoulders. This is similar to real life examples, where the Prophet will rebel from the Hero's timely institution, and be confrontational with the Artist. In most societies, the preceding generation begins teaching a generation later, the omission is evident here as well, Proteus had little to do with Lotophagi’s education; he left that up to Zelus. This is obvious when Lotophagi becomes sick, and Proteus shows no sympathy. Being taught by Proteus as opposed to his apathetic father, Theseus has the same sort of rebellious streak to him that Proteus had in his younger years, but his disposition is not of out arrogance like Proteus at times but out of distress for his father’s safety. Protogonus also hints to a bit of favoritism with Theseus, which may stem from them being so similar, they’re going to have what socionics dubs an Identical Relation, while Proteus and Theseus will have a Mirror Relation. Protogonus's may feel recently energized by the Theseus's generation, and want to help with their cause, the Proteus's alienation of authority is what kept them from feeling the same energy before.

So, we have Protogonus who made the box. Zelus who established the first of its social rules. Proteus who tried to break those rules, Lotophagi who relished in them and Theseus who wishes to step out of the box.



Predicting the Future of NationStates



Using this model, I can lay out a prediction of the future. The Theseus generation will convince other significant members of the generational landslide that a course of action needs to be taken to combat the Great Decline. Consider this time an epic battle of ideologies, generational rivalries, and a rebirth of social institutions. Older, wiser and well respected members of NationStates will awake from their pedestals, and feel compelled to help the cause. The Lotophagi will be hesitant of such changes, and for the most part let the crisis be averted by others. Not out of ignorant lethargy, but out of social apathy and a love for a system they don’t understand fully, or truly know. This hesitation is a logical one, the last time the system was changed it led to the Great Decline (regional influence). Zelus and Proteus generations may have a hard time distinguishing the movement behind these changes from the ones that brought forth the initial awakening. In the coming months, systems will be revamped, or scrapped and replaced with something more efficient.

The Theseuses will carve their way into NationStates history with new social institutions and game mechanics that bring about a NationStates revival. There is a relative calmness for a while, the Raleigh generation emerges. Their populace is a homogeneous one, which partakes in only a few different demographics, silent and forgettable. But their existence is welcomed by the Theseuses who had worked hard to see such arrivals and new blood. Ralieghs will find themselves befriended and taught by Lotophagies, who are as lost in this new and brave face of NationStates as the newborns. Their doctrine of stability, knowledge and authority will drive the Ralieghs to enforce strict new social rules in their prevalent years. In the coming months of mid 2010, the young and fresh Alaric generation will materialize. With their arrival marks a new age of imagination which helps to expand on the world forged by the Theseuses and the Ralieghs, but also instigates a huge change to the game’s mechanics. Around 2012, a magnificent alteration to the game will carry a huge price, as Alaricods and Ralieghs argue over its creation, popular institutions will become outdated with the changes. Creativity and populace will decline once again, worse than in the original great decline. Imagine NationStates falling like Rome. The Zhuangzi generation will slowly fill NationStates hollowed halls, echoing generations before it, as they attempt to put the pieces back together like a gigantic puzzle. The Alaricods and the Ralieghs will drop out of attendance with the fruitless attempts of the Zhuangzi to put back together its troubled world. NationStates will die a slow lingering death and will never reach its cyclic heroes, the Croatoan generation scheduled to arrive in early 2016.

One has to remember that NationStates will be very different in 2016. There will be a few distinctive demographics, and many failed projects. New features such as Regional Issues, and a glorious new systems for delegacy will be abroad. Predicting NationStates in six years is about the equivalent of guessing what Earth will look like in 110 years. Also one has to consider the possibility that the Internet will change, in six years, a lot of technological progresses can happen, as well as a possible NS3 sequel (shudder...) that could drain the Croatoan populace's attention from NS1.



“An Inquiry of Assembly Values” – A Social Experiment



After little debate with myself, I set out to test these anthropological theories. I had at first considered an experiment with a supposed “vulnerability” in the code that would allow for some humorous circumstances. But in the end I decided on a simple thread which outlined a question I have asked myself a lot, and wait for the replies. The question is “should the World Assembly have an army” among other discussions, the reason this is such a “debatable” topic is because the World Assembly is forbidden from forming an army, a decision which apparently was not left to the participants to decide. I figured the issue would show the generations very clearly, with their varying dispositions. Unfortunately, the thread was closed before too many observations could be made, in fact only members of two generations had time to comment (Proteus and Lotophagi).

