NationStates

Joop wrote:

Mousebumples wrote:So, Artic Oasis will host such a facility? Or a different Antarctic Oasis nation that is a member of the WA? Anybody clear that with them before determining that their land is the best location onto which such a facility can be built?

As founder of Antarctica I concur. We also were not contacted about hosting such a facility, and we will not be forced by a resolution to do so. Our penguin armies and antarctic polar bears will stand in your way.

The Imperial English Ambassador coughs discreetly, standing. "The Imperial English Empire can and will provide land in The League of Free Nations for such a facility."

St George of England wrote:The Imperial English Ambassador coughs discreetly, standing. "The Imperial English Empire can and will provide land in The League of Free Nations for such a facility."

Your generosity is an inspiration ambassador.

The resolution clearly states "in a neutral World Assembly controlled territory" which is fairly obviously the ice maker in the Strangers Bar as the World Assembly doesn't control any actual territory as it's not a sovereign nation.

Philimbesi wrote:The resolution clearly states "in a neutral World Assembly controlled territory" which is fairly obviously the ice maker in the Strangers Bar as the World Assembly doesn't control any actual territory as it's not a sovereign nation.

I'm aware that the WA itself does not own any territory what was meant here is a WA nation willing to donate or sell a parcel of land to the WASP for the building of the facility.As the WASP is a WA office itself (correct me if I'm wrong on that) then by proxy the land would be owned by a WA body after it was obtained.I mentioned neutral because it would not be owned by any single nation.

Philimbesi wrote:The resolution clearly states "in a neutral World Assembly controlled territory" which is fairly obviously the ice maker in the Strangers Bar as the World Assembly doesn't control any actual territory as it's not a sovereign nation.

I believe the World Assembly owns a few inter-dimensional parcels, of which at least one might be arctic. If not, I'm sure the gnomes will accidentally send some arctic land through a wormhole during a siege on some Antarctic Oasis nation's legislature.

Being serious for a second, I always imagined that the Emergency Crop Program would be made up of several areas throughout the world/universe, where certain crops grow more favorably. Either the World Assembly is renting or bought the land, or some nice governments donated it for "the good of the world."

Support given completely.

As you know, my generous and kind Sir from The Associated Peoples, our Nation States are far from the same ideology and hmmm..how shall I put it, loving handling of our peoples. However, here we find common ground.

I have just been able to bring back the long lost feather bellied Golden Mule into existence, as well as our land is some of the most lush and fertile in all of the World. The price of keeping these safe is devastating, and even if I could do so I could not guarantee that a power outage, or the renewable and natural energies we use to supply our country would not fail us in our time of need.

A RESOUNDING AYE!

Glen-Rhodes wrote:Being serious for a second, I always imagined that the Emergency Crop Program would be made up of several areas throughout the world/universe, where certain crops grow more favorably. Either the World Assembly is renting or bought the land, or some nice governments donated it for "the good of the world."

Thank you ambassador for providing the clarification.I believe when I tried to explain myself my words came out a bit jumbled.Your support is also appreciated.

Buried Plows wrote:Support given completely.

As you know, my generous and kind Sir from The Associated Peoples, our Nation States are far from the same ideology and hmmm..how shall I put it, loving handling of our peoples. However, here we find common ground.

I have just been able to bring back the long lost feather bellied Golden Mule into existence, as well as our land is some of the most lush and fertile in all of the World. The price of keeping these safe is devastating, and even if I could do so I could not guarantee that a power outage, or the renewable and natural energies we use to supply our country would not fail us in our time of need.

A RESOUNDING AYE!

Hello Yale when did you sneak in here?If you happen to have any of that scotch you are always carrying around I sure could use a wee nip or two.This proposal stuff is a bit nerve racking.Yale we do share a continent so I suppose we by the laws of chance and proximity we will manage to shudder find common ground on occasion.I all of a sudden feel dirty.By the way we have a new nation in the area be sure to stop in and say hello to them.