The Lotophagi appeared apathetic to the argument, it took them the longest to register what I was getting at, and they suggested that I would fail. Showing no hope for change. The Lotophagi crave “maturity” and acceptance within the systems they respect, they wear their apathy like a badge. When someone else walks in and shows no “realism”, the Lotophagi suggest that they back down, as they have or else the society might not respect them, and immediate failure would follow. The Proteuses were more confrontational, they took the attack on the rules as an attack on themselves and the system they were protecting. This leads me to suggest the Violet Curve, a generational experience that is alive today in real life; generations after the “awakenings” such as the Boomers switch from absolute liberalism to strict conservatism in decades. The Proteuses were initially quarrelsome with their founders who were attempting to force them into conformity. But after they saw the changes they wanted to the system, the Proteuses became the greatest protectors of the systems. I would like to also point out, that although confrontational, the Proteuses were not totally apathetic to possibility that change could happen, because they have experienced it before, but they were still confrontational in “behalf of the system’s defense”.

I’d also like to thank a particular Proteus for being the only one that actually tried to answer my question of why there is a ban on the World Assembly’s potential army. You know who you are.


A Census Report of Generations


Data collected by me and a talented colleague, which reveals the distinct make-up of NationStates.

The census report was conducted with a python script that scans the <FOUNDED> tags in the XML feeds of Nations which describes how long ago the nation was founded. Some Protogonus outdate the <FOUNDED> tag’s creation and therefore have a <FOUNDED> date that equals zero – they were included in the census as Protogonuses.

As of April 29, 2009 …

NationStates can be dissected as,




3.7% Protogonus Generation
5% Zelus Generation
8.3% Proteus Generation
17% Lotophagi Generation
66% Theseus Generation


With merely two thirds of NationStates being young this causes me to think that the majority of Theseuses are merely puppets that have been newly created, however this assumption is unproven and based entirely on common beliefs.

On May 12, 2010, this experiment was conducted again with the results as recorded...






3.14% Protogonus Generation
1.55% Zelus Generation
7.63% Proteus Generation
10.75% Lotophagi Generation
8.63% Theseus Generation
29.39% Raleigh Generation
38.90% Alaric Generation


-- Tentatively, Feb 26, 2010 was used as the date to split the Alaric generation from the Raleighs. Feb 26, 2010 was the day that the World Assembly's voting floors were split. This date of transition is subject to change.

With the number of Theseuses deflated to 8.63% (-57.37%), and the two most recent generations, representing 68.29% which is similar to the 2/3 Theseus Measurement from 2009. I would conclude that the most recent generations are inflated by newly created puppet nations, which their owners don't intend on revisiting.
_______________________________________________________________


If you disagree with the depiction of a Generation, please say so. I could be dead wrong on my anthropological analysis, I don’t have much history to go by, and I’m applying a very theoretical model to it. If you do approve of the generational analysis, and you wish to contribute with more significant events, please do so. If you don't approve of your name being used as an example for a generation (possibly because you think this generation stuff is silly and you don't want your name linked to it ), for what ever reason, please just say so, I'll take your name off, promise. If you think you can add to the list of names with better examples, please post them.

Thanks for Reading
Unibot
Last edited by Unibot on Sat May 15, 2010 8:51 am, edited 11 times in total.

User avatar
Gauntleted Fist
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10019
Founded: Aug 17, 2008
Father Knows Best State

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Gauntleted Fist » Fri May 29, 2009 10:57 pm

Would it be possible to give a rough chronological estimate of the generations?

It can be confusing reading through the analysis with no point in time reference.