Official Communication

The People's Republic of Teshuvá, through it's People's Power ministries for the Justice and Juridical Order and Natural Environment Preservation officially and enthusiastically praise the intent of this proposal, but sees itself forced to vote AGAINST and recommend other nations to do the same for the following reasons:

- There is no provision on the statute of the WA about land tenure of any kind, nor any international law or agreement to regulate how such transfer should be done. How can an interested nation apply? What are the objective critters for it? What are the mechanics of election for the host nation of those facilities, in case of more than one interested? What is the nature of such occupation on foreign lands -- does it include military personnel for secutiry? Military from where? And other related questions.

"III / a.) All discoveries shall be made available to any establishment showing legitimate interest."
- The government of Teshuvá believes this clause provides multinational pharmaceutical industries the chance to take advantage of a world bank of natural raw material to create it's own products and take huge amounts of profit -- without sharing the formulas with the member states who provided the specimens and could have interest in producing it's own medication. This is not only severe undermining of national sovereignty, but also the path to infinite legal battles over patents and rights of distribution of derivatives of those specimens.

- Teshuvá also asserts that the legal maneuver of registering this proposal under "education and creativity" by the argumentation that it won't affect the economy if approved is weak and meaningless: it is important for the environmental issue that the prejudice over the topic is banned. It does NOT necessarily affect economic growth, and, even when it does, it's a fair price to pay for better conditions for life on our planet. All free-from-charge "solutions" presented for environmental matters presented so far all proved to be innocuous.

Respectfully,
The People's Republic of Teshuvá

Teshuva wrote:Official Communication

The People's Republic of Teshuvá, through it's People's Power ministries for the Justice and Juridical Order and Natural Environment Preservation officially and enthusiastically praise the intent of this proposal, but sees itself forced to vote AGAINST and recommend other nations to do the same for the following reasons:

- There is no provision on the statute of the WA about land tenure of any kind, nor any international law or agreement to regulate how such transfer should be done. How can an interested nation apply? What are the objective critters for it? What are the mechanics of election for the host nation of those facilities, in case of more than one interested? What is the nature of such occupation on foreign lands -- does it include military personnel for secutiry? Military from where? And other related questions.

"III / a.) All discoveries shall be made available to any establishment showing legitimate interest."
- The government of Teshuvá believes this clause provides multinational pharmaceutical industries the chance to take advantage of a world bank of natural raw material to create it's own products and take huge amounts of profit -- without sharing the formulas with the member states who provided the specimens and could have interest in producing it's own medication. This is not only severe undermining of national sovereignty, but also the path to infinite legal battles over patents and rights of distribution of derivatives of those specimens.Furthermore their is no host nation it is to be run by the WASP which I believe I have said more than once.Hey you know what I think I see a conclusion over their by the wall you may want to jump to that one also.It's not to far from the one you already jumped to... pharmaceutical...just when I thought this place couldn't get any weirder.Yale you still here with that scotch?

- Teshuvá also asserts that the legal maneuver of registering this proposal under "education and creativity" by the argumentation that it won't affect the economy if approved is weak and meaningless: it is important for the environmental issue that the prejudice over the topic is banned. It does NOT necessarily affect economic growth, and, even when it does, it's a fair price to pay for better conditions for life on our planet. All free-from-charge "solutions" presented for environmental matters presented so far all proved to be innocuous.

Respectfully,
The People's Republic of Teshuvá

Honored ambassador I have no idea where you got all that from pharmaceuticals? really ?You can't possibly be serious.It's not environmental.It does not seek to maintain environments.It seeks to study ways to bring back an environment that has ceased.To maintain a viable source of genetic materials and seek ways to use them in an efficient manner.It is exactly what it says it is.I will admit my good sir sometimes they are out to get you, to stick it to you, to rip you off ,to be all sneaky and covert... but on the other hand sometimes you are just paranoid.Surely you can't really believe that pharmaceutical companies would be considered as having legitimate interest.