User avatar
Democratic Eurasia
Diplomat
 
Posts: 743
Founded: Oct 25, 2007
Democratic Socialists

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Democratic Eurasia » Sat May 30, 2009 5:21 am

Deep- I think, judging from the events you give and comparing my population with the example nations' populations, I am a Lotophagi. I'm older than Urgench and younger than the rest, I have a larger popualtion than all the example Theseii and a well smaller one than the Proteii. I also remember most of those events from the your estimate of when the Lotophagi came into being. That's only been a couple of years though- seems like longer... I joined in summer '07.
"Jenkins... chap with wings, there. Five rounds rapid." Brigadier Lethbridge-Stewart


By the way, please excuse all spelling and grammar mistakes- they are indeed numerous and highly irritating. If its any consolation they annoy me just as much. Its just combing through and editing your post for a 3rd time for that last 'their' that should be 'they're' would last me to the next general election. I'm not good with keyboards. But I am a good speller in the real world. Really. I'm not just saying that.
...
Honestly.

User avatar
Unibot
Senator
 
Posts: 4292
Founded: May 25, 2008
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Unibot » Sat May 30, 2009 8:59 am

Gauntleted Fist wrote:Would it be possible to give a rough chronological estimate of the generations?

It can be confusing reading through the analysis with no point in time reference.


Gauntleted Fist, thanks for the suggestion. I've went through and added a rough chronological estimate, and also I made changes to my analysis to give a concrete date of importance to each cut-off date (instead of picking some arbitrary date like 'Dec. 2002' or 'Jan. 2004', I've picked dates like 'the day we got moderators' or 'the day we meant jolt :twisted:'). Therefore with the update, we've got some new Protogonosues,

WELCOME SIROCCO AND THE MOST GLORIOUS HACK TO PROTOGONOSHIP!

This also puts the generation-ship in question for Automagfreek and Flibbleites, because they pre-date their currently listed generations by two months. AMF was pretty happy as Zelus but after looking back at the descriptions and his post, he seems like a Protogonus - and Flibbleites seems a tad less conservative than many Proteuses however pretty much the norm. What do you guys/gals think? Maybe I should contact both of them...


Deep- I think, judging from the events you give and comparing my population with the example nations' populations, I am a Lotophagi. I'm older than Urgench and younger than the rest, I have a larger popualtion than all the example Theseii and a well smaller one than the Proteii. I also remember most of those events from the your estimate of when the Lotophagi came into being. That's only been a couple of years though- seems like longer... I joined in summer '07.


Yep. Lotophagi. - Unless you disagree with the depiction of you as a player, sometimes with the way things work out (some players keep in solid isolation for a long time, preventing them to influenced by NationStates for a while) you might be a later generation, in this case, possibly a Theseus.
Last edited by Unibot on Sat May 30, 2009 4:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
Democratic Eurasia
Diplomat
 
Posts: 743
Founded: Oct 25, 2007
Democratic Socialists

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Democratic Eurasia » Sat May 30, 2009 12:52 pm

No, no- unflattering as it may be I fit the timeframe, population size and, well, personality traits (online I mean). To me your analysis is good and it fits. I'm not the most intelligent guy in the west, but there's a chance I'm not the dumbest (George Bush jr has always been there for me in that sense ;) ) and it fits for me- well argued with good examples, solid dates and works personally.
"Jenkins... chap with wings, there. Five rounds rapid." Brigadier Lethbridge-Stewart


By the way, please excuse all spelling and grammar mistakes- they are indeed numerous and highly irritating. If its any consolation they annoy me just as much. Its just combing through and editing your post for a 3rd time for that last 'their' that should be 'they're' would last me to the next general election. I'm not good with keyboards. But I am a good speller in the real world. Really. I'm not just saying that.
...
Honestly.

User avatar
Charlotte Ryberg
The Muse of the Westcountry
 
Posts: 14973
Founded: Mar 14, 2007
Civil Rights Lovefest

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Charlotte Ryberg » Sat May 30, 2009 1:26 pm

It was only the WA era when I actually did up some resolutions so I might have well fitted into the Theseus generation. The most recent one was also in the Theseus era.
Minoa and Charlotte Ryberg
National profileGA librarySC libraryFlickr • Twitter: @cuddly_owl

User avatar
Starblaydia
Minister
 
Posts: 3155
Founded: Apr 05, 2004
Father Knows Best State

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Starblaydia » Sat May 30, 2009 2:14 pm

"While we were the newbies in the RP world at the time, it seems to me at least that we quickly came to dominate it...


Though Sports RPing (who's generations are very closely analogous to those proposed for NS overall) probably wasn't quite what was in mind when this was said, it's very true indeed for the Proteus Generation in that respect.
The Protectorate of Starblaydia: Commended by WA Security Council Resolution #40
Five-Time NS World Cup Champions (WCs 25, 28, 41, 44 & 47)
Former World Cup Committee President (WCs 25-33, 46-54)
Factbooks: Starblaydia national football team
NSwiki (when it works): StarblaydiaStarblaydia national football team (Featured)Simeone Di Bradini (Featured)

Co-host of World Cups 20 & 40 • Di Bradini Cup Organiser
World Cups 30 & 63 Runner-Up • World Cup 27 Third Place • 25th Baptism of Fire Runner-Up
Six-Time AOCAF Cup Champions • Two-time U21WC Champions • Men's Football Olympic Champions, Ashford Games
Five-Time Cherry Cup Champions • 1st Quidditch World Cup Champions • WGPC8 Drivers' Champion
Visit My gaming channelMy blogAO4LIFE

User avatar
Third Spanish States
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1454
Founded: Oct 09, 2007
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Third Spanish States » Sat May 30, 2009 2:25 pm

This is what the newest NS generation has mostly shown far, and most older NS players who do NS RP have ignored these forums because of it. You don't like as much of RP as you do like regional gameplay, so you probably are not entirely aware of how things are going in NS RP. The only people trying to "save" NS RP so far are older players who want some fun and have hope. Most new NSes are just like this, and "I n00k!", one-liners and all.

Image

Pop Sci "anthropology" book is exactly like that image as well, and this is really, really superficial and poorly thought-out generalization of something that was applied to mainstream society to a niche Internet subculture, and even as a treatise for mainstream culture, it is extremely questionable.

If people spamming 4-liners and ignoring advice whether due to immaturity or stupidity are Artist/Adaptives who will resurrect NS, then I'm Rembrandt.

The "Raleigh generation" will steady the "decline" (as of now II is only slightly less worse than as it was in 2002, from what I've heard), not stop it, and the other "generation" will simply follow the footsteps of n00bery and Fail set by them unless something is done by the older NS players. Internet communities do not have rises and fall, they only have one rise and one fall. The hardcore veterans are the ones who actually keep them going, alive, and who actually shape them.
Last edited by Third Spanish States on Sat May 30, 2009 2:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
PMT Factbook.
Honoro Sacrificium e Libertas : The Mindset, Jaredcohenia, New-Lexington, Binaria, Varejao, Hogsweat, Franberry, ChevyRocks, Izistan, Ulanpataar, North-Point, The Mindset, Vault 10, Rosbaningrad, Sharfghotten, Tyrandis, South Sharfgotten, Jeuna, Satirius, Zukariaa, Midlauthia et New Nicksyllvania.
Izistan wrote:Third Spanish States is a well known far-right activist so his attempts at humor can only be expected.

Umbagar wrote:%*$#! I put a crack in my screen thanks to the awesome "place fist here" sign. >:(

Lhazastan wrote:if all you want to do is run around being the big badass of a community, not only are you pathetic, but you are a bad RPer

Saxon Germany wrote:[...]you're practically a professional troll, TSS.[...]

User avatar
Todd McCloud
Minister
 
Posts: 2394
Founded: Oct 11, 2006
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Todd McCloud » Sat May 30, 2009 4:36 pm

I like this!

Actually, my first nation was formed during the Proteus Generation, but I didn't get involved in NS until the next generation, so it all works out!
"Your uniform doesn't seem to fit. You're much too alive in it."

"You must be the change you want to see in the world" - Gandhi
"The worst prison would be a closed heart." - Pope John Paul II
Vekaiyu's Wiki Page | Ikrisia Levinile's Wiki Page | Vekaiyu at the Eighth Summer Olympics | What about #9?

User avatar
Unibot
Senator
 
Posts: 4292
Founded: May 25, 2008
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Unibot » Sat May 30, 2009 4:40 pm

If people spamming 4-liners and ignoring advice whether due to immaturity or stupidity are Artist/Adaptives who will resurrect NS, then I'm Rembrandt.