"Ahem", the ambassador of Teshuvá promptly interrupted. "Please, my friend ambassador, first of all, don't take this as anything personal. It isn't. Nor is against the spirit of the proposal in discussion. But we can't ignore that, when we talk about the possibility of reviving dead environments we are talking about recreating plants that could even have become extinct before extensive scientific study over their chemical properties. Let's not get too 'sci-fi'. It might mean that specimens today restricted for private exploitation could be saved from extinction and made available for research. It is not fair that this new patrimony of humanity, saved by the cordinated effort of the member-states of the WA, could fall in the hands of private enterprises that could (and would) make it a monopoly. We believe we need stronger regulation -- specially over the results of the research -- to create such facility".

Mousebumples wrote:

The Associated Peoples wrote:a.) The facility will be located in a neutral World Assembly controlled territory. Ideally, in an arctic region well above sea level, with little to no seismic activity, to minimize the danger of damage due to electrical failure, flooding or structural damage.

So, Artic Oasis will host such a facility? Or a different Antarctic Oasis nation that is a member of the WA? Anybody clear that with them before determining that their land is the best location onto which such a facility can be built?

[Quietly orders drilling operations on strategic faultlines throughout the Antarctic continent, in order to deem the regional climate unsuitable for hosting an EPRF facility.]

Omigodtheykilledkenny wrote:

Mousebumples wrote:So, Artic Oasis will host such a facility? Or a different Antarctic Oasis nation that is a member of the WA? Anybody clear that with them before determining that their land is the best location onto which such a facility can be built?

[Quietly orders drilling operations on strategic faultlines throughout the Antarctic continent, in order to deem the regional climate unsuitable for hosting an EPRF facility.]

actually old bean, I don't think we in the AO have to worry. Any unihabited land has already been eith used as a either weapon testing ranges, places to test experiments, or places where test subjects of failed Mad Scienti....exploritory scientific research have been released. Certainly that in itself should make our fair region unsuitable.
Excelsior,
Sen. Horstio Sulla

Well that, and our residents have an unfortunate habit of shooting any gnome within their line of sight. Mrs. Mary Higgenbother of Pine View, Santa Califia used to be the proud owner of the world's largest collection of lawn gnomes, until recently, when her neighbors mistook them for a WA invading force.

I don't think that said research ought to be conducted. I find it kind of sacrilegious and it murders far too many embryos.

This proposal is extremely vaguely written; and the "sentence" "Ideally, in an arctic region well above sea level, with little to no seismic activity, to minimize the danger of damage due to electrical failure, flooding or structural damage" is actually a fragment. For these reasons in particular, Sarong-and-Saright cannot support the proposal.

(ooc)I apologize for not getting in the responses in a timely manner I had to run a couple quick errands but I'll scroll up and be sure to try and catch what I missed.

Dargokia wrote:(ooc)I apologize for not getting in the responses in a timely manner I had to run a couple quick errands but I'll scroll up and be sure to try and catch what I missed.

(ooc)Ignore this I logged with my puppet to do issues and forgot to log back with my real nation.

Teshuva wrote:"Ahem", the ambassador of Teshuvá promptly interrupted. "Please, my friend ambassador, first of all, don't take this as anything personal. It isn't. Nor is against the spirit of the proposal in discussion. But we can't ignore that, when we talk about the possibility of reviving dead environments we are talking about recreating plants that could even have become extinct before extensive scientific study over their chemical properties. Let's not get too 'sci-fi'. It might mean that specimens today restricted for private exploitation could be saved from extinction and made available for research. It is not fair that this new patrimony of humanity, saved by the cordinated effort of the member-states of the WA, could fall in the hands of private enterprises that could (and would) make it a monopoly. We believe we need stronger regulation -- specially over the results of the research -- to create such facility".