Well actually if you read the analysis - you'd find it was the Thesuses that are suppose to be the ones that really push for the Great Revival. Its the Raleighs that embrace it, and come up with the rules and enforcement with the new institutions over time.

Considering the Raleigh generation is, as of today, little over a couple weeks old (like these forums), I'd give it some time before you started to judge them.

You never know, Third Spanish States, you might find that you like them - according to this
so-called 'pop sci-anthropology analysis', you and your generation are going find yourselves being the ones to educate them. :)

User avatar
Unibot
Senator
 
Posts: 4292
Founded: May 25, 2008
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Unibot » Sat May 30, 2009 4:45 pm

I like this!

Actually, my first nation was formed during the Proteus Generation, but I didn't get involved in NS until the next generation, so it all works out!



Thanks.

Quick question, what feels more like you... Lotophagi or Proteus?

Its been a long-standing debate that took place on the jolt forums, because players that stop and started in two different generations create a dilemma, when I'm try to archetype them.

User avatar
Dalimbar
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 115
Founded: Jul 19, 2004
Father Knows Best State

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Dalimbar » Sat May 30, 2009 6:32 pm

I have to say that this is an amazing piece. I started this game back in July 04 (an early Proteus Generation by your analysis) back when Great Bight was in control of TNP, and while still somewhat screaming and kicking around the Gameplay scene, the descriptions are quite accurate and articulate.
Dalimbar,
Delegate / Pharaoh (Ret.) of Osiris
Delegate (Ret.) of The North Pacific
Folk Hero of the Pacifics
Member of the Ex-Feeder Tyrant Club

User avatar
Unibot
Senator
 
Posts: 4292
Founded: May 25, 2008
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Unibot » Sat May 30, 2009 6:37 pm

I have to say that this is an amazing piece. I started this game back in July 04 (an early Proteus Generation by your analysis) back when Great Bight was in control of TNP, and while still somewhat screaming and kicking around the Gameplay scene, the descriptions are quite accurate and articulate.


Thank You. :lol:

I was really worried about the accuracy part when I created it, considering I wasn't actually there to witness most of these events with my own eyes.

User avatar
Parthenon
Senator
 
Posts: 3512
Founded: Antiquity
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Parthenon » Sat May 30, 2009 6:45 pm

Excellent write up. That being said, I identify my history more so with the Zelus Generation as I existed during the time of Automag, however, having a 0 founded date, I would be classified as Protogonus by definition. I feel that the line is a bit blurred between these two generations as we coexisted for so long together.


Edit: Reading your above post about Automag predating Zelus and knowing his demeanor I would have to agree with reclassification to Protogonus.
Last edited by Parthenon on Sat May 30, 2009 6:57 pm, edited 5 times in total.
The Parthenese Confederation
Parthenon
Intergallactic Hell
The Bleeding Roses
West Parthenon
Former GDODAD/Metus Member

User avatar
Unibot
Senator
 
Posts: 4292
Founded: May 25, 2008
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Unibot » Sat May 30, 2009 6:55 pm

Excellent write up. That being said, I identify my history more so with the Zelus Generation, however, having a 0 founded date I would be classified as Protogonus by your standards. I feel that the line is a blit blurred between these two generations.


It is, especially if you didn't participate on the forums, get involved with raiding (or whatever people did in the pre-mod antiquity days... I don't know, play pin-the-donkey?) or gameplay until the moderators came about, which I think must of changed the atmosphere, atleast a little bit. With mods being brought into the picture, that signals to me as a sort of pop-historian, that the new institutions of NS were accumulating to the point that they needed more rules, and enforcement - which is about the point a new generational archetype pops up. The Swinging' 03s ?
Last edited by Unibot on Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Unibot
Senator
 
Posts: 4292
Founded: May 25, 2008
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Unibot » Sat May 30, 2009 6:56 pm

Edit: Reading your above post about Automag predating Zelus and his demeanor I would have to agree with reclassification to Protogonus.


Yeah, I think I'll change that when I get the chance.

User avatar
Parthenon
Senator
 
Posts: 3512
Founded: Antiquity
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Parthenon » Sat May 30, 2009 7:03 pm

Also, I don't seem to recall a time in which there wasn't moderators in either the game or the forums. Can you elaborate a bit on the terminology of pre-mod?
Last edited by Parthenon on Sat May 30, 2009 7:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The Parthenese Confederation
Parthenon
Intergallactic Hell
The Bleeding Roses
West Parthenon
Former GDODAD/Metus Member

User avatar
Unibot
Senator
 
Posts: 4292
Founded: May 25, 2008
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Unibot » Sat May 30, 2009 7:15 pm

Also, I don't seem to recall a time in which there wasn't moderators in either the game or the forums. Can you elaborate a bit on the terminology of pre-mod?


http://www.nationstates.net/page=news/2 ... moderators ?

User avatar
Clearwater
Political Columnist
 
Posts: 5
Founded: Antiquity
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Clearwater » Sat May 30, 2009 7:16 pm

While not perfect, it does give a good breakdown on the attitudes of NS scociety.

Parthenon, when the game firth started the only people with mod powers were the admins [violet] and [dredd]. Max Barry only added player mods after the game went through it's first major population boom.
Wash: This landing is gonna get pretty interesting.
Mal: Define interesting.
Wash: Oh God, oh God. We're all gonna die.

User avatar
Parthenon
Senator
 
Posts: 3512
Founded: Antiquity
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Parthenon » Sat May 30, 2009 7:27 pm

I have always considered Violet and Dredd to be a part of the moderation team. So the reference is to player moderators, all I needed to know.
The Parthenese Confederation
Parthenon
Intergallactic Hell
The Bleeding Roses
West Parthenon
Former GDODAD/Metus Member

User avatar
Unibot
Senator
 
Posts: 4292
Founded: May 25, 2008
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Unibot » Sat May 30, 2009 7:30 pm

Well sorry, I call those two admins.

User avatar
Todd McCloud
Minister
 
Posts: 2394
Founded: Oct 11, 2006
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Todd McCloud » Sat May 30, 2009 10:29 pm

Unibot wrote:
I like this!

Actually, my first nation was formed during the Proteus Generation, but I didn't get involved in NS until the next generation, so it all works out!



Thanks.

Quick question, what feels more like you... Lotophagi or Proteus?

Its been a long-standing debate that took place on the jolt forums, because players that stop and started in two different generations create a dilemma, when I'm try to archetype them.


I'm in the right slot, lol. I was founded in the earlier generation, but, because I took a while to get into global politics, I'm in the right generation!

I love this, by the way.
"Your uniform doesn't seem to fit. You're much too alive in it."

"You must be the change you want to see in the world" - Gandhi
"The worst prison would be a closed heart." - Pope John Paul II
Vekaiyu's Wiki Page | Ikrisia Levinile's Wiki Page | Vekaiyu at the Eighth Summer Olympics | What about #9?

User avatar
Northern Chittowa
Envoy
 
Posts: 226
Founded: Mar 03, 2005
Capitalist Paradise

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Northern Chittowa » Sun May 31, 2009 3:02 am

I like this, very good job. The lines sometimes overlap, but that is surely to be expected as the boarders of anything such as this are always going to be flexible. I think im pretty much spot on. :)

User avatar
Delphina
Political Columnist
 
Posts: 4
Founded: Antiquity
Ex-Nation

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Delphina » Sun May 31, 2009 3:13 am

Is this some plot to make me feel old?

User avatar
Vocenae
Diplomat
 
Posts: 849
Founded: Jan 19, 2006
Compulsory Consumerist State

Re: An Analysis of NationStates Generations

Postby Vocenae » Sun May 31, 2009 3:16 am

Unibot, you have won NS.

But woo for the Proteus generation! Even if I was a couple months shy from the end of it!
Last edited by Vocenae on Sun May 31, 2009 3:21 am, edited 2 times in total.
The Imperial Star Republic.

The Future Tech Advice & Assistance Thread, the definitive resource thread for Future Tech.

New to FT or just want to meet other members of the community? Join us on IRC at #NSLegion and #NSFT on Esper!

18:34 <Kyrusia> Voc: The one anchor of moral conscience in a sea of turbulent depravity.

Next

Remove ads

Return to Gameplay

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Exabot [Bot], Nordic States and Territories, Severania, Valentir

Remove ads