No offence taken.People are going to disagree.I knew that before I submitted the proposal.I also recognize that you do not have any qualms with the intent.Once again the final authority will be handed over to the WASP an organization that was created to oversee things of a scientific nature.

1. Establishes a ‘WA Scientific Programme’ [or ‘WASP’], to administer and coordinate whatever agencies are placed under its jurisdiction so as to promote cooperation and reduce wasteful duplication between them;
relevant exert from Resolution #87
Personally I think you are finding problems where they do not exist.In your mind and perhaps in the minds of others they are somehow relevant.Not in mine.I don't recognize some shadowy corporation twisting the WASP into allowing them to perform unethical activities.In a nut shell your fears are unfounded.

Omigodtheykilledkenny wrote:[Quietly orders drilling operations on strategic faultlines throughout the Antarctic continent, in order to deem the regional climate unsuitable for hosting an EPRF facility.] (Image)

No worries I would not dream of suggesting an encroachment on your lands I've read your factbook and quite frankly the people on that continent scare me.

The Palentine wrote:actually old bean, I don't think we in the AO have to worry. Any unihabited land has already been eith used as a either weapon testing ranges, places to test experiments, or places where test subjects of failed Mad Scienti....exploritory scientific research have been released. Certainly that in itself should make our fair region unsuitable.
Excelsior,
Sen. Horstio Sulla

See reply to above.

Omigodtheykilledkenny wrote:Well that, and our residents have an unfortunate habit of shooting any gnome within their line of sight. Mrs. Mary Higgenbother of Pine View, Santa Califia used to be the proud owner of the world's largest collection of lawn gnomes, until recently, when her neighbors mistook them for a WA invading force.

Oh and this also.I'm not even sure I ever want to visit there although the pictures are quite lovely.

Jedi8246 wrote:I don't think that said research ought to be conducted. I find it kind of sacrilegious and it murders far too many embryos.

What?Where did that come from.I assure you that embryos will not be harmed in any way.There are more sources for genetic material than embryos of this I am quite positive.

Sarong-and-Saright wrote:This proposal is extremely vaguely written; and the "sentence" "Ideally, in an arctic region well above sea level, with little to no seismic activity, to minimize the danger of damage due to electrical failure, flooding or structural damage" is actually a fragment. For these reasons in particular, Sarong-and-Saright cannot support the proposal.

If you think it is vague there is nothing I can do about that.As far as the grammar goes I couldn't tell you one way or the other.My grammar is atrocious.That is why I had my friend an English Major co-write with me.I'll have to scold him soundly for his mistake.If it is actually there.Like I said I couldn't tell you.

Philimbesi wrote:The resolution clearly states "in a neutral World Assembly controlled territory" which is fairly obviously the ice maker in the Strangers Bar as the World Assembly doesn't control any actual territory as it's not a sovereign nation.

That ice maker is not neutral. It went into overdrive and started flinging cubes at my assisant Murray just the other day.

Mr Newman stood slowly and thoughtfully.

"It seems, to me, like a useful proposal, although I wonder if there are not more important things to be looking at." H stopped momentarily and picked up a sheet of paper. "Although it does appear, looking through the queue that there clearly aren't. Ah well. I wonder if one territory is enough. In fact, I'd reckon that to be a major weakness of the resolution. Also, I'm sure the Seedbank would have been completely fine. Defining seeds as something that contains genetic material that is part of the reproductive system of a living organism would allow you to jump through that loophole.

"Hmm. It's hard. I'll change my vote to support this resolution, although I'd rather see it rejected in favour of an improved version." He addressed the representative from the The Associated Peoples. "Your idea has so much more to offer, Mr. err...?"

Johz wrote:Mr Newman stood slowly and thoughtfully.

"It seems, to me, like a useful proposal, although I wonder if there are not more important things to be looking at." H stopped momentarily and picked up a sheet of paper. "Although it does appear, looking through the queue that there clearly aren't. Ah well. I wonder if one territory is enough. In fact, I'd reckon that to be a major weakness of the resolution. Also, I'm sure the Seedbank would have been completely fine. Defining seeds as something that contains genetic material that is part of the reproductive system of a living organism would allow you to jump through that loophole.

"Hmm. It's hard. I'll change my vote to support this resolution, although I'd rather see it rejected in favour of an improved version." He addressed the representative from the The Associated Peoples. "Your idea has so much more to offer, Mr. err...?"

Thank you for the change of heart and it's Dr.Roosevelt but there is really no need to be so formal Nigel will do just fine.To answer the point you make of whether it would best be served by more than one facility I am inclined to agree.Of course there is nothing stopping the building of multiple facilities in the event that the space became an issue.There are after all quite a few nations in this world of ours.I can assure you though that genetic materials takes up very little space.The reason I did not opt for setting that down in stone if you will is that I assumed and rightly so it seems that the issue of where it would be located would come up and be a minor point of contention.I can also see here more could have been done I will not disagree with your point here either.I just figured it was already providing for storage,research and education and if I tried to add more it had the potential of becoming to bogged down with to many things that it would become unworkable.These thoughts actually crossed my mind during the initial draft phase.You should have seen the drafts I had before I finally settled on this one.

Hmm... After much consideration, this nation has decided to back this resolution. The proposal, though flawed, is a brave and useful attempt at bringing greater good and relief to the environment and animals. This nation appreciates that and gives this resolution the green light.

To: Mr. Newman
From: Eustace Levi, Managing Director

Johz wrote:Mr Newman stood slowly and thoughtfully.

"It seems, to me, like a useful proposal, although I wonder if there are not more important things to be looking at." H stopped momentarily and picked up a sheet of paper. "Although it does appear, looking through the queue that there clearly aren't. Ah well. I wonder if one territory is enough. In fact, I'd reckon that to be a major weakness of the resolution. Also, I'm sure the Seedbank would have been completely fine. Defining seeds as something that contains genetic material that is part of the reproductive system of a living organism would allow you to jump through that loophole.

"Hmm. It's hard. I'll change my vote to support this resolution, although I'd rather see it rejected in favour of an improved version." He addressed the representative from the The Associated Peoples. "Your idea has so much more to offer, Mr. err...?"

We had considered multiple facilities, although, there were concerns about scale. Robert and I decided that complaints might crop up concerning even more extensive use of World Assembly territory and, considering the complaints (flippant or otherwise) of those opposed involving the exact nature of the land we intended the World Assembly to implement, it seems it may not have been an incorrect decision. I do agree with you, though, but compromises often have to be made.

Concerning the seedbank, we simply didn't want to step on anyone's toes when it came to past resolutions. We were also concerned with the dreaded legality issues that often get brought up.

I've also noticed concerns about how vague the issues seems to be and I thought I'd address them here. For example, initially, the proposal looked more like this at points:

IV. REQUIRES acceptable storage methods to be observed.
a.) Seeds are to be stored in four-ply, sealed envelopes and placed into plastic tote containers on metal shelving racks. The storage rooms are to be kept at −18°C (−0°F).
b.) Saplings are to be kept in nurseries.
c.) Genetic animal materials are to be stored through the process of cryopreservation, including the use of cryoprotectants at a temperature of 77 K or −196°C.

It was brought to our attention that more advanced methods might exist throughout the World Assembly and we ought to be somewhat vague on those accounts. (OOC: Considering many nations in NationStates have methods far beyond those of what's we're capable of in the real world.)

Keronians wrote:Hmm... After much consideration, this nation has decided to back this resolution. The proposal, though flawed, is a brave and useful attempt at bringing greater good and relief to the environment and animals. This nation appreciates that and gives this resolution the green light.

Thank you ambassador for your support.